High Guard 4th edition

[Condottiere]

That would depend on whether it would be sold as a set, and it's been implied that each would be marketed separately.

Since page numbers would shrink, each should be cheaper, so there could be more than one setting book.

Or, for that matter, more than one gear and bestiary book.

 

[Sigtrygg]

Go play T5. They have exactly that. Why do you want to make MgT into T5?

I don't, I want Traveller to stay true to what Traveller has been since 1977.

 

[Geir]

If Core is to be core, it should include the mechanics to do just about everything (skill resolution; combat: personal, vehicles, spaceships; common equipment list (everything from filter masks to starships); spaceship operation and commerce rules; system generation rules. Not even sure I would include psionics in the base book.

• And then setting books (3I, 2300, whatever).
• Highguard for spacecraft construction, detailed (vector) combat and mass (fleet) combat and catalogue .
• Mercenary for weapon construction, maybe suits, detailed (maybe) and mass combat - wargamer stuff - and a catalogue.
• A vehicle book for vehicle construction and catalogue.
• A robot book -ditto.
• A worlds and ecosystems book, which may or may not be the same as a world builders book - but that would be a big book. So ecosystems and animals in one, stars and planets in the other. Maybe societies in a third - and societies could then include pockets empire, world tamers stuff.
• A merchants book for more money grubbing stuff and trade items.
• 1024 characters and patrons
• And I'm sure I forgot something.

 

[phavoc]

What Ottarrus says on requirements is a good summary of the three types of things to address and a pretty good layout for it.

More examples is something I'm running into right now, and though I'm usually three edits and into the email, after two edits, I think I need some more examples and more reality checks, especially on some of the more 'wargamy' rules in the back. I mean, they 'seem' practical. But I can't test them as well as with vehicle builds and I'm still ironing out things there.

As for facing, even the the Agility -6 vehicles, as of last night, at least, can do a 180 in a little less than a minute, so the facing of a spinal in a six minute round shouldn't matter - especially since High Guard armour, unlike vehicle armour doesn't care about faces. Or batteries bearing. The way Highguard works, a 100kton ship can still go just as fast as a fighter... it just takes longer to zoom past your window so it 'looks' bigger. No rules tell us they don't have commensurate attitude control, though the longer 'spin arm' on a flip probably pushes those compensators on either end harder.

That brings up a good point - adding acceleration factors to differentiate ships and small craft, bringing back the ship design concepts where the physical form-factor of your ship affects the number of weapons you can bring to bear. If you are looking at the system as a whole then I'd say the length of a game turn / combat round and what can occur within a round is subject to review as well. Small ships would be able to turn their facing much faster than capital ships could (or even would - newtonian movement makes facing changes a bitch for your vectoring and course corrections). Babylon 5 star furies spining on their axis to change their facing 180 degrees while shutting down their forward thrust to engage an enemy on their tail is a good example of how at least some Traveller small craft would work. Other sci-fi shows that have fighters operating like regular aircraft in a terrestrial environment don't match well with Traveller ship movement concepts.

If you get into fleet combat it would be nice to see how you could summarize off/def factors into simple numbers (ex- a DD has a off beam factor of 2, and this CL has an off beam factor of 5 and missile of 2). Trying to keept track of the myriad individual weapon systems gets to be tedious for the larger ships. It's one thing for adventure class ships with 4-6 weapon systems, but a small 5k dton ship could have 50. Too much record keeping.

 

[-Daniel-]

If Core is to be core, it should include the mechanics to do just about everything (skill resolution; combat: personal, vehicles, spaceships; common equipment list (everything from filter masks to starships); spaceship operation and commerce rules; system generation rules. Not even sure I would include psionics in the base book.

• And then setting books (3I, 2300, whatever).
• Highguard for spacecraft construction, detailed (vector) combat and mass (fleet) combat and catalogue .
• Mercenary for weapon construction, maybe suits, detailed (maybe) and mass combat - wargamer stuff - and a catalogue.
• A vehicle book for vehicle construction and catalogue.
• A robot book -ditto.
• A worlds and ecosystems book, which may or may not be the same as a world builders book - but that would be a big book. So ecosystems and animals in one, stars and planets in the other. Maybe societies in a third - and societies could then include pockets empire, world tamers stuff.
• A merchants book for more money grubbing stuff and trade items.
• 1024 characters and patrons
• And I'm sure I forgot something.

A Psionics book so you can either add it in or ban it from your table?

 

[MasterGwydion]

I don't, I want Traveller to stay true to what Traveller has been since 1977.

Then why not just use the old books and not worry about the new books? I am not sure of your goal here. Heck, just cut and paste the new material into the format of the old books. Then you have what you want. Maybe? Maybe not. As I said, I do not understand the goal.

 

[Geir]

A Psionics book so you can either add it in or ban it from your table?

That was my thought. It's there for the 3I as is in a 3I book, not for 2300, and whatever - Space Magic - for whatever. It's a very golden age of sci-fi hold-over. Haven't been able to bend a spoon by thought alone, though I really wanted to in eight grade (and make my lunch tray fly across the cafeteria, too, but alas, no such luck).

 

[AndrewW]

Haven't been able to bend a spoon by thought alone, though I really wanted to in eight grade (and make my lunch tray fly across the cafeteria, too, but alas, no such luck).

Your next vehicle handbook example a flying lunch tray.

 

[Geir]

Your next vehicle handbook example a flying lunch tray.

Robot. Like the flying sword, but for higher law level worlds.
But... a lifter-propelled wandering buffet table (with seating), that's not out of the question - and cheaper than the house.

 

[Terry Mixon]

Robot. Like the flying sword, but for higher law level worlds.
But... a lifter-propelled wandering buffet table (with seating), that's not out of the question - and cheaper than the house.

 

[Arkathan]

Robot. Like the flying sword, but for higher law level worlds.
But... a lifter-propelled wandering buffet table (with seating), that's not out of the question - and cheaper than the house.

Until it shorts out and starts spinning...

 

[Limpin Legin]

I'm not, there is a comma.

The number of books to cover all the rules are the Core Rule Book , High Guard , Vehicles , World Builder's Handbook , Animal Encounters , Robots , Central Supply Catalogue.

It appears you are using commas to write a list of similarly grouped items. Especially in the sense of items grouped according to their relevance in providing robot rules. I still wouldn't recommend WHB as being big on robots, but it's expansion on Tech Levels and Law Levels is a welcome addition if you got the readies and the time of day to referee the extra detail.

You should be able to play Traveller using nothing but the core rule book,

You can. Even Mongoose state a much. I don't understand why you are struggling with thinking otherwise?

LBB:1 character generation, situation throws, combat
LBB:2 ship operations, ship construction, ship combat, computers, drugs, trade, experience
LBB3: planet building, encounters, ecosystems, equipment, psionics

Super organisation and a unique selling point like no other rule system does that (AFAIK).

Repetition and sequence made the books sound as easy as 1-2-3, yet the blackened appearance gave the game a distinctive mysterious feel. Something none of the colour editions successfully captured.

IMO, what Mongoose missed was the option to organise the CRB into Parts A, B and C, with each Part approximately corresponding to a classic LBB. However, the nuts and bolts concerning, characters, combat, ships, etc are all sufficiently presented to sufficient enough detail to run a game/campaign, without needing extra sourcebooks.

 

[Condottiere]

Player's Handbook - protagonists

Monster Manual - antagonists

Dungeon Master's Guide - divinities

 

[Sigtrygg]

Then why not just use the old books and not worry about the new books? I am not sure of your goal here. Heck, just cut and paste the new material into the format of the old books. Then you have what you want. Maybe? Maybe not. As I said, I do not understand the goal.

The goal was clearly stated in my original post.

To fix Mongoose High Guard.

 

[Sigtrygg]

It appears you are using commas to write a list of similarly grouped items. Especially in the sense of items grouped according to their relevance in providing robot rules. I still wouldn't recommend WHB as being big on robots, but it's expansion on Tech Levels and Law Levels is a welcome addition if you got the readies and the time of day to referee the extra detail.

It's a thread to fix High Guard - where have I mentioned Robots?

You can. Even Mongoose state a much. I don't understand why you are struggling with thinking otherwise?

You can as it is now, with ship construction. I'm not interested in Third Imperium standard designs if I am using Traavller to do what it was intended for - running a bespoke setting.

Super organisation and a unique selling point like no other rule system does that (AFAIK).

Repetition and sequence made the books sound as easy as 1-2-3, yet the blackened appearance gave the game a distinctive mysterious feel. Something none of the colour editions successfully captured.

IMO, what Mongoose missed was the option to organise the CRB into Parts A, B and C, with each Part approximately corresponding to a classic LBB. However, the nuts and bolts concerning, characters, combat, ships, etc are all sufficiently presented to sufficient enough detail to run a game/campaign, without needing extra sourcebooks.

In the form of the CRB update 2022 yes, but the original 2ed CRB lacked ship construction.

 

[Vormaerin]

The Core Rulebook should cover basically the same material for MgT2e that The Traveller Book did for CT. If you have that (or its antecedents, the Deluxe Traveller box set or the individual Books 1, 2, & 3), you can play the game in your own homebrew setting just fine.

I am under the impression that we have that in the current version of the CRB, but that was not true in earlier versions. Like every successful product, the rules eventually get scattered over a wide variety of products. Occasional consolidation is useful.

But, overall, I am pretty pleased with Mongoose' intention to do that via "updates" rather than new editions. I don't think there are any substantive changes necessary to the core rules that merit tossing out the baby with the bathwater. The things that are busted are the niche "advanced" systems like build your stuff and fleet combat. Those are important niches but they aren't "core rules".

 

[Terry Mixon]

But, overall, I am pretty pleased with Mongoose' intention to do that via "updates" rather than new editions. I don't think there are any substantive changes necessary to the core rules that merit tossing out the baby with the bathwater. The things that are busted are the niche "advanced" systems like build your stuff and fleet combat. Those are important niches but they aren't "core rules".

I'm happy with it, too, though they need to pull in the new rules they've scattered all across the books during an update to make them discoverable. Or create a comprehensive index of all the products.

 

[Vormaerin]

Yes, that's the purpose of the "update every few years" design that I was talking about.

A master index would be nice in the interim between such updates, especially given that it's a lot of tedious work for someone else.

 

[collins355]

A lot of it is about imposing discipline on adventure and supplement writers so they don't keep adding spurious and often conflicting features to those in High Guard scattered across numerous books.

 

[Terry Mixon]

A lot of it is about imposing discipline on adventure and supplement writers so they don't keep adding spurious and often conflicting features to those in High Guard scattered across numerous books.

This is where editing is important.