Foreven Sector

[Gruffty the Hiver]

Correct, a hex number and an asterisk for an occupied hex. The borders indicate ownership of the hexes though.

Blimey :shock:

Thanks for the information, Deniable :mrgreen:

 

[EDG]

Well, as I said earlier, Matt mentioned that someone could move the sector to another part of the map or relocate races or whatever.

Yeah, but like I said elsewhere, if it can be moved around Charted Space then it can't be Foreven because that sector is specifically next to the Spinward Marches.

It makes far more sense to me to say "you have a blank sector that isn't in the Third Imperium/Charted Space setting, but can use all the stuff from that setting as you please" than to specify Foreven.

 

[GypsyComet]

Imperiallines was indeed a "short-lived" newsletter from GDW. Two issues were released in the closing days of MegaTraveller, and two more were at the draft stage but never saw publication.

While I haven't hunted down Mr. Sprange's announcement re Foreven, I suspect the line quoted here about "moving it around" is more to do with how *you* use it. It's on the big map of Known Space next to the Spinward Marches, and there it will stay, but for the purposes of publication (of whatever sort) stating that these events, people, places, etc happened "in Foreven Sector" is simply the key phrase that says "unofficial but in the OTU". You might be playing in The HinterWorlds and have written up material you want to "publish". Say it happened "in Foreven" and you're good as far as M3 (Marc, Matt, and Mongoose) are concerned.

Remember folks, "Canon" is for authors to worry about. The rest of us can use it or not as we will, in pieces or whole, as our games require. Only authors have to worry about being compatible with all of it.

 

[Deniable]

Given that the policy with regard to Foreven is for authors, the discussion of canon is entirely relevant. And the relevant quote from the 'Fair Use' thread is:

Matt is the location of the Foreven sector fixed?

For the OTU it is. For you. . . well, that is pretty much up to you

We might as well just wait and see what the final license has to say rather than jumping to conclusions.

 

[EDG]

Remember folks, "Canon" is for authors to worry about. The rest of us can use it or not as we will, in pieces or whole, as our games require. Only authors have to worry about being compatible with all of it.

Well I think the purpose of this thread is just to establish what is known canonically about Foreven - which as it turns out is more than "nothing at all" which is what one would expect from a supposed "GM Preserve". And it's interesting to note that two of the most popular CT adventures (and aliens) - Horde/Chamax Plague and the Chamax - are set in Foreven.

 

[Vile]

Remember folks, "Canon" is for authors to worry about.

It was in relation to this that I raised the question about Foreven canon. The history behind the whole "open sector Foreven" is quite interesting in itself, though. And I still hope that whatever was (or will be) determined to be canon for the OTU License Foreven gets noted in the license for future reference.

 

[dmccoy1693]

Yeah, but like I said elsewhere, if it can be moved around Charted Space then it can't be Foreven because that sector is specifically next to the Spinward Marches.

My understanding is that Foreven was specifickly set aside as being the official unofficial sector, even as to where in space it is located, and that there never was suppose to be any official canon for it. Ever.

Remember folks, "Canon" is for authors to worry about. The rest of us can use it or not as we will, in pieces or whole, as our games require. Only authors have to worry about being compatible with all of it.

From the way Mongoose Matt is making it sound, the only people that have to worry about canon work for Mongoose and Avenger, since they have specific licenses. Foreven, by contrast sounds like every publisher can make their own canon. If they want to make Vargr to have a long standing rivalry with Kree and have them battle it out in Foreven, a company can do that. But if another company wants Hivers to be at war with the Aslan-Imperium Alliance and most of those battle take place in Foreven, a company can do that.

This sector is explicity set aside as a GM's preserve by Game Designers' Workshop. There is very little canon information about it and no more will be established.
Canon
This sector is know as Iakr in the Zhodani Consulate.

Two systems in the Reidan subsector, Rashev and Alenzar are featured in The Chamax Plague/Horde.

link

I see no mention that it even HAS to have the Zhodani Consulate in it or that it is anywhere near the SM.

I do, however, see this (same link):

Non-Canon
The main Zhodani proxies in the area are the Avalar Consulate in Foreven/Beyond and the Steblenz Consulate (a full-fledged Zhodani colony) in Vanguard Reaches; the Imperium has three independent systems in Foreven that are client states, and on the Vanguard Reaches/Far Frontiers border, to spinward, the Duchy of Trelyn (renamed the Trelyn Domain, as part of a governmental reorganization paralleling the reorganization of the Domain of Deneb subsequent to the Rebellion) also takes an active role as an Imperial client state to promote Imperial interests in the region.

The same major aliens that can be found in the Spinward Marches can also be found here; Aslan, Vargr, and Droyne and Chirpers may be encountered, although Vargr will probably be encountered less frequently, and Aslan (and Zhodani) more frequently, than in the Spinward Marches.

This to me says that everything being claimed as canon Foreven is specifickly designated as non-canon.

 

[Vile]

Check back through the topic and you'll find more official sources on what is and isn't Foreven canon. Previous official sources, that is - the OTU License could of course say that anything goes from now on. The sector is firmly located next to Spinward Marches by CT AM4: Zhodani, and part of it definitely lies in the Consulate.

The Wiki, grand project though it is, does not have all the information, all the time.

 

[qstor]

Ahh well One thing I wouldn't mind (if possible) would be a mapped Trailing sector near the K'Kree / Hiver / Imperial area. Theres lots of possibilities with those three.

Take care all

E. Herdan

Have you looked at Gateway to Destiny for T20. It has very little rules information in it so it can be used with any edition of Traveller.

Mike

 

[dmccoy1693]

Mongoose posted a draft version of the FFSLL on the main traveller page.

 

[Rikki Tikki Traveller]

From the way Mongoose Matt is making it sound, the only people that have to worry about canon work for Mongoose and Avenger, since they have specific licenses. Foreven, by contrast sounds like every publisher can make their own canon. If they want to make Vargr to have a long standing rivalry with Kree and have them battle it out in Foreven, a company can do that. But if another company wants Hivers to be at war with the Aslan-Imperium Alliance and most of those battle take place in Foreven, a company can do that.

This sector is explicity set aside as a GM's preserve by Game Designers' Workshop. There is very little canon information about it and no more will be established.
Canon
This sector is know as Iakr in the Zhodani Consulate.

Two systems in the Reidan subsector, Rashev and Alenzar are featured in The Chamax Plague/Horde.

link

I see no mention that it even HAS to have the Zhodani Consulate in it or that it is anywhere near the SM.

I think you have hit it on the head with this idea.

If I want to publish a book or adventure or world development and say that it is part of the OTU, or even just use the OTU references, then I HAVE to put it in Foreven, even if in name only.

The Great Aslan Hiver war of 500 can be told as it happened in Foreven. The K'Kree-Aslan CoDominion history can be written about, but only within the Foreven Sector. What Foreven gives the author is the ability to use the OTU names, places and races AS REFERENCE, legally.

What you CANNOT do is say that the Avalar Consulate invaded the Spinward Marches, destroying the Darrians and Conquering half of the Sword Worlds. That moves things out of Foreven and into the OTU are NOT going to be allowed.

From that perspective, if someone wanted to detail a subsector caught between the Hivers and K'Kree (trying to stay within OTU as much as possible), that author would have to place their subsector within "Foreven Sector" since it was non-Canon. In that sense, Foreven could move to accomodate where your story is being set, but still not be Canon (with a big C). Only Mongoose can add to Canon now (and Avenger through their license).

If people want to reference other people's work within some kind of shared Foreven Sector, they could, but would not be required to.

 

[Deniable]

I've just read it and the answer is:

You can't 'move' Foreven, however, if you can define what you want completely inside the sector without referencing any others you should be able to do a lot with it. Otherwise the Foreven license looks a lot like the TLL.

OK, RTT nailed it. That's what I've been trying to say.

 

[Vile]

Ok, well, this discussion has been superseded, I guess. The list of what is canon should you wish to include it is in the Foreven Sector Guide, and it's pretty similar to what was discussed.

For those who want to re-write the contents of the sector, the clause that you cannot change any OTU material outside the sector can be circumvented if you don't reference anything by location - if you want to have Hivers, you can talk about the Hive Federation but don't say it's located spinward of Foreven. That's if you want to go wild and do what you like in the sector. I guess this leaves things wide open for those Zhodani - Hiver interactions ... :wink:

 

[Gruffty the Hiver]

Mongoose posted a draft version of the FFSLL on the main traveller page.

Linky

Then click on "Draft Developer's Pack". Everything is in the .zip file, including a Foreven Sector logo and the sector dot map.

Thanks Matt! :mrgreen:

 

[Rikki Tikki Traveller]

After reading the files, it does seem like Foreven cannot be moved, unless you can define everything within the Sector.

SO, if you want to go into the Hiver-K'Kree conflict, you can still do it with the Foreven Sector, but you have to be careful to keep everything within the sector. No references to neighboring sectors or subsectors. You might also have to be careful about what direction they are located relative to your Foreven.

And yes, you could have several different and even contradictory versions of the Foreven Sector out there. As well as multiple writeups for the same planets or polities. The MAPS might even be different since Mongoose spefically said that you didn't have to use the map.

All of the "official Canon" material is also not necessarily required. But, it is listed (with references) for those that want to try to stay close to the OTU material.

 

[Emperor Herdan]

Ah crikey....

Of all the places and times to have this pointed out to me (and BTW thank you for the linkey)...

Ohh well... I guess MTU Foreven sector is going to be a tad different, on the plus side I've a spiffy new logo I can (ab)use (smile)

Take care all

E. Herdan

 

[klingsor]

Interesting, very interesting indeed. A pity the resolution is so poor, especially of the map, but this is just a taster and I must say I am rather looking forward to the meal. I am impressed by the way they put the few known planets on from Chamx Plague/Horde, a very nice touch that.

The systems are charted and what are those little black bits I cannot make out? All in all a good excuse to crank up a planet building spreadsheet.

This is going to be fun.

 

[EDG]

Interesting, very interesting indeed. A pity the resolution is so poor, especially of the map, but this is just a taster and I must say I am rather looking forward to the meal. I am impressed by the way they put the few known planets on from Chamx Plague/Horde, a very nice touch that.

The systems are charted and what are those little black bits I cannot make out? All in all a good excuse to crank up a planet building spreadsheet.

This is going to be fun.

Er, I think they've got Raschev and Alenzar in the wrong hexes on the map - shouldn't they be in 3228 and 3229? It looks like they're shown in 3229 and 3230. (but yeah, the map in the PDF is awful. It does say there's a downloadable one somewhere though)

 

[EDG]

Also, is it just the positions of the systems on the map that are fixed? Or do people have to keep EVERYTHING shown on the map the same? (i.e. whether the planet is a watery world, a dry world, or an asteroid belt).

 

[captainjack23]

Also, is it just the positions of the systems on the map that are fixed? Or do people have to keep EVERYTHING shown on the map the same? (i.e. whether the planet is a watery world, a dry world, or an asteroid belt).

From my read thru, it seems pretty clear that you may use some, none or all of the exisiting info on foreven. So, no, you do not have to.