Upcoming New Vehicle Handbook

[phavoc]

I'm sure most of us know that the vehicle handbooks are being combined and the design system re-done.

But has anyone heard anything about the new system? Any odds that its gonna be an actual improvement, or more of the same? Anyone know if the system has actually been tested outside of Mongoose?

I'm really not interested in paying $30-$40 for more garbage. I keep hoping MG will do it right the 2nd time around....

 

[barnest2]

No news, except that it is going to be a less complicated, more 'quick and simple' version of the rules.
It's not my sort of thing...

 

[DFW]

From info released so far, it will be very non-detailed and therefore, designs from game to game have no guarantee of being compatible.

 

[Colin]

I designed the system. It is conceptually simple, but with the add-ons can produce some fairly complex designs.

The systems includes anti-missile systems, meson communicators, stealth, wooden ships, supercavitating submarines, hydrofoils, grav vehicles, trains, planes and automobiles...

Plasma A guns, plasma B guns, hyperkinetic cannons, meson guns, autocannons, VRF gauss guns, electrostatic armour, reactive armour, VTOL aircraft, take-off and landing rolls, and rickshaws...

It is payload based, with the unit of measure being the Space, approximately the volume required to comfortable contain a person. I can design a civilian vehicle in seconds, and a military vehicle in a couple of minutes.

 

[Colin]

I designed the system. It is conceptually simple, but with the add-ons can produce some fairly complex designs.

The systems includes anti-missile systems, meson communicators, stealth, wooden ships, supercavitating submarines, hydrofoils, grav vehicles, trains, planes and automobiles...

Plasma A guns, plasma B guns, hyperkinetic cannons, meson guns, autocannons, VRF gauss guns, electrostatic armour, reactive armour, VTOL aircraft, take-off and landing rolls, and rickshaws...

Despite all that, it is not a gearhead system. It is not overly-fiddly. It is payload based, with the unit of measure being the Space, approximately the volume required to comfortable contain a person. I can design a civilian vehicle in seconds, and a military vehicle in a couple of minutes.

 

[alex_greene]

You got a spot of double post on your forum, there.

The supplement sounds interesting to me.

Any vehicular combat and movement rules there? We need vehicular rules to cover such things as:-

(1) Hitting an aerial target from a moving ground vehicle, and vice versa;

(2) Anti-vehicle fire from ground-mounted pedestrians;

(3) Vehicle chases, including competitive racing (we need Drive/Flyer/Seafarer specialities similar to Athletics that covers endurance and sprint racing)

 

[BFalcon]

hmm... pondering a meson-packing sailing ship that's also a submersible...

 

[phavoc]

There's no need for it to be overly complicated. So long as we can build vehicles that the rules already define... I'm not looking for the wonderfully heac-scratching complex rules that GURPS put in their software tool to design vehicles... Simple is good!

But so is a system that is a) simple and b) works. Point B being, I think, the most important aspect.

 

[Rikki Tikki Traveller]

From what Colin has posted before, the new system will give you almost the same results as the old system; which will still be valid and can be used.

So, for those people like me who want QAD, I can use the simple system and be done with it. For those who want the detail of the old system, it is still valid and can be used.

HOPEFULLY, the issues of Power Density in the old system were addressed.

 

[DFW]

HOPEFULLY, the issues of Power Density in the old system were addressed.

From the prior threads came the "a hamster can be used as power source" because that aspect got sketchier than the 1st vehicles book...

 

[SSWarlock]

"a hamster can be used as power source"

Sounds like what's running my Windows XP desktop. :lol:

 

[Colin]

They would have to be mighty strong hamsters. The book includes rules for animal-powered vehicles.

It is just a design book. Rules for combat, chases, etc were specifically excluded. The only exception are some new rules for sensors, electronics and stealth. Tech level becomes critically important under these rules.

The issue of power plants is not dealt with directly, they are subsumed as part of the hull cost. However, the system includes rules for improving (or degrading) performance, so any effect can be achieved.

Hulls have certain levels of performance included as part of the basic hull, dependent on tech level. You can simply take a basic hull, add stuff, and be done. Or you can modify the performance, add armour, add capabilities, then add stuff (like additional propulsion systems, hyperkinetic guns, cranes, and wet bars).

 

[SSWarlock]

They would have to be mighty strong hamsters. The book includes rules for animal-powered vehicles.

Think about the hamster in "Nutty Professor II". :wink:

 

[DFW]

They would have to be mighty strong hamsters. The book includes rules for animal-powered vehicles.

Does it have rules for how many KW to power grav drives for x sized vehicle & kw ratings for PP's based on type (fusion, battery, petrol) and size?

 

[apoc527]

They would have to be mighty strong hamsters. The book includes rules for animal-powered vehicles.

Does it have rules for how many KW to power grav drives for x sized vehicle & kw ratings for PP's based on type (fusion, battery, petrol) and size?

For my purposes, hopefully not. From what's been said, I would doubt very much that much detail is included. Personally, I don't see the point of making up numbers for that stuff. It's not like anyone can give a realistic guess for the power consumption of a grab unit!

 

[DFW]

Personally, I don't see the point of making up numbers for that stuff.

Without something (even power points) there is no way to determine how much of what type engine is needed for what. Ergo, the hamster powered air raft... And, zero compatibility between different games.

 

[Colin]

They would have to be mighty strong hamsters. The book includes rules for animal-powered vehicles.

Think about the hamster in "Nutty Professor II". :wink:

That movie does not exist. :roll: Not in any rational universe, at any rate.

 

[Colin]

Personally, I don't see the point of making up numbers for that stuff.

Without something (even power points) there is no way to determine how much of what type engine is needed for what. Ergo, the hamster powered air raft... And, zero compatibility between different games.

Different kind of design system. This system is effects-based. If that is the kind of system you prefer, then that's fine. I like that sort of thing, or at least I used to. I no longer have the time to spend 30 minutes to design a car, or two hours to design a grav tank. This system avoids that.

 

[DFW]

Different kind of design system. This system is effects-based.

Doesn't matter what you name the flower, the weak points I noted will still be a problem. That alone may doom it.

 

[Colin]

Different kind of design system. This system is effects-based.

Doesn't matter what you name the flower, the weak points I noted will still be a problem. That alone may doom it.

You characterize it as a weak point. I characterize it as a feature, as I designed it that way deliberately.

To transfer this system to different versions, all you need to do is convert the Hull, Structure, and weapon damage values. Those are all you really need to play. And playing here is the key.

This system is not designed as an engineering simulation. It is a game product to allow you to create convincing, consistent vehicles for use in a game. It is the end product that is important here, not the process.

I understand that for some people, spending hours trying to create perfect vehicles is fun. The engineering simulation, if you will, is the point. This system is not for them. This system is for people playing the game, who want to create a vehicle for use in the game.

When I approached Matt, I offered to take the current design system and upgrade it, make it more realistic, like a new vehicle-oriented Fire, Fusion and Steel. He pointed me the other way, and asked for a simpler system. Which I gave him. It may not be to the tastes of some, but that certainly does not mean that it is doomed.