New Babylon 5 novels ???

[OmahaStar]

I have a question for Matthew Sprange.

Sir, knowing as you do that JMS is extremely open on the net, and honest (posts he's sent have been referenced back years later, and are 100% true), why would you go onto the Babylon 5 podcast and lie your face off?

You claim in the podcast that JMS is involved with these books. You have since backpeddled in the newsgroup, and tried to say you never said it, even when the podcast is right there for all to hear.

You then said you were working from outlines provided by JMS, then we find out you're working from three unproduces scripts, presumably his two and Fiona Avery's "Value Judgements". Since the scripts were not produced, WB does not own them, which means you're stealing (plagiarism, anyone?).

You've lied repeatedly, and apparently are used to being able to charm your way out of it. What makes you think you can get away with such boldfaced lying?

Is this really the way you think you can sell a few books? You're doing more harm than good. B5 fans are extremely loyal, and we are used to honesty. We're not getting it from you.

Trust is very hard to earn. And you've lost it with us. How can you possibly even hope to earn it back?

 

[Chernobyl]

Omaha, do you know who owns the scripts? Are you involved in the business liscense of B5 at WB?

Chern

 

[MongooseMatt]

I have a question for Matthew Sprange.

Welcome to our forums.

Sir, knowing as you do that JMS is extremely open on the net, and honest (posts he's sent have been referenced back years later, and are 100% true), why would you go onto the Babylon 5 podcast and lie your face off?

Well, I didn't. I must stress that I have been mis-quoted and mis-represented.

You then said you were working from outlines provided by JMS, then we find out you're working from three unproduces scripts, presumably his two and Fiona Avery's "Value Judgements". Since the scripts were not produced, WB does not own them, which means you're stealing (plagiarism, anyone?).

It is our understanding, at this time, that Warner Brothers do own those scripts, and they have given permission for us to use them. We have requested confirmation on this.

Is this really the way you think you can sell a few books? You're doing more harm than good. B5 fans are extremely loyal, and we are used to honesty. We're not getting it from you.

I am afraid you are.

Trust is very hard to earn. And you've lost it with us. How can you possibly even hope to earn it back?

By sticking to our guns, and telling the truth.

 

[OmahaStar]

Well, I didn't. I must stress that I have been mis-quoted and mis-represented.

Oh? How is that? Since the words came directly from you. You said it in the podcast. You were not asked, for example, about the RPGs. You were asked about the novels, and you answered about the novels, but were not honest. You were giving information about the RPG books, which was dishonest, at best.

It is our understanding, at this time, that Warner Brothers do own those scripts, and they have given permission for us to use them. We have requested confirmation on this.

And you will be contacting the authors, paying them for their scripts? JMS has not been contacted regarding his two scripts, so I can safely answer "no" to that question.

Is this really the way you think you can sell a few books? You're doing more harm than good. B5 fans are extremely loyal, and we are used to honesty. We're not getting it from you.

I am afraid you are.

When you lie, twist the facts, and then backpeddle when confronted with the facts, it can not be called honest.

Trust is very hard to earn. And you've lost it with us. How can you possibly even hope to earn it back?

By sticking to our guns, and telling the truth.

And when are you going to start telling the truth?

 

[Flashman67]

Wow, Omaha, you sure know how to make a first impression.

I have no dog in this fight; I come here because I am a huge Conan fan. I've never watched Babylon 5 or played the game. But after seeing several of JMS's posts, yours, and Matthew's on this subject on this site and others, I've got to say JMS is not helping his case with his prima donna, snarky attitude. You, of course, aren't helping either, since you are throwing some serious accusations against a guy without establishing your own credibility to make those accusations. So why don't you simmer down a bit.

I've never met Matthew, but in all of my dealings with his company, both on line and at Gen Con, Mongoose has been very honorable. So if you are going to come on his board and make an inflammatory post, you have to understand that your tone won't help your argument. In fact, it just makes you look like a troll, which I assume was your purpose.

Cheers, Mike

 

[MongooseMatt]

And you will be contacting the authors, paying them for their scripts? JMS has not been contacted regarding his two scripts, so I can safely answer "no" to that question.

If it turns out, as we have been informed, that they have already been paid for those scripts, it is unlikely.

 

[OmahaStar]

Wow, Omaha, you sure know how to make a first impression.

I have no dog in this fight; I come here because I am a huge Conan fan. I've never watched Babylon 5 or played the game. But after seeing several of JMS's posts, yours, and Matthew's on this subject on this site and others, I've got to say JMS is not helping his case with his prima donna, snarky attitude. You, of course, aren't helping either, since you are throwing some serious accusations against a guy without establishing your own credibility to make those accusations. So why don't you simmer down a bit.

I've never met Matthew, but in all of my dealings with his company, both on line and at Gen Con, Mongoose has been very honorable. So if you are going to come on his board and make an inflammatory post, you have to understand that your tone won't help your argument. In fact, it just makes you look like a troll, which I assume was your purpose.

Cheers, Mike

My purpose is to get to the truth of the matter. Matthew mistated several facts in his interview, making it sound like he was giving answers about the novels he was there to pimp, when he was actually talking about something completely different. For example, he specifically states the novels are being written from outlines provided by JMS. They aren't. The outlines don't exist. In reality, there are 3 unproduced scripts which they're working with, and he didn't even credit Fiona Avery for her script on that podcast.

He says JMS has been involved in the novels, then claims his involvement has been "less and less". In reality, JMS has never been involved with the production of these novels, which Matthew finally admitted in a recent post.

He could have just come out and been honest, and these novels would have sold in amazing numbers. Instead, he lied, putting words in JMS' mouth, stating "facts" which turned out to be false, and makes it seem like JMS is the bad guy, when in fact, JMS left them alone to do what they wanted, until Matthew started playing this game.

Sooner or later, the truth will come out. Matthew needs a course in Customer Service, as well as Business Ethics.

 

[MongooseMatt]

My purpose is to get to the truth of the matter. Matthew mistated several facts in his interview, making it sound like he was giving answers about the novels he was there to pimp, when he was actually talking about something completely different. For example, he specifically states the novels are being written from outlines provided by JMS. They aren't. The outlines don't exist. In reality, there are 3 unproduced scripts which they're working with, and he didn't even credit Fiona Avery for her script on that podcast.

_We_ created the outline for the Crusade novel the scripts which, clearly, do exist.

He says JMS has been involved in the novels, then claims his involvement has been "less and less". In reality, JMS has never been involved with the production of these novels, which Matthew finally admitted in a recent post.

The quote was taken from a question about the line itself, not specifically the novels. 25:24 into the podcast, the question raised cited 'B5 universe' _not_ the B5 novels. And damn your eyes for making me spend the time listening to the podcast to get that exact quote and time.

He could have just come out and been honest, and these novels would have sold in amazing numbers. Instead, he lied, putting words in JMS' mouth, stating "facts" which turned out to be false, and makes it seem like JMS is the bad guy, when in fact, JMS left them alone to do what they wanted, until Matthew started playing this game.

You want something false?

Mr Straczynski has accused us of not seeking approval for anything we do. This is blatantly not true and have offered Mr Straczynski proof of this. Everything, and I mean _everything_ we do for Babylon 5 is approved by Warner Brothers.

Sooner or later, the truth will come out. Matthew needs a course in Customer Service, as well as Business Ethics.

You know what? I'll take that one on. Ask the people here, on this forum. Ask the guys and gals who have been with us for the past 5 years what they think of Mongoose's customer service. I will stand by our reputation.

 

[OmahaStar]

Sooner or later, the truth will come out. Matthew needs a course in Customer Service, as well as Business Ethics.

You know what? I'll take that one on. Ask the people here, on this forum. Ask the guys and gals who have been with us for the past 5 years what they think of Mongoose's customer service. I will stand by our reputation.

I did not say Mongoose. I said, and will repeat, "Matthew needs a course in Customer Service, as well as Business Ethics." I don't see anybody else from Mongoose out there pimping the books and making blanket lies about the line. I only see Matthew doing it, and he keeps digging himself deeper with each lie compounding the ones before it.

Matthew, I believe, whether intentional or not, that you lied to the consumers and Babylon 5 fans. And yet, even when the proof is staring you in the face, you continue to lie.

Why?

 

[MongooseMatt]

I did not say Mongoose. I said, and will repeat, "Matthew

Well, say hello to Mongoose Customer Service.

Matthew, I believe, whether intentional or not, that you lied to the consumers and Babylon 5 fans.

You are free to believe what you will. But you are making an error.

Can't help noticing that you have failed to pick up the whole script/outline thing, so I can perhaps presume I have convinced you on that front.

 

[OmahaStar]

I did not say Mongoose. I said, and will repeat, "Matthew

Well, say hello to Mongoose Customer Service.

Matthew, I believe, whether intentional or not, that you lied to the consumers and Babylon 5 fans.

You are free to believe what you will. But you are making an error.

Can't help noticing that you have failed to pick up the whole script/outline thing, so I can perhaps presume I have convinced you on that front.

I noticed. You said you were working on outlines provided by JMS. Then it was scripts of unproduced episodes. Now you're saying it's outlines YOU created based on those scripts.

Yep, I noticed. That's the third variation *so far*. Just curious. Is any of it true? Or just more bs?

 

[nitflegal]

It is our understanding, at this time, that Warner Brothers do own those scripts, and they have given permission for us to use them. We have requested confirmation on this.

And you will be contacting the authors, paying them for their scripts? JMS has not been contacted regarding his two scripts, so I can safely answer "no" to that question.

The scripts have been paid for already, by WB as scripts. There is a pretty formal Writer's Guild framework for this but, in essence, they were paid for when commissioned and WB now owns them, not the authors who have already been paid for the scripts. Just like, at the end of the day, JMS does not own the Babylon 5 universe anymore as it is sold to WB. They have the rights and JMS cannot do anything within the B5 universe without WB's permission. Obviously, it's not that cut and dried to us fans, as JMS has the backstory in his head and anything that WB does without him will almost certainly deviate from that. However, strictly speaking WB owns the franchise lock, stock, and barrel along with everything that they commissioned for it.

Put another way, JMS already sold those scripts and WB can do whatever they please with them, including providing them to Mongoose as reference works. This tracks with what I've been hearing out of friends at WB, that they've come to the conclusion that there will not be any further JMS related B5 products in film or print and that they may as well start fleshing them out w/o them while there is still demand (especially now, with the DVD's still so popular). There were also some major bridges burnt on both sides with the Crusade DVD's, so the general consensus is that JMS has washed his hands of the WB and vice versa. Not that all of this couldn't change in the future but I have been told that the WB people involved were pushing really hard for a print wrap-up of Crusade for the DVD release and were PO'd that nothing came of it.

Matt

 

[frobisher]

Yep, I noticed. That's the third variation *so far*. Just curious. Is any of it true? Or just more bs?

Out of interest, have you actually listened to the podcast..? Or are you just reacting to out of context quotes from the podcast?

It's quite clear that what Matt meant (if not what he said) was pretty much the information he's repeating here if you've listened to them (the questioners tended to put an odd spin on things that didn't help...).

 

[Oldbury]

OmahaStar don't come onto the mongoose forums and have a go at one of the owners it's not the smartest idea i've ever seen to be honest.... As for mongoose's customer service there bloody outstanding and one of the best in the bussiness, try getting things resolved with a another major company and compare how long it takes to get sorted and how it's sorted to the way mongoose do it, i think you'll find mongoose usually come up trumps...

Regards Oldbury

 

[MongooseMatt]

It's quite clear that what Matt meant (if not what he said) was pretty much the information he's repeating here if you've listened to them (the questioners tended to put an odd spin on things that didn't help...).

There is something else I have recently noticed. . . JMS said he viewed a podcast transcript - he didn't listen to it. I am wondering (and I just raise this as a possibility) whether the transcript is 100% accurate.

 

[MongooseMatt]

BTW, I was quite happy to entertain Omahastar's questions. However, I just read on another forum that it was his intention to become a thorn in my side. So you won't be seeing him round here again. He can find his sport elsewhere (and I am sure he will).

 

[Oldbury]

I find it quite sad really when people seem to enjoy just making a nusiance of themselves and take up other people's valuable times.

Regards Oldbury

 

[Morden]

You know, it's pretty rare for a business owner to bother responding to someone who comes to their board or place of business with the express purpose of stirring up drama and causing trouble. The typical response would be to bounce you out and not dignify your baseless attacks with a response. Omaha, I know you're reading this, so take this into consideration: Matt not only bothered to say a few words, but he actually tried to reason with you and help you see things from his perspective. He is, as he has always been, a class act.

If you know anything about Mongoose's handling of the B5 license, you would understand that they've made every attempt to keep as closely to the source material as possible and they've been both reverent and faithful, being big fans of the show themselves. I suggest that you actually do some research into the work this company has already done with Babylon 5 before attempting to crucify them on their own boards.

Seriously Omaha, I've seen fanbase splits before, and they usually end up hurting the franchise. Your efforts really aren't hurting Mongoose in any way, the novels will still be produced and they will likely sell well, but the outrage of yourself and certain JMS purists certainly isn't helping Babylon 5 either.

 

[frobisher]

There is something else I have recently noticed. . . JMS said he viewed a podcast transcript - he didn't listen to it. I am wondering (and I just raise this as a possibility) whether the transcript is 100% accurate.

They rarely are Especially if the transcribing party doesn't understand certain British idioms corrrectly...

 

[MongooseMatt]

You know, it's pretty rare for a business owner to bother responding to someone who comes to their board or place of business with the express purpose of stirring up drama and causing trouble.

Yeah, my business partner keeps telling me that I should stop doing that