MasterGwydion
Emperor Mongoose
It would be more for worldbuilding and figuring out what is out there to be pirated or some such things.
Digital Trade Map Generator
- Thread starter MasterGwydion
- Start date
MasterGwydion
Emperor Mongoose
Not just Traveller grogs, but yeah.Well the only riposte to that is, 'isn't everything about adventuring?'
But yeah, Traveller grogs have this desperate inborn need for the math to work out
agentwigggles
Cosmic Mongoose
Hrm. Intra shipping piracy probably wouldnt much of a thing. There is no stealth in space. So pirate couldnt amush civilian shipping. And if the system is populated enough to have intrasystem shipping, its populated and wealthy enough to have and SDB fly the fix shipping routes.
Yes stealth systems do exist.
Pirating is job of the desperately poor. Thats why they pirate. If the pirates are using stealth ships, then they're doing commerce raiding, which is very similar to pirating, but it means they're state actor, and thats an act of war probably, during a war.
MasterGwydion
Emperor Mongoose
They can hide behind moons, asteroids, other floating debris. Ship sensors suck, so turn off most of your systems, let your ship cool down, and wait. Sensor checks at Distant Range are a Diff 12. Almost no one is going to make that, even if they are of similar TLs. As far as SDBs, yes, these are a problem, but no system has enough SBDs to send escorts with every in-system cargo run to other planets, mining colonies, space stations, etc. So, there will always be targets for smart pirates. It discusses this stuff in the Pirates of Drinax books. Most of these places send their cargo to the starport for shipment to other systems, since the starports are where most of the Starships dock at. At least, that has been the excuse used in most of the Traveller books that I have read so far, as for why other planets send their goods to the starport instead of shipping direct.
Or you just happen to be in The Borderlands. lol The Pirate Lords of Theev build TL-15 ships specifically built for piracy. Not piracy of desperation, but piracy of We'll steal your shit and then sell it to make Ourselves rich.
Terry Mixon
Emperor Mongoose
Someone else said the range imparted a DM, but I could never find it. Can you point out a book and page for that?
agentwigggles
Cosmic Mongoose
Space is big. For Sol the average distance between astroids just shy of 1m kilometers. Then if you have a gas giant like Saturn, the average distance is in the 1m km distance too for the outer moons. And the hiding works both ways. If they cant see the pirate because of a physical object blocking, they cant see prey.
This kind of ambushing works, but typically at gas giants, to pounce on wilderness refueling.
I'm familar with PoD. And Theeve. Theeve is funded by GeDeCo. Its goal isnt to make money.
Pirate pops out. Makes a interception plot.
Victim ships knows.
Inform the SDB doing patrol.
Flies either away from the pirate if they're the same speed. They fly toward patrol if they're faster or slower.
This kind of ambushing works, but typically at gas giants, to pounce on wilderness refueling.
I'm familar with PoD. And Theeve. Theeve is funded by GeDeCo. Its goal isnt to make money.
Pirate pops out. Makes a interception plot.
Victim ships knows.
Inform the SDB doing patrol.
Flies either away from the pirate if they're the same speed. They fly toward patrol if they're faster or slower.
MasterGwydion
Emperor Mongoose
HG lists Very Distant as Formidable Diff 14 check. I just figured one Diff less for each range band. Makes for Average Diff at Long Range. I am not certain if I got that from a book or just made the rule up.
Terry Mixon
Emperor Mongoose
Okay. That works. Thanks.
MasterGwydion
Emperor Mongoose
Regular shipping flies regular routes. That makes them predictable. Pirates do not have the same problem if they know where the ship is going to be. They just have to wait for it to arrive. Yeah, maybe they miss a few, but if you know your enemy's route and have time to plan, they have already lost. One of the ways of accomplishing this in PoD is gaining the information from your contacts and allies in the starports and spaceports. Personally, I think proximity-armed ion mines with mission or torpedo bodies would handle this situation nicely. Mix in some Anti-Radiation missiles with the same proximity-armed triggers and that will make them keep their sensors off while you approach to firing range. Oh yeah, and jam their comms. Most merchant traffic doesn't use directional communication gear. Less power, less sensors, no communications, etc. Now that would only be worthwhile on a ship you know if carrying something good, as it is expensive, but it is an acceptable tactic.
Never underestimate the players ability to come up with good tactics that change the whole situation. They will surprise you every time. Most of the time with an idiotic idea, but, oh well. lol
MasterGwydion
Emperor Mongoose
Any time.
GabrielGABFonseca
Cosmic Mongoose
I am glad to report the wheel has (fortunately) already been invented:
github.com
It's how Thomas Low-Jones made the trade maps in the wiki.
GitHub - makhidkarun/traveller_pyroute: Traveller trade route generator
Traveller trade route generator. Contribute to makhidkarun/traveller_pyroute development by creating an account on GitHub.
github.com
It's how Thomas Low-Jones made the trade maps in the wiki.
MasterGwydion
Emperor Mongoose
Damn! That seems like exactly what I need and want, but I am not smart enough or tech-savvy enough to use it...I am glad to report the wheel has (fortunately) already been invented:
GitHub - makhidkarun/traveller_pyroute: Traveller trade route generator
Traveller trade route generator. Contribute to makhidkarun/traveller_pyroute development by creating an account on GitHub.
It's how Thomas Low-Jones made the trade maps in the wiki.
I need an idiot's version. Congrats to Thomas for creating something amazing! I just wish I could use it.
CthulhuStig
Mongoose
This sounds like it would be something I could possibly add to Auto-Jimmy. It already does a load of stuff relating to trade and I can do overlays on Traveller Map. Which book are the rules covering what your trying to do in?
MasterGwydion
Emperor Mongoose
Mainly in GURPS Far Trader. The hardest part seems to upgrading the trade routes in between planets where trade routes overlap. Every 3 of one type gets bumped up to the next larger size trade route, but only on the part of the routes where they overlap.
CthulhuStig
Mongoose
GURPS rules aren't something I'm familiar with, if someone could point me at the section of the rules that cover it, that would be greatly appreciated. I'm in the middle of doing a release at the moment, but I could take a look to at least see if it was something I thought would be possible.
MasterGwydion
Emperor Mongoose
I am not a GURPS player either. The only 2 GURPS books that I ever owned were Far Trader and Starports. I unfortunately need to get new copies of both as My hard drive that contained them went KAPUT! lol
CthulhuStig
Mongoose
Damn, those Far Trader rules are hard to get your head around. Would some worked examples really have killed them. I can now see why automating the process is so desirable.
I've had a look at what PyRoute can do, and I don't think there would be much point in adding the ability to calculate the actual routes into Auto-Jimmy. PyRoute already does that and does it well from what I saw when looking at the code and brief experiance using it. Calculation of the routes is also something that gets done relatively infrequently and takes a releatively long time to execute, so wouldn't really benefit from being integrated into the app.
One thing I could do would be to add support for loading the routes that PyRoute generates into Auto-Jimmy so it could overlaying them on Traveller Map. It should also be possible to display the other info that PyRoute outputs such as BTN between world pairs. If having them overlayed on Traverller Map is something people would find useful, give this comment a like or post a comment saying it would be of use. If it looks like something that would benefit a few people then can try and look at doing it.
@MasterGwydion you said you weren't able to use PyRoute. I'm by no means an expert with it, but I have managed to get it running well enough to generate trade routes for a sector. If you let me know what problems you're having with it, I might be able to help you get it running.
I've had a look at what PyRoute can do, and I don't think there would be much point in adding the ability to calculate the actual routes into Auto-Jimmy. PyRoute already does that and does it well from what I saw when looking at the code and brief experiance using it. Calculation of the routes is also something that gets done relatively infrequently and takes a releatively long time to execute, so wouldn't really benefit from being integrated into the app.
One thing I could do would be to add support for loading the routes that PyRoute generates into Auto-Jimmy so it could overlaying them on Traveller Map. It should also be possible to display the other info that PyRoute outputs such as BTN between world pairs. If having them overlayed on Traverller Map is something people would find useful, give this comment a like or post a comment saying it would be of use. If it looks like something that would benefit a few people then can try and look at doing it.
@MasterGwydion you said you weren't able to use PyRoute. I'm by no means an expert with it, but I have managed to get it running well enough to generate trade routes for a sector. If you let me know what problems you're having with it, I might be able to help you get it running.
MasterGwydion
Emperor Mongoose
Yeah. If Mongoose ever updates them, they could definitely use some streamlining.
I love this idea!
I was not able to use PyRoute and Auto-Jimmy is even worse for Me. My problem is computer illiteracy, Mine. lol. I am sure Auto-Jimmy is wonderful. PyRoute as well. Just remember, I am the guy that can't even use the search function to separate out planets by TL on the Travellermap. I am sure at least 90% are better with computers than I am. My old ass abilities to use ray tracing programs or program in Basic are not that helpful anymore...lol...
