Central Supply Catalogue Update 2023 - PDF & Pre-Order!

[Geir]

Sorry for the slow response, still recovering from brain fog, but I'll comment...

Some editing notes, if'n you don't mind.

• p9: The External Fabricators table states the max TL as TL3, not TL-3, which is what's implied by the description.

Correct, should be TL-3

• p97: Less of an editing thing, more just personal preference; Behind The Claw has the High-Performance Grav Belt; TL 16, Medium speed, 24 hours endurance, 4kg, Cr250,000. Looks like it'd fit, but then I don't know the exact margins you're working with.

The TL16 version is not included, but not precluded- not everything from every supplement is included in the CSC.

• p106: The G-Suit's description points the user to page 96 for G-Tolerance drugs, but page 96 only has the Zero-G Tolerance drugs. The G-Tolerance drugs are on page 93.

Slippery page numbers... p. 93 would be the correct reference.

• p127: The Laser Cutting Gear and Laser Drill could use some Cut Rate numbers, for the sake of compatability with the Specialist Forces/High Guard rulesets. Off the top of my head, 3 and 7 respectively?

Pretty sure this was turned in before Specialist Forces came out, so Cut Rate wasn't a thing. But 3 and 5, respectively, would probably be more like it. Not sure we need to include it here, though.

• p132: The Finely Made Weapons box states that each advantage increases the cost of a weapon by 2D3, not 2D3 times standard cost, which is what I presume was meant. Might make things clearer.

Yes, 2D3 times standard cost. The rest of the text does make it clearer, but it could be added up front as times standard cost if that adds clarity.

• p140: Should the Gravitic Shield still be TL17? You've imported the personal energy shield from The Third Imperium, and that's TL15, so...

It's also about a hundred times more expensive at TL15, so I think it's fine to keep it as a TL17 option. (Not sure I'm really a big fan of the personal energy shield in any case, but that's apparently a minority opinion)

• p165: The Artillery Weapons, Vehicle Heavy Weapons, and Rockets, Missiles and Bombs tables list their masses in kilograms, not tons. Maybe add an exception for the Infantry Mortar, which I think is supposed to be 12kg.

Yes, that is all supposed to be tons - except the Infantry Mortar which is 12kg (or 0.012 tons). The table got consolidated, as I had each weapon with its own 1 row table (not space efficient, but that's how it was in the old book) - , so the column heading should be Tons with the Infantry Mortar as 0.012.

• p171: Rotary Autocannon is under Rockets, Missiles and Bombs.

Yeah, I think that's an artifact of the source; it came from the Vehicle Handbook... should probably be up with the other autocannons on p.167 (table) and p. 168 (text), or as its own item in the Vehicle Heavy Weapons section, but to be fair, that table already eats the whole page.

• p179: Directed Plasma has its TLs listed at TL6 and TL15, I think that's supposed to be TL15 and TL16; same as Plasma.

I only had a the TL15 entry for Directed Plasma. The TL6 row should go.

Probably more, but I'm tired, so.

Probably more, but thanks for what you found.

 

[Geir]

Comments in line...

Weapon Implant, Page 57

1. "from between the middle finger and ring fingers" should it say "ringer finger"? Now it could be "fingers" which I guess would depend on the customs of the characters home world/religion.

Well, I guess on an Aslan it would be entirely different... probably fine, since most readers get the idea, "in between the middle fingers" would work for an Aslan but leave the human confused.

2. Chart All implants are TL 10? The other charts are progressively increasing in TL.

Same as previous CSC version. The size of the implant may differ but the tech is the same.

3. Chart, Effect. "See above". Above to Improved Prosthetic Limb "No DEX penalty"?

"See text" might have been clearer.

4. Chart, Cost increases until you get to "Laser Pistol", which is cheaper than "Dagger". Should there be an extra 0 at the end for Cr25000?

Yes, Laser Pistol should be Cr25000... somewhere I dropped a zero.

Based on the Laser Pistol description on page 149, the Weapon Implant - Laser Pistol should be at TL 11? TL 11 Laser Pistol is no bigger than a standard pistol at this point which would match the Auto Pistol Implant for space used inside the forearm.

At the corrected price properly matching the old CSC, it's fine to leave it at TL10, but I wouldn't be opposed to altering to TL11 for the reason you state.

Thanks,

 

[Geir]

I think for nuclear rounds, it should read "Nuclear rounds are only available for grenade launchers or other heavy weapons of 40mm or *larger* calibre at TL13 and above".

Yes, it should be 40mm or larger calibre

Thanks,

 

[Geir]

Potential typo: the wafer jack/4 is listed as 1000cr, contradicting the price in the core rule book and earlier CSC.

Yes, should be Cr10000 (I seem to be loosing zeros somewhere...)

 

[Geir]

I think the biggest impact to my players will be the lack of TL12 cloth armor. But that was always a bit weird in allowing the stacking, and would not neatly fit with the new rules.

yeah, the Cloth was dropped in the new Core book, for reasons you mentioned, so this is just in keeping with that.

 

[agentwigggles]

The Zeros are going where all the socks in the dryer go. Overall really liking the new CSC. I was surprise to see the Robot chapter gone.

 

[gilthy]

Yes, should be Cr10000 (I seem to be loosing zeros somewhere...)

As I suggested a while back, Mongoose should consider putting -something- in between the thousands, if only a space.

To prevent confusing in different places around the world (for example, I'm Dutch so I would write 100000.01 as 100.000,01 and in the US that would be 100,000.01), using a space to split up (long) numbers in groups of 3 would really help (and be ISO compliant too!).

So that would be 100 000.01. Or maybe use a "thin space", though that will be harder to type

 

[Jetrock]

P. 162 & 164, the Assault Rocket Launcher, basically a Traveller version of the Gyrojet pistol & rifle created in the 1960s, is portrayed in the illustration like a large shoulder-fired anti-tank rocket weapon instead of an assault rifle that fires 10mm ammunition that carries its own propellant instead of cartridge/slug ammunition.

 

[Sigtrygg]

And had a very good write up in a CT JTAS. It was also in MegaTraveller.

 

[Geir]

And had a very good write up in a CT JTAS. It was also in MegaTraveller.

It was also in the new JTAS volume 1. The accelerator rifle and snub pistol (sort of) are more in line with the Gyrojets. The ARL is a heavier gun, but yeah, the illustration does look more like it fires 40mm RAM grenades or something...

 

[Jetrock]

It was also in the new JTAS volume 1. The accelerator rifle and snub pistol (sort of) are more in line with the Gyrojets. The ARL is a heavier gun, but yeah, the illustration does look more like it fires 40mm RAM grenades or something...

Indeed, that's how I ran the ARL--basically a heavy accelerator rifle! I'm not sure if the snub pistol is supposed to be gyrojet fed, but that would also make sense since a slow-but-heavy conventional pistol would still have plenty of recoil (think .45 ACP). And the illustration looks more like a full sized anti-tank rocket launcher that for some reason has little babby rockets in a magazine on the side (although I think ARL rockets spin-stabilize using angled rocket motors vs. being fin-stabilized.)

 

[a_witch_bird]

For the Weapon Implant. It says that to upgrade the weapon with one of a similar size it is, "At a cost of 5 times the base cost in addition to the cost of the standard implant."
Is the 5 times the base cost the base cost of the weapon you are implanting, or the implant itself? Would upgrading a laser pistol weapon (25000 credits) implant to a stunner (1000 non implant cost) be 150,000 credits (125,000 + 25,000) or 30,000 (5,000 + 25,000).
The lower number feels more correct, but I just wanted to see if that is the correct reading.

 

[Geir]

For the Weapon Implant. It says that to upgrade the weapon with one of a similar size it is, "At a cost of 5 times the base cost in addition to the cost of the standard implant."
Is the 5 times the base cost the base cost of the weapon you are implanting, or the implant itself? Would upgrading a laser pistol weapon (25000 credits) implant to a stunner (1000 non implant cost) be 150,000 credits (125,000 + 25,000) or 30,000 (5,000 + 25,000).
The lower number feels more correct, but I just wanted to see if that is the correct reading.

It would be 5 x the cost of the weapon. If you had a laser weapon implant, it would be 25,000, then removing and adding the stunner would be 5,000, so the second calculation is correct. But a stunner + power pack is smaller than a laser pistol + power pack, so it might be upgradable from an auto pistol implant. Maybe. Referee call.

There's also the question of whether you need to add 5 x 200 for the power pack, and whether or not that's a removable component, or if you can plug your arm into a wall and recharge (or hold the arm over an induction pad for a few hours). Again, referee call.

 

[Tupper]

I'm a bit worried about the Cloth Trench Coat (p12), which rears the ugly head of stacking armour. A traveller could combine a TL10 cloth suit with this (total cost Cr1,000) and achieve +13 armour (+8+5), equivalent to basic combat armour (cost Cr96,000). A more flush traveller could spring for an advanced poly carapace and cloth trench coat (cost Cr35,500) and achieve +21 armour (+16+5). That's almost as good as basic battle dress (cost Cr200,000, armour +22). It's true that the battle dress and combat armour give radiation protection and sealing against the environment. But unless these are an issue, the cloth trench coat feels pretty over powered.

 

[Sigtrygg]

Since you can just wear a personal energy screen I don't see the issue. A screen on top of battledress...

thank heavens for meson pistols and tachyon daggers.

 

[Geir]

I'm a bit worried about the Cloth Trench Coat (p12), which rears the ugly head of stacking armour. A traveller could combine a TL10 cloth suit with this (total cost Cr1,000) and achieve +13 armour (+8+5), equivalent to basic combat armour (cost Cr96,000). A more flush traveller could spring for an advanced poly carapace and cloth trench coat (cost Cr35,500) and achieve +21 armour (+16+5). That's almost as good as basic battle dress (cost Cr200,000, armour +22). It's true that the battle dress and combat armour give radiation protection and sealing against the environment. But unless these are an issue, the cloth trench coat feels pretty over powered.

Well, neither the trench coat or the jacket is intended to be a subtle piece of armour; the trench coat is especially paramilitary or thug-like, plus it doesn't have any electronics suit or protect against any sort of environment, so it's a little unfair to compare a cloth trench coat or cloth jacket to combat armour, plus, as noted for the jacket, these things don't breath well and are more suited to cooler climates. The combo of armour does make for some pretty tough jack-booted thugs, though, and makes a good case for using AP ammo. Or a tranq grenade.

 

[Tupper]

Well, neither the trench coat or the jacket is intended to be a subtle piece of armour; the trench coat is especially paramilitary or thug-like, plus it doesn't have any electronics suit or protect against any sort of environment, so it's a little unfair to compare a cloth trench coat or cloth jacket to combat armour, plus, as noted for the jacket, these things don't breath well and are more suited to cooler climates. The combo of armour does make for some pretty tough jack-booted thugs, though, and makes a good case for using AP ammo. Or a tranq grenade.

Sorry, my arithmetic was off: the trench coat is +6, so with cloth it's actually better than entry level combat armour (barring, as you note, bells and whistles), and with poly carapace under it, it's on par with battle dress.

I think the jacket is less of a worry. It's capped in terms of what can go under it (has to be 1kg or less), which means just the ballistic vest or protec suit are valid stacks. Those combinations will only get you to armour +9, which is only one better than a cloth suit (+8), at the expense of looking a bit more militaristic. As an aside, combat armour and battle dress are definitely militaristic looking too!

The problem, as I see it, with the trench coat is that it can be added to armour that's already very substantial. Traveller generally has an "exponential" rise in costs leading to a "linear" increase in protection:

Cloth suit Cr500 +8
Poly carapace TL11 Cr15,000 +12
Combat armour TL12 Cr88,000 +17
Battle dress Cr220,000 +22

Allowing one to pay Cr500 to add 6 to armour suddenly makes heavy armour cheap for travellers. With +14 armour (cloth suit + trench coat), one is pretty impervious to pistol rounds, and at +22 (poly carapace TL 13 + trench coat), normal rifle rounds don't do much. I think I'd be less worried if the trench coat had the same caveat as the jacket (1kg or less for armour under it). Then you could have goons wandering round with a trench coat and a ballistic vest, with armour +10 (a bit better than a cloth suit, for twice the price), but not have them wading through small arms fire.

 

[Tupper]

The combo of armour does make for some pretty tough jack-booted thugs, though, and makes a good case for using AP ammo. Or a tranq grenade.

Having slept on it, I think I understand your point about AP. If one (say) used an AP round in a pistol, it would nullify 3 points of armour from both layers, leaving the trench coat + cloth combo absorbing 3+5 = 8 points of damage. Against combat armour (armour 13), there'd still be 10 points of armour left. Up the ante to an APDS in a rifle, and you'd be nullifying 9 points of armour, leaving no protection from the trench coat + cloth combo (but doing 3D-3 damage rather than 3D due to the ammo), versus 4 armour still left from the combat armour.

 

[agentwigggles]

Having slept on it, I think I understand your point about AP. If one (say) used an AP round in a pistol, it would nullify 3 points of armour from both layers, leaving the trench coat + cloth combo absorbing 3+5 = 8 points of damage. Against combat armour (armour 13), there'd still be 10 points of armour left. Up the ante to an APDS in a rifle, and you'd be nullifying 9 points of armour, leaving no protection from the trench coat + cloth combo (but doing 3D-3 damage rather than 3D due to the ammo), versus 4 armour still left from the combat armour.

Holy Shit.
I dont know if Geir meant for that to be the thing, but thats fucking awesome and now gonna be a house rule for me moving forward

 

[Tupper]

Holy Shit.
I dont know if Geir meant for that to be the thing, but thats fucking awesome and now gonna be a house rule for me moving forward

I don't think it's a house rule. That's how layered armour is described as working in the new version: you treat each level sequentially. I was wondering why they called that out, but it's relevant for AP.