Who pays for it all?

[ColinD]

This thread has players who care about the economics of their world building! It is one of the things I love about Traveller is that it gives you the space (both literal and figurative) to decide how you want to make your setting run. Many of the players I've met have some really thoughtful and imaginative takes on how they have their Science Fiction setting run, either 3rd Imperium or homebrewed.

I looked into the recent World Builders Handbook and it states that Taxes are "something Referees should consider ignoring for game purposes". I could see if a referee goes down the route of taxing the players in game, when its not in the book, it could cause some consternation.

For myself I have mentioned local and planetary tariffs and taxes for some verisimilitude but haven't charged the characters with any credits that way. I've charged players the Berthing Costs in the 2022 Core Rulebook but never thought of where it goes besides the Starport. It could be considered Imperial Taxes since Starports are under Imperial Law according to the same chapter. It would be an interesting thought experiment to have some Economists look at the 3rd Imperium and see how they think taxation would be done.

 

[Iracundus]

Next we need rules for players filing their taxes, especially if they have engaged in cross-jurisdictional trade between stellar nations. Are there tax treaties? What tax deductions does the Imperium allow? Are the mortgage payments on the ship tax deductible? Does the Solomani Confederation have different tax rates if one is Solomani vs. non-Solomani?

 

[Geir]

GURPS Traveller: Far Trader went into way to much detail on taxation, and yet not enough to be practical (so... can I deduct missiles as a business expense? What about that triple turret I just installed? ) The only practical thing I considered was a tariff system: pay us a fixed percentage of your cargo sales value (not profit)... anything else and it would become Traveller: Accounting (which is not a skill... a Profession maybe?). And then the assumption that the Third Imperium doesn't allow tariffs on internal trade, because it's allegedly all about free trade.

 

[Iracundus]

What about income taxes? Does the Imperium have income tax and is it universal (i.e. is the income generated while trading in the Confederation or Consulate considered taxable by the Imperium?).

 

[Geir]

From a game perspective, I think it's best to assume taxation at the individual Traveller level is all a VAT (Value Added Tax) built into the price of goods and just handwave it away. The interest in running an adventure call 'Tax Audit on Arcturus' would likely be very small.

I doubt it would be a direct Imperial tax in any case, definitely an individual member world sort of thing. As other have said, how the Imperium collects its share is not really explained, though I suspect it's probably something close to 'tax farming' based on whatever the Imperium says the rate for a world should be, with the world deciding how to pass along the burden pay for it.

 

[Iracundus]

From a game perspective, I think it's best to assume taxation at the individual Traveller level is all a VAT (Value Added Tax) built into the price of goods and just handwave it away. The interest in running an adventure call 'Tax Audit on Arcturus' would likely be very small.

I doubt it would be a direct Imperial tax in any case, definitely an individual member world sort of thing. As other have said, how the Imperium collects its share is not really explained, though I suspect it's probably something close to 'tax farming' based on whatever the Imperium says the rate for a world should be, with the world deciding how to pass along the burden pay for it.

I don't know. I could see an adventure based around aggressive tax collection or pursuing tax evaders. Have the players be the collection agents of the IRS (Interstellar Revenue Service). Maybe have it spiral up into an interstellar diplomatic incident if the antagonist's income spans borders, and the other side lays claim to tax the revenue as well.

 

[Condottiere]

Individual taxation is highly likely at the planetary level, and considering how you can be tracked nowadays, especially with electronic banking, likely unescapable.

Megacorporations and interstellar trusts are likely directly taxed by the Imperium, so you can't find tax havens.

 

[Iracundus]

Individual taxation is highly likely at the planetary level, and considering how you can be tracked nowadays, especially with electronic banking, likely unescapable.

Megacorporations and interstellar trusts are likely directly taxed by the Imperium, so you can't find tax havens.

But what about peripatetic people like our Travellers and other starship crew that spend most of their time on board a ship? Do they have to have a declared "tax home"?

 

[Condottiere]

Pay As You Earn?

In the Confederation, all spacecraft have a declared home port.

 

[MonsterX]

I've never seen individual taxation on players actually dealt with in a Traveller game, except in terms of starport and import fees which might or might not actually be taxes. However, if we were realistic, ships would be flagged somewhere, and players would pay income tax to that polity. Which would prompt the players to search for a polity which doesn't have income taxes, and hopefully not very high fees in other respects either, where they can flag their ships. Something like this happens on ships in reality. However, maybe ships are not registered to individual planets. Does the Imperium flag the ships? If the Imperium, maybe they do in fact exempt starship crews from planetary taxes, as part of encouraging free trade. Players also don't pay a lot of the other kinds of fees ships would normally pay, like classification and registration. However, I am pretty sure planets will want to tax income earned on the planet, which players sometimes earn but basically never pay taxes on.

 

[Condottiere]

Starport might be sales tax and value added tax.

Might have a duty free section.

 

[DarkDawning]

While nothing seems done consistently in the game rules. but if i were setting it up
the system baron collects a percentage of gdp 1% or less from the planets governments(tribute) and gets a tariff on imports and exports from the starports. all these fees are already included in the prices in the rulebook. about half is used locally by him for system defence boats ,local infrastructure , and so forth. the other half is sent up to the duke and used simulary with half of what he gets sent to the archduke and he send half to the emperor. so the emperor gets roughly 1/8 of all taxes from entire imperium that would add up to a lot to spend on the navy . and other things.

 

[Shadowblayde99]

What would happen if a system formally requests that they no longer be part of the Imperium?

Would they suddenly find a fleet of imperial Navy ships above the planet?

Would they find themselves no longer able to trade?

 

[Sigtrygg]

Ever wonder how amber and red zones get designated...

 

[Geir]

Neither a lawyer or a diplomat, but somewhere their should be a template (not readily modifiable since nobody wants 11,000 variations on any theme) where the planetary authorities and an Imperial representative sign off on the responsibility, duties, and benefits of both parties (all I can remember from Business law is that you can't have a valid contract without consideration - a legal term, not a an etiquette thing - so each party has to 'get' something of value- whether that be taxes, or protection, or two free passes to a grav ball game on Capital. That and that I don't ever want to be a lawyer or even deal with them except as a last resort, because no matter what you signed, it doesn't protect you for being sued for something you either didn't think of or that you thought was covered - but maybe that's just an American legal system 'feature'.)

 

[Condottiere]

Planetary taxes probably pay for the starport, and most other Imperium operational costs within the system, otherwise they need a subsidy from the subsector duke's general fund.

Imperium Navy, Scout Services, and most other Imperium organizations are paid from the sector budget; susbsector navies, and system squadrons are funded by their regional budgets.

 

[CordwainerFish]

At least as far as trade is concerned, we're told that the bulk of interstellar hauling is done by the megacorporations, and (if you drill down) that the Imperial family is a minority owner of most if not all of the megacorps, so my non-economist's idle thought is "why tax something when you're already getting a taste of it"?

 

[Iracundus]

At least as far as trade is concerned, we're told that the bulk of interstellar hauling is done by the megacorporations, and (if you drill down) that the Imperial family is a minority owner of most if not all of the megacorps, so my non-economist's idle thought is "why tax something when you're already getting a taste of it"?

The amount gained from a corporate tax would far exceed the amount from dividends paid to a minority stake of a few percent of a megacorp. Taxes are also in theory unavoidable, whereas a corporation could decide to reduce or even stop dividend payments.

 

[Condottiere]

It's probably a conflict of interest being both taxman and shareholder.

On the other hand, it's likely that some tax avoidance is tolerated, as long as it doesn't become systemic.

 

[Alqualonde]

Beside dividends goes to the Emperor's pocket (or at least the Imperial Family's pocket) whereas the taxes goes the Imperial coffers. Unless the ruler is particularly corrupt, the two will be mostly separated. At least in a modern state.
Dividends will pay Emperor Strephon a new shiny Yatch for personnal use, Taxes will pay a new BatRon in the SpinwardMarches (built locally I guess).