Utilizing Element Cruiser Pods (or, what to do with 715-765 Tons and 2 hardpoints)

EccentRick

Banded Mongoose
Feeling like a glutton for punishment, I dove into another round of Element-class redesigns and comparisons. To keep the Hull design (standard, Reinforced, Armor Rating) consistent between the Core hull and Pods, the Fuel pod (favorite of the Khumakirri) imposes initial limitations, while a matching Missile pod has crazy amounts of open “unused” space for the Ghalalk and Amara.

With 715 – 765 open tons in the Missile pod, but only 2 available hardpoints, what would you do with the tonnage?

Redistribute fuel from the core hull for more armor and armored bulkheads? Double the number of missile salvoes that can be thrown? (As written, there are 20 ‘shots’ for every launcher the pod carries, mix and re-allocate for your damage-control needs). Doubling the salvoes only uses 525 tons for the extra missiles (and their armored storage bulkheads - safety!), what would you do with the remaining 190 - 240?
 
Some of the thought processes during creation:
Hull design (Standard, Reinforced, Armor Rating) must be consistent between the Core hull and the Pods of a line (I built 3; Armored: Hull armor of 15 and many reinforced bulkheads with fuel in the pods, Citadel: keeping the reinforced bulkheads and reducing armor to 8 to pull the fuel out of the pods, and Shelled: sacrificing the reinforced bulkheads to bring the hull armor up to 12 while the pods stay fuel free).
Pod related functions should be as contained to the pods as possible (crew quarters, etc.) to maximalize the ‘versatility’ of changing to a different pod.
Components in pods (Power Plant, fuel, repair drones) combine ‘seamlessly’ with the same component in the Core hull – when a pod is installed they are treated as part of the main system of the core hull, not as separate sub-systems.
Played on that seamless integration for some wiggle room in Core vs Pod location. The Armored and Shelled lines carried the tonnage for the repair drones in the Core hull instead of the various pods.
Standard staterooms are double occupancy. High staterooms single occupancy.
Common Areas: The Armored line shows space for 1 ton per crew/passenger berth, plus 0.5 ton per marine. The others allocate 0.5 ton per person onboard. The Frozen Watch (low berths) are not included in the calculation.
Ballparked and assigned Stewards (probably in excess) at 1 per 10 officers or 100 crew [Counting ‘Officers’ as all of Captain, Pilots, Astrogator, and Officers]. Stewards were calculated after officers and before medics.
These are Cruisers, potentially tapped for independent operations. They carry enough fuel processors to refine sufficient fuel for J4 in 2 days.
Supply Units rules: The Element Cruiser box set and Deepnight campaign have ‘free’ storage of an amount of SU, but HG2020 is ambiguous and could imply that storage space on the record sheet is needed for those SU. Standard is 100 days (DNR made a deliberate customization for 200 days), and the formula is designed so 100 days of SU is equal to 1% of the hull. If storage space is required for normal SU carrying, the Amara ships fall short by up to 75 tons with an endurance as low as 85 days.

Thanks to Arkathan for a ship designer that helps make processing the calculations bearable. Thanks to Regnarts for inspiring the exploration of storing fuel in the pods – a considerable impact.

To avoid overloading the thread with ship stats, the general approach to a ‘core’ hull is:

Line/Ship Core
Hull19,800 / 39,600 / 59,400 tons, Standard
Reinforced
ArmorBonded Superdense, Armor: [per line]
Radiation Shielding
M-DriveThrust 6 (@ full Dtons) (Energy Efficient, Small x2)
J-DriveJump 4 (@ full Dtons) (reduced fuel x2)
Power PlantFusion (TL 15), Power: per line
Fuel TanksJ-2, 8 Weeks, + additional tons needed for J4
BridgeBridges x2, Holographic Controls
Command Bridge, Holographic Controls
ComputerCore / 100
Backup Core / 90
SensorsAdvanced, Distributed Array x2
Military Countermeasures x2
Enhanced Signal Processing x2
Additional sensor Stations x6 / x8
WeaponsSpinal Particle Accelerator Cannon (TL 14) (x2 for Amara)
Fusion Barbettes (Long Range, High Yield) x12
Triple Turret Beam Laser (Accurate, High Yield) x15 / x20 / x30
Triple Turret Sandcaster x20
Point Defense Battery Type III-L x2
AmmunitionSand (200)
ScreensMeson Screen x10
Nuclear Damper x10
Armored BulkheadsM-Drive
J-Drive
Power Plant
Bridges
Command Bridge
Sensors
Spinal Mount
Screens
CraftFull Hanger (240 Tons)
Troop Transports x4
SystemsFuel Scoops
Fuel Processor (sufficient for J4 at 2 days)
Repair Drones (@ full Dtons)
UNREP System (200 tons/hour)
Armory (200 Marines, 250 crew)
Briefing Room x4 / x8
Medical Bay x6
Workshop x4
Brig x4
StateroomsStandard x (per crew)
High x3 / x4
Barracks x 200
Low Berths x200
Common Areas
Cargo


Khumakirri:

StateroomsStandard x164
656​
324 Crew: 1 Captain, 7 Pilots, 1 Astrogator, 100 Engineers, 26 Mechanics, 5 Medics, 118 Gunners, 13 Sens-ops, 7 Stewards, 17 Administrators, 29 Officers. Also carries 200 Marines.

Ghalalk:

StateroomsStandard x196
784​
390 Crew: 1 Captain, 7 Pilots, 1 Astrogator, 149 Engineers, 39 Mechanics, 6 Medics, 100 Gunners, 15 Sens-ops, 9 Stewards, 25 Administrators, 38 Officers. Also carries 200 Marines.

Amara:

StateroomsStandard x284
1136​
566 Crew: 1 Captain, 7 Pilots, 1 Astrogator, 224 Engineers, 58 Mechanics, 8 Medics, 142 Gunners, 19 Sens-ops, 13 Stewards, 38 Administrators, 55 Officers. Also carries 200 Marines.
 
First question: How much armor can these ships carry (The Armored Line)?

Start with the fuel pod.

The Khumakirri needs the 2600 ton armored gas can to hold 2250 tons of fuel. Retaining the box set’s idea that there should be a minimal contribution to the ship’s self-defense from the pod, it has 6 beam lasers. Taking advantage of the Khumakirri’s crew reduction factor (the ‘primary’ user) results in the pod needing a crew of 13: 4 Mechanics, 8 Gunners, and 1 officer to ride herd on them, so there are 7 double staterooms. That leaves space for a Bonded Superdense armor value of 15, and 4 tons of common areas (or internal storage). In theory the armor value might be pushed to 16, but that leaves only 11 tons of space where even Barracks sleeping is short on beds and would combine with the complete lack of common areas/internal storage to be a drain on morale. It’s also the tipping point of needing to pay extra for a Military Hull. There are variants to play out with the armaments and crew space, but an armor value of 17 does not appear reachable.

Armored Fuel Pod
Mass​
Hull2,600 tons, Standard
Reinforced
ArmorBonded Superdense, Armor: 15
312​
Radiation Shielding
Fuel Tanks2,250 additional tons
2,250​
WeaponsTriple Turrets (accurate, high yield beam lasers) x6
6​
StateroomsStandard (Double) x7
28​
Common Areas
4​

13 Crew: 4 Mechanics, 8 Gunners, 1 Officer

This then feeds the design of the Khumakirri Core hull. The design includes extra space in the common areas to accommodate the crew of 2 fuel pods.

From this baseline, attempts to scale everything up for the Ghalalk and Amara hit an immediate crisis: there’s not enough space to bring all the fuel into the Core hull. If we abandon the idea of using the fuel pods on these larger hulls and carrying fuel in the other pods they might have installed, the Missile pods (the ‘Primary’ pod used by Ghalalk and Amara) have space to carry 730 tons of fuel – a sufficiently rounded number for calculations.

Armored Missile Pod
Mass​
Hull2,600 tons, Standard
Reinforced
ArmorBonded Superdense, Armor: 15
312​
Radiation Shielding
Fuel Tanks
730​
WeaponsLarge Missile Bays (Small x3) x2
700​
Medium Missile Bays (Small x3) x2
140​
Triple Turrets (accurate, high yield beam lasers) x12
12​
AmmunitionMissiles (20 full salvoes)
480​
Armored BulkheadsLarge Missile Bays
70​
Medium Missile Bays
14​
Missile Storage
48​
StateroomsStandard (Double) x11
44​
Common Areas
22​
Cargo
26​
“Unused” / Cargo
2​

22 Crew: 3 Mechanics, 18 Gunners, 1 Officer
 
Second question: If we wish to retain use of the Fuel Pods by the entire Element series of ships, we need to bring the fuel back into the core hull. If we retain all the Armored Bulkheads in an All-or-Nothing armoring philosophy, how much Armor gets sacrificed? The Citadel line shifts some tonnage (Repair Drones, Power Plant capacity) from the Core hull to the Pods to try and free up some of the tonnage lost as the fuel moves in. The aim is for the Pod to be responsible for itself, while not leaving the core hull short-handed. The Core hull also reduces the Common areas to just 0.5 tons per active person. The Pods as listed also reflect that ratio for consistency and to set the minimum required before other adjustments are made.

Results: the armor value drops to 8.

The fuel pod is fairly straightforward, after adding minimal power plant, repair drones, an extra stateroom, and increasing the common areas there is only 46.6 tons of ‘unused’ space:

Citadel Fuel Pod
Mass​
Hull2,600 tons, Standard
Reinforced
ArmorBonded Superdense, Armor: 8
166.4​
Radiation Shielding
Power PlantFusion (TL 15), Power 600
30​
Fuel Tanks8 Weeks operation, 2,250 additional tons
2,256​
WeaponsTriple Turrets (accurate, high yield beam lasers) x6
6​
Armored BulkheadsPower Plant
3​
SystemsRepair Drones
26​
StateroomsStandard (Double) x8
32​
Common Areas
8​
Cargo
26​
“Unused” / Cargo
46.6​

13 Crew: 4 Mechanics, 8 Gunners, 1 Officer

The missile pod, however, has an enormous amount of ‘unused’ space. Even after attempting to maximize the powerplant without causing a brownout on the core hull, there is still open space of 765 Dtons!

Citadel Missile Pod
Mass​
Hull2,600 tons, Standard
Reinforced
ArmorBonded Superdense, Armor: 8
166.4​
Radiation Shielding
Power PlantFusion (TL 15), Power 1500
75​
Fuel Tanks8 Weeks operation
15​
WeaponsLarge Missile Bays (Small x3) x2
700​
Medium Missile Bays (Small x3) x2
140​
Triple Turrets (accurate, high yield beam lasers) x12
12​
AmmunitionMissiles (20 full salvoes)
480​
SystemsRepair Drones
26​
Armored BulkheadsPower Plant
7.5​
Large Missile Bays
70​
Medium Missile Bays
14​
Missile Storage
48​
StateroomsStandard (Double) x11
44​
Common Areas
11​
Cargo
26​
“Unused” / Cargo
765.1​

22 Crew: 3 Mechanics, 18 Gunners, 1 Officer
 
Third question: Returning full circle, what can be done to maximize the hull armor again? The obvious answer is scavenging the armored bulkheads, changing the armoring philosophy away from the all-or-nothing of a line of battle the cruiser is not suited for to a more evenly spaced protection to facilitate against lighter combatants in its raiding or defending role, hopefully with fewer trips to the repair yard. Here the Amara sets the defining limitations.

The armor value increases to 12. If cargo space is not required for normal stowage of SU, an Armor value of 13 can be achieved by cutting the Amara’s cargo space down to 66 tons.

In this Shelled line, to get the most armor on the Fuel pods again resulted in all repair drones being ‘assigned’ to the core hulls, and a shortage of cargo space.

Fuel Pod:

Shelled Fuel Pod
Mass​
Hull2,600 tons, Standard
Reinforced
ArmorBonded Superdense, Armor: 12
294.6​
Radiation Shielding
Power PlantFusion (TL 15), Power 600
30​
Fuel Tanks8 Weeks operation, 2,250 additional tons
2,256​
WeaponsTriple Turrets (accurate, high yield beam lasers) x6
6​
Armored BulkheadsPower Plant
3​
StateroomsStandard (Double) x8
32​
Common Areas
8​
Cargo
15.4​

13 Crew: 4 Mechanics, 8 Gunners, 1 Officer

The missile pod, still has an enormous amount of ‘unused’ space, 715 Dtons!

Shelled Missile Pod
Mass​
Hull2,600 tons, Standard
Reinforced
ArmorBonded Superdense, Armor: 12
249.6​
Radiation Shielding
Power PlantFusion (TL 15), Power 1500
75​
Fuel Tanks8 Weeks operation
15​
WeaponsLarge Missile Bays (Small x3) x2
700​
Medium Missile Bays (Small x3) x2
140​
Triple Turrets (accurate, high yield beam lasers) x12
12​
AmmunitionMissiles (20 full salvoes)
480​
Armored BulkheadsLarge Missile Bays
70​
Medium Missile Bays
14​
Missile Storage
48​
StateroomsStandard (Double) x11
44​
Common Areas
11​
Cargo
26​
“Unused” / Cargo
715.4​

22 Crew: 3 Mechanics, 18 Gunners, 1 Officer
 
Just a quick question that may be stupid. Why not put the J-Drive in a pod? Then if you take out the J-Drive pods and the fuel pods, you can have it be a System Monitor, but when you need an offensive fleet, just add the J-Drive and Fuel Pods back on.

Put the J-Drive in a Docking Space instead of a Modular Space. Adds 10% to the space used, but makes it easy to get in and out.
 
Just a quick question that may be stupid. Why not put the J-Drive in a pod? Then if you take out the J-Drive pods and the fuel pods, you can have it be a System Monitor, but when you need an offensive fleet, just add the J-Drive and Fuel Pods back on.

Put the J-Drive in a Docking Space instead of a Modular Space. Adds 10% to the space used, but makes it easy to get in and out.
An interesting idea.
 
Just a quick question that may be stupid. Why not put the J-Drive in a pod? Then if you take out the J-Drive pods and the fuel pods, you can have it be a System Monitor, but when you need an offensive fleet, just add the J-Drive and Fuel Pods back on.

Put the J-Drive in a Docking Space instead of a Modular Space. Adds 10% to the space used, but makes it easy to get in and out.
Instead of doing that, look at p12 of the High Guard Update under 'Breakaway Hull'. For no credits an extra 2MCr/dTon, and 2% of the hull volume any PowerPlant, M-Drive, and/or J-Drive in a pod combines seamlessly with all similar items on the main hull and other pods. No limit on tonnage. One downside is that each 'Pod' needs to have a 'Bridge' (which can be 'undersized' for the Pod).

"Manoeuvre drive, jump drive, sensors, weapons, screens and so forth are all options that can (and, under normal circumstances, should) be included in each section. While the sections are together, drives, power plants and weapons can all be combined when calculating performance."

Also, total Armor Value for 'Bonded Superdense' cannot go above TL.

Carrying enough Nuclear Dampers to ignore / negate 80D of Particle Accelerator damage (and the powerplant to run it) is less than 5k dTons -- this is enough to withstand one maximized Spinal PA hit per round. Being able to withstand 75D of Meson damage is more compact, and does the same thing for Meson Guns Spinal weapons.
 
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Instead of doing that, look at p12 of the High Guard Update under 'Breakaway Hull'. For no credits an extra 2MCr/dTon, and 2% of the hull volume any PowerPlant, M-Drive, and/or J-Drive in a pod combines seamlessly with all similar items on the main hull and other pods. No limit on tonnage. One downside is that each 'Pod' needs to have a 'Bridge' (which can be 'undersized' for the Pod).

"Manoeuvre drive, jump drive, sensors, weapons, screens and so forth are all options that can (and, under normal circumstances, should) be included in each section. While the sections are together, drives, power plants and weapons can all be combined when calculating performance."

Also, total Armor Value for 'Bonded Superdense' cannot go above TL.

Carrying enough Nuclear Dampers to ignore / negate 80D of Particle Accelerator damage (and the powerplant to run it) is less than 5k dTons -- this is enough to withstand one maximized Spinal PA hit per round. Being able to withstand 75D of Meson damage is more compact, and does the same thing for Meson Guns Spinal weapons.
Docking space uses 10% more tonnage, but only costs 0.25MCr/ton This is way better than 2MCr per ton. Also, if each breakaway hull needs a bridge, that means you have to buy a Computer for each hull as well, increasing your price even further.
 
You have to find a balance for what you want your spacecraft to do.

Pods are, essentially, free.

Except, it takes time to attach them, and hook up the plumbing.
 
Docking space uses 10% more tonnage, but only costs 0.25MCr/ton This is way better than 2MCr per ton. Also, if each breakaway hull needs a bridge, that means you have to buy a Computer for each hull as well, increasing your price even further.
Breakaway hulls have two advantages over putting drives in docking space. The first is that breakaway hulls expressly do work exactly like it says on the label -- all the drives (and powerplants, and weapons, and screens, and etc) on the pod and ship combine to work together to determine performance for the whole ship. Putting drives in 'docking space' is exactly equivalent to wasting 10% more space than the drive takes, and provides the same performance boost as anything else carried as cargo -- unless the GM house-rules otherwise.

Second is that Breakaway Hull allows 49 dTons of systems (plus the one dTon spent on the Breakaway mechanism) for 2 MCr. For 49 dTons of systems in 'docking space', that comes to 4.9 dTons of wasted space for the dock, for ~13.5 MCr.
 
Breakaway hulls have two advantages over putting drives in docking space. The first is that breakaway hulls expressly do work exactly like it says on the label -- all the drives (and powerplants, and weapons, and screens, and etc) on the pod and ship combine to work together to determine performance for the whole ship. Putting drives in 'docking space' is exactly equivalent to wasting 10% more space than the drive takes, and provides the same performance boost as anything else carried as cargo -- unless the GM house-rules otherwise.

Second is that Breakaway Hull allows 49 dTons of systems (plus the one dTon spent on the Breakaway mechanism) for 2 MCr. For 49 dTons of systems in 'docking space', that comes to 4.9 dTons of wasted space for the dock, for ~13.5 MCr.
This is a valid point, and your math is correct. Thank you.
 
If, however, time is of the essence, and connectivity, then breakaway.

Since two percent is ubiquitous, consider that a premium of forty thousand starbux per tonne.
 
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