Refits-Traveller

tytalan

Emperor Mongoose
So there seems to be some confusion over refits according to HG 2022. Under major refits it says “ Major refits cover changes in power plant, manoeuvre or jump drive, as well as changes to spinal mounts or launch facilities (such as launch tubes).” To me that’s pretty clear it costs a lot of time and money but you can change these things how you want. The problem comes under the minor refit category

Under minor refit it says this “ Minor refits are changes to any other components aboard the ship, such as weapon mounts or staterooms.” But it later says this “ Armour and other parts of the ship integral to the hull (such as configuration or reinforced structure) cannot be changed under any refit.” Which should probably be stated elsewhere in the section but it makes this next line confusing by being placed under the minor refit paragraph as is this next line “ Those items covered under a major refit cannot be increased in size but they can be reduced.”

Now the way I read it under a major refit you can increase the size of the of Jump drive, Manuever drive, Power plant, spinal mounts and Launch facilities because your moving bulkheads and restructuring the inside of the hull literally rebuilding the inside of the ship which makes sense the navy does it from time to time and it fits with the cost and time requirements. While under a minor refit you can only decrease the size of these components because you’re not doing major structural changes. But it’s been argued that you can’t increase the size of these components under and refit major or minor but the Hero class far trader is literally a refit of the Beowulf class free trader with larger jump drive. So which is it?
 
You mean the one that confirms what I have said?

You can, a paragraph is one of the most versatile artifacts in English writing, and also the most confusing.

I gnored nothing, I'm only going to keep posting what the rules state, that you quote yourself.

No, I have quoted them, you are now just making things up with no evidence to back up your claims

You started the attack on my educational knowledge, which appears to be a notch or two above yours since basic comprehension eludes you.

The truth is the text I have quoted that you fail to comprehend.

Lol, AI, you mean those artifacts of mass ignorance?

Refits are the topic.

Several sentences.

Supporting details for major, minor and hull refits

This it does, badly, but it does it.

The topic is refits as a whole, looks like I am correct, again.

There are no random sentences in the refit paragraph that do not relate to ship refits.
Why in the name of all that is holy are you wasting time arguing with Tytalan of all people?
 
IMO this thread is unneeded. In simplifying the rule's set Mongoose has created an issue where a good portion of the RAW ruleset should probably be taken as Alacarte. There is a good chance that there is a RAW paragraph in Book A that will contradict what another RAW rule says in Book B or the RAW rule doesn't quite make sense to someone. I know nobody wants to hear this. Just do you man. However you read the rule is correct.
 
IMO this thread is unneeded. In simplifying the rule's set Mongoose has created an issue where a good portion of the RAW ruleset should probably be taken as Alacarte. There is a good chance that there is a RAW paragraph in Book A that will contradict what another RAW rule says in Book B or the RAW rule doesn't quite make sense to someone. I know nobody wants to hear this. Just do you man. However you read the rule is correct.
Rule Zero is the Law of the Land at the table, but it is a crappy way to write a ruleset or a setting. One applies to players and referees, the other to publishers.
 
Rule Zero is the Law of the Land at the table, but it is a crappy way to write a ruleset or a setting. One applies to players and referees, the other to publishers.
Sure, I don't mind the simplified ruleset of 2nd even with the inconsistencies. It is still workable. Mongoose is also potentially working towards a repair. They are redoing the Vehicle handbook and have updates on the way for CSC and High Guard as a start.
 
Sure, I don't mind the simplified ruleset of 2nd even with the inconsistencies. It is still workable. Mongoose is also potentially working towards a repair. They are redoing the Vehicle handbook and have updates on the way for CSC and High Guard as a start.
I am very much looking forward to Geir's Vehicle's update. I have my concerns with it holding on to too much of the legacy stuff for no reason other than it being legacy stuff and not finally making Slots, Spaces, and Dtons scalable. At the same time, I tend to love Geir's work, so I am carefully optimistic.

One thing that I love about Traveller is that they are constantly evolving, looking for better ways to do things and implementing them without having to completely release a new edition.
 
I don't use the refit rules at all. The rules for removing old components isn't bad, but they rest of it is stupid. If I want to renovate a stateroom, it apparently takes 10% of the total time to build the ship. If I want to renovate every stateroom on the ship it still take 10% of the time required to build the whole ship. Someone didn't think that through and that is only one of the problems with the refit rules. So a liner with 100 staterooms takes 39 months to build (I grabbed this number out of thin air, so it is not tied to anything), and I want to change a 4-ton stateroom into 2-2ton staterooms, that takes 3.9 months. If I want to replace all 100 staterooms, it still takes 3.9 months.
Instead of cost of the ship, I use cost of the refit. Much more realistic, in my player's opinions. Still gives effectively two+ days of downtime for each turret changed out, but that is more reasonable than weeks/months.
 
Summary:
No refit allowed for armour, configuration, integral hull options
Major refit - drives, spinal, launch tubes - may be decreased in size, can not be increased.
Minor refit - other stuff, weapon mounts, staterooms, cargo hold
This is a good summary that aligns with my understanding of the rules as written. Thank you
 
Last edited:
Back
Top