Here's an idea...

[iamtim]

Ok, folks, go with me here for a minute.

Fact 1: We already know that you can't copyright a game mechanic, only a given representation of a game mechanic. Mechanics can be re-written and re-released; this is exhibited perfectly in MRQ and OSRIC, a 1E AD&D compatible RPG.

Fact 2: Mongoose RuneQuest is open. It's been released under the OGL and there is an SRD freely available for it.

So what if Mongoose knew all along that old-guard RQ fans wouldn't like the changes they made and planned on those old-guard RQ fans tweaking the SRD using Fact 1 above to re-release all the RQ1/2/3 mechanics for MRQ?

What if Mongoosed planned it that way?

Why would they want to do that? Well, it creates a vibrant and ongoing development community using the MRQ core rulebook and/or SRD. It gets more people playing RuneQuest -- even if many of those people are playing, essentially, RQ1/2/3 based on the MRQ SRD. RuneQuest would be all over the place again -- old-guard RuneQuest fans playing their implementation, and newer fans playing the Mongoose implementation. All the buzz creates more new customers, who go to the game store looking for this "RuneQuest" game and only find Mongoose's offering.

Not a bad little plan, eh?

 

[atgxtg]

Ok, folks, go with me here for a minute.

Fact 1: We already know that you can't copyright a game mechanic, only a given representation of a game mechanic. Mechanics can be re-written and re-released; this is exhibited perfectly in MRQ and OSRIC, a 1E AD&D compatible RPG.

Fact 2: Mongoose RuneQuest is open. It's been released under the OGL and there is an SRD freely available for it.

So what if Mongoose knew all along that old-guard RQ fans wouldn't like the changes they made and planned on those old-guard RQ fans tweaking the SRD using Fact 1 above to re-release all the RQ1/2/3 mechanics for MRQ?

What if Mongoosed planned it that way?

Why would they want to do that? Well, it creates a vibrant and ongoing development community using the MRQ core rulebook and/or SRD. It gets more people playing RuneQuest -- even if many of those people are playing, essentially, RQ1/2/3 based on the MRQ SRD. RuneQuest would be all over the place again -- old-guard RuneQuest fans playing their implementation, and newer fans playing the Mongoose implementation. All the buzz creates more new customers, who go to the game store looking for this "RuneQuest" game and only find Mongoose's offering.

Not a bad little plan, eh?

Except for the fact that the old guard could just as easily or likely swtich over to Chaosium's DBRP. THat is what most of the have saidin parting comments as they left the board one by one. Being one of the remainingg "old guard", and someone who has done some MRQ tweaking, I have more anticipation about DBRP that I do about any MRQ product.

 

[iamtim]

Except for the fact that the old guard could just as easily or likely swtich over to Chaosium's DBRP.

Yeah... but I don't have a lot of faith in Chaosium or DBRP. If it comes out, I'll be pleasantly surprised. But I'm not holding my breath.

I've heard all the reports from the Chaosium insiders about how much progress is being done on it. I'm in the "I'll believe it when I see it" camp.

That said, though, DBRP isn't an open system. Or at least it hasn't been announced that it will be. They said at one point on RPG.net that they were investigating some sort of an open license for it, but as with the system itself, I'm not putting faith in anything out of the Chaosium camp aside of real, actual product.

It's sad, too, 'cuz I've long been a Chaosium fan.

 

[atgxtg]

As far as being an "open" suystem goes. That really doesn't mean much to anyone who is not writing and selling RPG products. For the vast majoirt who play but don't publish it doesn't make a difference, as long as prodcut is being released.

I have sympathy for you over Chaosium. THey just aren't the company there used to be. Literally. A good portion of the staff have left the company, and that includes most of the people who wrote the orginal RQ stuff.

Still, it wouldn't take much for them to relase something along the lines of RQ2, 3 or even Magic World. I can't see why they couldn't get something out by 2007, as planned. It isn't like the game really needed a lot of progress. THe core rules are pretty sound. Maybe a little tweaking and a some supplments to get it out of the gate.

That said. Who knows? I don't think I've understood what they were up to for at least a decade, and probably longer. I know they had some finacial difficulties (what RPG company hasn't?) and suspect that the delay might have something to do with getting up enough venture capital to start up a new line.

But, if DBRP does get released, it may very well become the rallying point for the RQ old guard. Of course that will depend on how well they like it.

 

[gamesmeister]

But, if DBRP does get released, it may very well become the rallying point for the RQ old guard. Of course that will depend on how well they like it.

The problem is of course that the term "RQ old guard" covers a very broad spectrum of players, as RQ3 was very different from RQ2. No matter how many new versions of RQ you produce, you'll never keep us all happy

 

[sexy_davey]

Sorry for being thick - DBRP?

Some sort of new Basic Role Playing?

 

[GoingDown]

Sorry for being thick - DBRP?
Some sort of new Basic Role Playing?

Deluxe Basic Role Playing.

It is something Chaosium has promised (for a long time already) - new version of BRP rules.

Hopefully it gets released someday.

 

[Mac V]

I have nothing by love for Chaosium. I'm a long time Cthulhu nut. BUT, Chaosium hasn't exactly been burning up the shelves with releases. I think there's a BRP monogram that might be useful, but I haven't read it.

 

[Rurik]

I have nothing by love for Chaosium. I'm a long time Cthulhu nut. BUT, Chaosium hasn't exactly been burning up the shelves with releases. I think there's a BRP monogram that might be useful, but I haven't read it.

The BRP Monographs currently available for download are just reprints of the RQ3 Rules with all references to RuneQuest and Glorantha replaced/removed.

Deluxe Basic Roleplaying is a product in development (work is still being done and playtesting ongoing). There is current info on it if you go googling. Hopefully Chaosium will be able to bring it to print.

 

[iamtim]

As far as being an "open" suystem goes. That really doesn't mean much to anyone who is not writing and selling RPG products.

While there is a large group of gamers who don't rightly care about the OGL (and why would they -- it makes no difference to the D&D or RQ or whatever games they play), you'd be surprised how many people look for open systems because of companies like Palladium and TSR who threaten lawsuits over house rules posted on the 'net.

 

[atgxtg]

As far as being an "open" suystem goes. That really doesn't mean much to anyone who is not writing and selling RPG products.

While there is a large group of gamers who don't rightly care about the OGL (and why would they -- it makes no difference to the D&D or RQ or whatever games they play), you'd be surprised how many people look for open systems because of companies like Palladium and TSR who threaten lawsuits over house rules posted on the 'net.

I guess so. I've seen a lot of house rules for RPGs out there. TSR is long gone, in part becuase they wnet after and discourage third party products. In effect they forced everyone to compete with them rather than support thier own line. Eventually they lost.

As far as threatening to sue people over house rules up on the net, I suppose some gaming compnaies do that, but it is not a good idea. All it does is reduce the nukmber of people buying and playing your company's products. If a company threatened to sue me over a something on a fan-site devoted to thier product. I'd stop. I'd stop posting the house rules, and I'd stop promoting that company in any way. That might be why I never read anything good about Kevin Siembeda.

The TV networks figured that out about six years back when they went after all the TV show fan sites and threatened them if they didn't take some images down. Suddenly the fan base started to dry up. The Star Trek franchise has yet to recover from all the fan sites that Viacaom cease & desisted out of existence. You would think, that after what happened to TSR gaming companies would know better.

 

[Exubae]

DBRP does get released, it may very well become the rallying point for the RQ old guard. Of course that will depend on how well they like it.

As the DBRP rules stand in play testing they're not bad, Jason has done a really good job on them. I've been using prototype DBRP as the basis for a new set of rules/rewrite for the Nephilim RPG, and the rules seem to be working well, but Jason's approach has been very different from Mongoose's.

MRQ has put forward some pretty cool innovations (and some damn annoying changes as well), but more importantly ones that encourage good role playing rather than roll playing.(i.e Hero points)

At the end of the day, I'm going to end up using a mishmash of DBRP and MRQ when running my Glorantha games.

A co-authored/co-produced system between Chaosium and Mongoose would have been a wicked concept.

Paul

 

[atgxtg]

DBRP does get released, it may very well become the rallying point for the RQ old guard. Of course that will depend on how well they like it.

As the DBRP rules stand in play testing they're not bad, Jason has done a really good job on them. I've been using prototype DBRP as the basis for a new set of rules/rewrite for the Nephilim RPG, and the rules seem to be working well, but Jason's approach has been very different from Mongoose's.

MRQ has put forward some pretty cool innovations (and some damn annoying changes as well), but more importantly ones that encourage good role playing rather than roll playing.(i.e Hero points)

At the end of the day, I'm going to end up using a mishmash of DBRP and MRQ when running my Glorantha games.

A co-authored/co-produced system between Chaosium and Mongoose would have been a wicked concept.

Paul

Can you give any hints about DBRP? Some clues as to how RQish it is? More like RQ than CoC/Strombringer? Anything gone? Anything added?

 

[Exubae]

Can you give any hints about DBRP

Sorry, I can't we're all under a NDA.

 

[GbajiTheDeceiver]

There's always a possibility that the RQ old guard will end up hating/disliking/meh-ing DBRP as well. What I've read in various posts and musings elsewhere from Jason indicates that it's sufficiently different from RQ to make this a likely result.

It's interesting (but of course futile) to speculate on what the situation would have been if DBRP had come out first. Would it have gotten all the flak, and would MRQ be the one that people were looking forward to now?

 

[atgxtg]

There's always a possibility that the RQ old guard will end up hating/disliking/meh-ing DBRP as well. What I've read in various posts and musings elsewhere from Jason indicates that it's sufficiently different from RQ to make this a likely result.

It's interesting (but of course futile) to speculate on what the situation would have been if DBRP had come out first. Would it have gotten all the flak, and would MRQ be the one that people were looking forward to now?

I suppose that depends on what it is like. I think a lot of the flack came from the lack of Steve Perrin or any of the other orignal RQ crew on board with the design of MRQ. Likewise DBRP doesn't seem to have much in the way of old RQ writers involved. Most of the writers from Chaosium's heyday are long gone, having left the company.

In some ways it is like another author taking over a fictional character. It just ins't the same.

 

[atgxtg]

Can you give any hints about DBRP

Sorry, I can't we're all under a NDA.

Yeah, I knew you were going to type that.

How 'bout an emoticon? Surely that must be within the NDA!

:mrgreen: :? :roll: :shock: :x :evil: :twisted:

 

[mthomason]

:idea:

 

[Rurik]

Can you give any hints about DBRP

Sorry, I can't we're all under a NDA.

Yeah, I knew you were going to type that.

How 'bout an emoticon? Surely that must be within the NDA!

:mrgreen: :? :roll: :shock: :x :evil: :twisted:

Well at least it isn't an !

 

[atgxtg]

Sorry, I can't we're all under a NDA.

Yeah, I knew you were going to type that.

How 'bout an emoticon? Surely that must be within the NDA!

:mrgreen: :? :roll: :shock: :x :evil: :twisted:

Well at least it isn't an !

Well, as far as I know, he isn't the author. Although if he does post a it will be a :shock: :!:

:wink: