The OTU - the equivalent to that 1980s TV star after decades of drug abuse

[MaxTac Transfer]

I was a casual gamer in the 1980s playing SciFi for fun when the weather was bad. Let RPG mostly laps and only recently looked back into Traveller. And the more I look into it the more it reminds me of those 1980s TV stars that fell on drugs and other problems. They are still around but they have little in common with how you remember them. And like those TV stars - one should maybe look elsewhere.

The Universe is badly designed and has been worked over by so many authors it looks more grotesque than a 1980s starlet after 20 cosmetic surgeries. And has about as much appeal. Tired old tropes that can not change like "British nobility in spaaaace" and a choice of a basic setup that makes it difficult to "Open Airlock, Space Nobel, be a better world" due to lack of an infrastructure that allows for more efficient government systems. Cold War in Space with the evil mind games playing Commi<<<Zhodanie and evil Space Nazis on the Solomani Rim. Not to mention Space Peta and other stuff that makes little sense in civilisations that often have been FTL capabel when naked guys on earth where throwing around overbacked flat bread while howling to their imaginary friends on a misty mountain top.

Add some fans that have more in common with fanatics than with people playing for fun and the setting does not get more appealing but rather more appaling.

The MgT2e game mechanics are sound, technology is useable and the star maps come in handy. Character generation - well the point buy in the Companion is a jump of point that can be developed into something useable by mature players. But the rest? That needs to be treated like Ole Yeller at the end of the movie. Time for a new puppy err universe with new ideas.

 

[Arkathan]

I buy the books for rules and ideas...
but my guys are playing in the Spinward Marches of the eighties.
Because that is what they remember. A couple of their old characters have been contacts from chargen and patrons, doing the stuff they left them doing back then - better or worse.
About the only "modern" trope I brought in for their current Sword Worlders is a disdain for cybernetics and the 1e Sworld World semi-anagathic diet. And that was because I allowed a limited minor anagathic while in service as a saving throw for aging (back when you could still die in character creation).
Other than that, it's star charts, UWP and roll some dice.

 

[Vormaerin]

Seems to be selling pretty well for something as awful as you make it out to be. And it wouldn't be if the only ones interested it in were the survivors of 70s and 80s. Especially since most of them are over on CotI with their older editions, as is true of most other long running games.
No single setting is going to satisfy everyone. But Traveller isn't a game about a single setting, for all that Charted Space is by far the most popular setting. If you don't like not having ansibles, it is easy to make games where they exist. But Charted Space will never be that setting.

As far as all your silly reduction of pretty detailed and unique cultures to their worst cliches, well, that's fine if you don't like them. But the Zhos aren't commies and the Solomani aren't nazis, Nor are the Imperial nobles the British aristocracy. And if you play them that way and don't like it, well, that's on you?

Seems like a pretty easy solution. If you don't like the OTU, don't use it. There half a dozen published sci fi settings using Traveller or Cepheus rules, plus settings for Old West and sword & sandal. Heck, there used to be rules for using Traveller to run Sanctuary, City of Thieves in the Thieves' World boxed set Large chunks of the rules are about making your own setting and always have been. That was always the original design intention.

I've used Traveller to play lots of settings of my own devising besides Charted Space. And when I play in Charted Space, it doesn't exactly match the published one. Because it is impossible for them to publish a setting that exactly suits me and my players.

 

[CordwainerFish]

 

[-Daniel-]

No single setting is going to satisfy everyone. But Traveller isn't a game about a single setting, for all that Charted Space is by far the most popular setting.

Not to imply the rest of your post is unimportant, I want to draw focus to these two lines as I love the truth in them.

No setting is for everyone, ever. Traveller was, originally back in the late 70's when I began to use the LBBs, a rules toolbox to build your own setting. Add to that, Reading the vast number of threads dedicated to arguments both here and on many other Traveller forums, I suspect most folks who claim to play the 3i/charted space are really playing a modified and changed semi-pseudo 3i/charted space. I suggest there are as many 3i versions out there as there are people claiming to play in the 3i/charted space.

Thus, I liked your two lines quoted above very much.

 

[MaxTac Transfer]

Seems to be selling pretty well for something as awful as you make it out to be. And it wouldn't be if the only ones interested it in were the survivors of 70s and 80s. Especially since most of them are over on CotI with their older editions, as is true of most other long running games.
No single setting is going to satisfy everyone. But Traveller isn't a game about a single setting, for all that Charted Space is by far the most popular setting. If you don't like not having ansibles, it is easy to make games where they exist. But Charted Space will never be that setting.

As far as all your silly reduction of pretty detailed and unique cultures to their worst cliches, well, that's fine if you don't like them. But the Zhos aren't commies and the Solomani aren't nazis, Nor are the Imperial nobles the British aristocracy. And if you play them that way and don't like it, well, that's on you?

Seems like a pretty easy solution. If you don't like the OTU, don't use it. There half a dozen published sci fi settings using Traveller or Cepheus rules, plus settings for Old West and sword & sandal. Heck, there used to be rules for using Traveller to run Sanctuary, City of Thieves in the Thieves' World boxed set Large chunks of the rules are about making your own setting and always have been. That was always the original design intention.

I've used Traveller to play lots of settings of my own devising besides Charted Space. And when I play in Charted Space, it doesn't exactly match the published one. Because it is impossible for them to publish a setting that exactly suits me and my players.

It is how those cultures feel to me. Stiff british wastes of life support, Space Commis and Amis and all the other elements that have been done to death in SciFi. Maybe deeeep down there is more "depth and detail" but that is not visible to me. So I will not even START using the setting (back than I was a player and not a GM, thankfully I guess) because so far all I see is those boring old stereotypes.

As for the other settings - 2300AD is about as interesting as real life with all the real life nations. And if I want to play non SciFi - there are better systems with their own settings for that. Be it GURPS for Fantasy or CP2020 for near future

And does Traveller really do that well? Does the OTU? At least where I am (and there is a couple million people within 50km) not one group shows up in the weekly/monthly RPG meets or the conventions.

 

[TrippyHippy]

Jeezuz. What a whine!

 

[Arkathan]

The only other system out there that I would consider using for Sci-Fi is the BattleTech rpg (first hardback set by Catalyst). Now, that works great tied to a mech merc company, but it falls short of Traveller pretty quickly if you are just some spooks or criminals trying to get by. Being an intel operative was fun, but Traveller just does some of that stuff better. Of course that was pre-muh-pronounz BT. I understand its quite a mess over there now.

 

[Vormaerin]

And does Traveller really do that well? Does the OTU? At least where I am (and there is a couple million people within 50km) not one group shows up in the weekly/monthly RPG meets or the conventions.

You'd have to ask Mongoose. They seem to be making money on it. Other companies make money on its knock off, Cepheus. Markosia was super pleased with how well the two Traveller comics sold. So I would seem to think so.

Anyway, it doesn't really matter. If it isn't the game for you, that's fine. There are literally hundreds of RPGs out there for a reason. I don't believe anyone is forcing you to play it. Or to use Charted Space if you do.

 

[MaxTac Transfer]

You'd have to ask Mongoose. They seem to be making money on it. Other companies make money on its knock off, Cepheus. Markosia was super pleased with how well the two Traveller comics sold. So I would seem to think so.

Anyway, it doesn't really matter. If it isn't the game for you, that's fine. There are literally hundreds of RPGs out there for a reason. I don't believe anyone is forcing you to play it. Or to use Charted Space if you do.

Well guess this is neither the game nor the fandom nor the forum for me. So I say bye bye to all three. Thankfully only bought PDF so the stuff is gone in a delete

 

[Sigtrygg]

I was a casual gamer in the 1980s playing SciFi for fun when the weather was bad. Let RPG mostly laps and only recently looked back into Traveller. And the more I look into it the more it reminds me of those 1980s TV stars that fell on drugs and other problems. They are still around but they have little in common with how you remember them. And like those TV stars - one should maybe look elsewhere.

There is a lot of good stuff out there for Traveller these days, sadly the convoluted, contrived, contradictory, car crash that is the current state of the Third Imperium as a setting is not the best of them.

The Universe is badly designed and has been worked over by so many authors it looks more grotesque than a 1980s starlet after 20 cosmetic surgeries. And has about as much appeal.

Good summation.

Tired old tropes that can not change like "British nobility in spaaaace"

Yanks in space is a better description...

and a choice of a basic setup that makes it difficult to "Open Airlock, Space Nobel, be a better world" due to lack of an infrastructure that allows for more efficient government systems.

Could you give an example of a more efficient government system that can rule a polity where it takes 44 weeks to send a message to your outlying colonies? You can add FTL comms but who wants to play ST;D...

Cold War in Space with the evil mind games playing Commi<<<Zhodanie and evil Space Nazis on the Solomani Rim.

Those descriptions have finally been analysed and shown to be wrong, they were unreliable narration form the Imperial a viewpoint of the original CT Alien Modules.
The current Mongoose version of the FFW has an interesting choice to make, what with the Zhodani being the good guys now and the forthcoming core expeditions book.

Not to mention Space Peta and other stuff that makes little sense in civilisations that often have been FTL capabel when naked guys on earth where throwing around overbacked flat bread while howling to their imaginary friends on a misty mountain top.

Lol, now there is an image to play with...

Add some fans that have more in common with fanatics than with people playing for fun and the setting does not get more appealing but rather more appaling.

Do you think he means me?
More seriously I have mostly run Traveller in settings of my own design, or ripped off from the authors I really like. When I do use the Third Imperium or other era I always adapt it to make sense - see my thread on the Imperium that could have been for example (shameless self plug)

The MgT2e game mechanics are sound, technology is useable and the star maps come in handy. Character generation - well the point buy in the Companion is a jump of point that can be developed into something useable by mature players. But the rest? That needs to be treated like Ole Yeller at the end of the movie. Time for a new puppy err universe with new ideas.

Ahh, so now we find out the truth...
only "immature players" like random character generation, the mature rpg elite are points buy.

Post your new ideas, would love to see what's new...

 

[Sigtrygg]

It is how those cultures feel to me. Stiff british wastes of life support,

Ladies and gentlemen, we have an anglophobe, likely French.

Space Commis and Amis and all the other elements that have been done to death in SciFi.

Amis? Amish?
And even when they were new to the Traveller sample setting the mature, intelligent, nuanced referees could read between the lines and recognise the unreliable narration and bias.

Maybe deeeep down there is more "depth and detail" but that is not visible to me.

I thought you were "mature"?

So I will not even START using the setting (back than I was a player and not a GM, thankfully I guess) because so far all I see is those boring old stereotypes.

Here's the thing. No one holds a gun to your head and says you have to use the Third Imperium, if you don't like it don't buy it. Make your own setting using just the basic system and whatever additional rules, houserules you want to. I've been doing that for over forty years.

As for the other settings - 2300AD is about as interesting as real life with all the real life nations. And if I want to play non SciFi - there are better systems with their own settings for that. Be it GURPS for Fantasy or CP2020 for near future

Oh come now, if you are going to troll us try a bit harder. GURPS for fantasy - lol.
CP2020 for near future - lol lol

And does Traveller really do that well? Does the OTU? At least where I am (and there is a couple million people within 50km) not one group shows up in the weekly/monthly RPG meets or the conventions.

Traveller will do what the referee and group want it to. No more, no less.

Interesting way to introduce yourself to a community. I do agree with you on a few points but...

 

[Sigtrygg]

Well guess this is neither the game nor the fandom nor the forum for me. So I say bye bye to all three. Thankfully only bought PDF so the stuff is gone in a delete

Perhaps if you took a slightly less confrontational tone?

More seriously you do raise what a lot of us have said for years, and you should see the early criticism of what Mongoose did to Traveller

I would say you are spot on with your appraisal of the Third Imperium - the setting is now a mess and has been for a long time.
But it is possible to use most of it if you want to run a Third Imperium set game.

The Mongoose core rule book, plus the Companion, plus High Guard give you plenty of rules to change the Third Imperium to your liking or - better yet in my opinion - make your own setting.

I also think too much Mongoose material is for the Third Imperium, I would like to see more generic supplements and adventures, but it is easy enough to rid most supplements and adventures of Third Imperium references and re-purpose.

I also find myself disagreeing with the modern authors on some of their interpretations of the setting - but they are getting stuff published and I am but a grumpy old grognard.

 

[ottarrus]

To the OP:
Absolutely nothing prohibits you from picking a sector on the galaxy map and starting your own MTU over there. It's work, but it literally solves ALL your issues with the OTU. Traveller doesn't have to change for you. You have to take the Traveller mechanics and adapt them to a milieu more to your liking.
Me, I like the OTU, but I have ideas on what I would include if I were to set up a sector in 'Here Be Dragons' territory too. I think we all do to one degree or another.
I know, for example, that I'd want my aliens to REALLY 'alien'. No 'fuzzy suit' aliens [Vargr /Aslan], no joke aliens [the K'Kree, aka 'cows with guns'], no almost Humans [Klingons, etc.]. I'd want my alien enemy races to be implaccable [the Käfer from 2300, the Reapers from ME], inscrutable [GDW's Hivers and Pentapods, the Overlords from Childhood's End], and terrifying [Aliens' Xenomorphs with a guiding civilization behind them]. The one thing extraterrestrials would not be is humanoid with five fingers and toes.
But all this is totally under your control. All you have to do is generate 250+ worlds, inhabit them with beings and animals, design the technologies, and write up the politics. And assemble all this in a way that's easy for new players to understand. Simple.
Take control of your dissatisfaction and put together something that meets your needs. I'm probably not the only one who'd be interested in reading what you come up with.

 

[MasterGwydion]

I run games in Charted Space, but it is definitely not the OTU. lol. I made some changes in the historical timeline and therefore MTU has some significant deviations from published materials.

 

[Condottiere]

You could regard it as fast food franchises.

You can eat home cooked meals, order in, or go out.

Compare the competition.

Buy the stuff you're in the mood for.

 

[Grognardia]

Well guess this is neither the game nor the fandom nor the forum for me. So I say bye bye to all three. Thankfully only bought PDF so the stuff is gone in a delete

Don't let the door hit your ass on the way out.

 

[Arkathan]

Well guess this is neither the game nor the fandom nor the forum for me. So I say bye bye to all three. Thankfully only bought PDF so the stuff is gone in a delete

Actually, not gone. It is still in your library from whichever site you bought it from. To truly delete the PDF, you have to nuke your account on that website.
Meaning, you can download it again after the rage-quit fit wears off

 

[MaxTac Transfer]

Actually, not gone. It is still in your library from whichever site you bought it from. To truly delete the PDF, you have to nuke your account on that website.
Meaning, you can download it again after the rage-quit fit wears off

That is actually VERY easy. The platform has a "Delete Account" element (unlike this ome, sadly)

 

[Lurking Grue]

The OP had to be trolling. Or drunk posting. Probably both. Sheesh!