Are we done with the "update" books?
- Thread starter apastuszak
- Start date
Terry Mixon
Emperor Mongoose
Agreed. Keep doing what you’re doing.
Still way too much they can do for the third imperium setting. We have the Rebellion (Which many of us are wanting to get the FFW treatment) TNE and Galaxiad to flush out.
Other settings require vastly more development and possibly licensing which is probably not in their best interest right now. They’ve also giving the players plenty of tools for creating their own settings (World Builders Handbook, sector construction box set, alternative rules in various other books).
I’m going to laugh now because this is just Funny. Playtest. Lol. I was part of the 5ed playtest and the final game throw out the playtest. The 5ed library by Wizards is as big or bigger than the MgT2 line and only half or less the quality. They literally have rewritten numerous books
No one is asking for them to stop making Third Imperium content.
But some of us are asking for them to stop mixing up the RULES and the SETTING.
The Core Rules (Rulebook, High Guard, Robots, Vehicle Book, Central Supply Catalogue) should be as setting neutral as much as possible. They are the Traveller Rules, not the Charted Space rules.
ESPECIALLY now when 2300 runs on them. Mindjammer has a version that runs on them. Pioneer will run on them.
It's a good thing when the RULES have stuff like personal energy shields, warp drives, and sentient robots. Or when they dive into deep space exploration. But not all that stuff fits into Charted Space. But it might fit into a setting you build yourself.
Write the rulebook as if the DM is homebrewing. Sell them Charted Space so they don't have to.
Sigtrygg
Emperor Mongoose
Like re-write the Fifth Frontier War? I already know what happened in the official timeline. I am looking forward to seeing ith they make good on the promise that the outcome of this version is not set in tablets of stone. But therein lies the issue. They can not pick an outcome to develop the setting any further without invalidating that commitment.
The rebellion that does not happen because now the Zhodani won the FFW the Imperium rallies behind Strephon, or the rebellion because the Zhodani won and Strephon is deposed as a result.
Or the events of the FFW are ignored and the rebellion setting becomes an alternative start point.
I would actually like to see the rebellion done properly, PC scale involvement from the assassin's planning all the way to the collapse at the end of hard times (with or without the release of Virus).
I like TNE, I think it had a lot of potential, but again it requires a new start point because the events preceding are now in chaotic individual referee flux.
I only hope Marc has shared his Galaxiad notes so the T5 kickstarter promise is kept some day. Not sure if I will live to see it though.
"various other books" - so to get all the rules I have to buy all the books.
How about there are a set of generic rule books with all the systems and option, and then setting books to accompany them.
Here is the kicker - the authors have to use the rules as written.
As to settings there are currently two, with a third on the way, and a few third party settings.
You make good points though.
It’s been tried for many games the most famous one Traveller wise is T5 it failed. The average gamer doesn’t Want that especially for a specific system like Traveller. If you look at 5ed the rules are set up for Forgotten Realms with other settings having rules and modifications for their specific setting in the setting book. Basically MgT2 does the same thing that way the vast majority don’t have to wade thru rules not a part of the core setting. While I understand you and a minority of GMs create their own setting or vastly modify the third imperium it’s just that a minority.
Condottiere
Emperor Mongoose
Complexity can be tolerated, if it's user friendly.
nats
Banded Mongoose
T5 failed because it was an obvious mess in the making. Anyone with a head on their shoulders could see that. Some people bought it anyway. I did not. I love Traveller but I wont buy low quality publications however well intentioned they are.
I dont think Mongoose is working, theres a lot of backlash about the lack of quality and care. They are on a losing spiral they just cant see it yet imo. What they are doing is just not sustainable. People get fed up. When you buy one crap product you don't buy more. They arent cheap. You start looking very carefully at future products. I've sold the majority of my books and I wont buy anything else now, unless highly recommended by people I know. I just want to see Traveller flourish but atm I am not seeing it. We have a wealth of books available now on every subject but I don't see anything I want to buy because I just cannot trust the product.
But anyway I've said my piece. I will still have eyes on future releases, but for the moment I think I am done with Mongoose Traveller.
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True but there’s both a limit and the caveat “if it’s user friendly” the current system already pushes that in some cases.
I would say both Marc and their numbers must disagree with you. There are obviously signs when it’s not working and Mongoose is not showing any of them. And that’s my informed opinion bases on my business degree and real life business experience
Condottiere
Emperor Mongoose
I love tinkering around with High Guard, but presented with Tee/Five, my first reaction was, and remains, where do I start?
agentwigggles
Cosmic Mongoose
Oh, so on Page 12, there a D66 chart you can roll on. The DM for it are on page 43 in a side bar.
I don't know about sales numbers for T5. I was a kickstarter backer and had great hope for T5. I was terribly disappointed with buying it sight unseen, and my hope was dashed by a terrible reality. Personally I felt I got gipped and would have happily returned it if I could for a full refund. Alas I'm stuck with it and it sits on a shelf with the rest of the Traveller collection.
MGT has had its doubts with me as well. When I bought the first v1 books and ran into the terrible editing with Mercenary (remember it's printing errors?) I almost dropped MGT as a publisher. However MGT stood up and acknowledged their mistakes and made it right. While I've had questions about some of the content & editing, they've convinced me that (so far at least) they are trying to work to do the right thing.
One of the reasons for Traveller sales is the old-guard and their continual support for the product. I have little time these days to play, but far more $$ to support the larger and smaller publishers - so I do. I won't buy crap just to support, but I'm generally more willing to give the benefit of the doubt because I can afford to do so. How many net-new players come to the game is anyone's guess. I see the kickstarters coming across my feed for many older game systems (Traveller, D&D, Mechwarrior, Renegade Legion, even Robotech). They seem to be doing well enough to continue working that way. The fact that a lot are going the kickstarter route with up-front sales rather than publishing-and-praying for sales indicates, somewhat at least, a possible weakness in the overall industry and the need to greatly lessen costs and risks in order to stay in business.
Without hard data its all idle speculation. Whether or not Miller could do a T6 kickstarter and find the same level of success is the bigger question, and one that will most likely never be answered definitely.
Actually Renegade Legion hasn’t had a Kickstarter and both the Robotech KS are for licensed companies and have nothing to do with the palladium version.
there’s literally been no suggestions of a T6 so I don’t know were that came from.
If you know what you’re looking for (which I do) you can tell if a publisher is in trouble. As for new players while I can give you a number my guess would be somewhere between a third to half of the current player base.
Okay, it's my first post and I am brand new to Traveller, my introduction was at Reapercon in September. I found an ancient copy of 1st Edition and have picked up the 2022 Core Rulebook. Looking forward to actually finding a group around here. I have just read this entire thread, so please bear with some observations from someone who has been gaming for 40+ years.
I have been with Battletech since it's beginning and one of it's best points is that the basic rules from 40 years ago are still usable. I will never use GW again because of their constant updating and making units unavailable or obsolete to force the purchase of new books. So writers and publishers should realize that there is a difference in correcting typos or contradictions is FAR different from making books that folks have spent hard earned money on obsolete for no good reason except to sell new merchandise.
Second, playtest your new stuff, then test it again. I have been a tester for new rules for Battletech and was a Betatester for MWDA and Heroclix. Use the experience of your long-time players and GMs.
I have been with Battletech since it's beginning and one of it's best points is that the basic rules from 40 years ago are still usable. I will never use GW again because of their constant updating and making units unavailable or obsolete to force the purchase of new books. So writers and publishers should realize that there is a difference in correcting typos or contradictions is FAR different from making books that folks have spent hard earned money on obsolete for no good reason except to sell new merchandise.
Second, playtest your new stuff, then test it again. I have been a tester for new rules for Battletech and was a Betatester for MWDA and Heroclix. Use the experience of your long-time players and GMs.
Well, good news. Essentially nothing from Classic Traveller is obsolete because of Mongoose Traveller. Might need some tweaks because of minor changes in the rules (mostly around different consolidations of the skills), but the lore is functionally the same. Pretty much everything from Traveller 4 is lore compatible, too. Mechanics are a bit different, but not so crazy you couldn't adapt them pretty easy. MegaTraveller is "in the future" relative to Mongoose Traveller, but most of its lore is still good other than specifics of future history. Traveller: New Era is best thought of as a completely different game. There's little in the way of mechanics or lore that is directly useful with the rest of the product line.
GURPS Traveller is an alternate history, but still has quite a lot of largely compatible world building. T20 Traveller is, like Traveller 4, 'in the past', but its not incompatible. Hero Traveller didn't release much that isn't mechanics heavy so that's probably not that useful to pick up.
GURPS Traveller is an alternate history, but still has quite a lot of largely compatible world building. T20 Traveller is, like Traveller 4, 'in the past', but its not incompatible. Hero Traveller didn't release much that isn't mechanics heavy so that's probably not that useful to pick up.
FASA rebooted RL with Aetherstream back in 2021. Since then they've done Interceptor and Leviathan via Kickstarter.
The T6 comment was speculatory on the potential success (or failure) if he attempted to redo it again based up the commentary from T5.
Actually it’s not while it does have the interceptor name and the other has the Leviathan name they have nothing to do with the original IP. FASA even stated this Different setting Different game mechanics. They only used the name to deny Bungee smuggler games from doing the same. The Original IP is still lost in Topps parent company. Unfortunately you don’t know what’s going on with RL I am sorry you’ve been misinformed.
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Yet catalyst game labs never playtest Shadowrun and have some of the worse editing in the industry.
