whitestars

[katadder]

looking at whitestars now i have to wonder why everyone complained about them before, they do seem a bit poor for a raid ship, less than half the damage of most peoples and i know they have AA and SR but AA is only helpful against the big hits, lots of small weapons will see it going down quickly. an as for its main weapon, 1 AD? ask any narn player why they take ka'tans over ka'tocs even dodge is now down to 50% and go up against EA and see how many shots you get through interceptors with your molecular pulsars esepcially now they down to 4AD, i had a hard enough time taking a ship down with 5 and generally only got one hit per turn with my laser.

think LBH knows what i talking about after playing him at last tourney where he couldnt hit me with his 1AD neutron lasers and my dargan was taking on and beating 2 whitestars plus attendant fighters without his own fighters. they dont really match upto any other raid ship except maybe the vorlons/shadows. the drakh heavy raiders are about the closest i see in capability and they are skirmish.

what was the original whitestar like, pre revised edition?

 

[Greg Smith]

The original Whitestar was:

speed 15, 2/90
Hull 5, damage 12/4, crew 8/2
1 nial, Adaptive armour, AJP, dodge 5+, flight computer, self repair (1d6)

Neutron laser: 15 F 1 AD, beam, double damage, Precise, super AP
Pulsars: 8 F 4AD AP double damage

It was vulnerable to fighters (no AF weapons) annd the original adaptive armour only stopped damage, not crew hits.

It was quickly revised (before SFoS) because there was a galaxy full of de-crewed Whitestars, to crew 12/3 with the adaptive armour now protecting crews. The pulsar range was increased to 10 and self-repair dropped to 1 point.

This revised one wasn't bad - I came second in the first Mongoose tournament with these.

You have to remember that speed and manouverability are the Whitestar's biggest weapons. Playing LBH isn't a good example of how to use them best.

 

[Voronesh]

I guess you mean SFOS. And not actually pre-SFOS,

Far too good.

I have it seen them rip a 4 Chronos extra fighters fleet apart without a single loss. And Chronos Interceptors remove alot of fire, still they didnt stand a chance. I have seen 6 of them stare down 3 Tinashis and 2 Sharlins with a single loss, with only minimal fire directed toward the G'Quans far away.

You could beat them yes, but that took Prefects........and lots of CAF on the closing first 2 turns.

I have seen 5 of them fail to destroy 2 Novas within 2.5 turns of fire.

I have seen them let loose the dogs of war with 4 hits out of the 1 AD Beam. Byebye Chronos.

They were beatable, but then everthing is with a bit of luck. (Seen a Raid lvl ship take down a Battle lvl one alone? 6-6 crit all the way, and stuff like that) But generally, White Stars are not that good at dishing out damage, but the dont want to die quickly and the masses of Precise weapons 6AD total? One of those beam, insured the enemy had problems either way. Either crippled by crits or just removed from the board straight away. While the Dodge of 3+ meant, they received only a third of the crits that other ships would receive.


Final Opinion:
Too good. Havent seen them do damage like hell, but they just wont die like other raid ships.

12 Damage, from crew. (2 turns of self repair is all that is needed.)
AA boosts that to 24
Dodge 3+ gives you 72. At hull 5.
The T'Loth has 60 and is ALOT less maneuverable.

 

[Greg Smith]

I guess you mean SFOS. And not actually pre-SFOS,

There was a revised White Star available as a pdf before SFoS was published. This was also printed in one of the Rules Supplements

The intent before SFoS was that the ISA was a fleet to be used by people who had a bit of experience and expertise with the game. When SFoS came along, the intention was to make the ISA suitable for beginners and experts alike and so the SFoS became a lot better (gaining 3+ dodge, triple damage laser, anti-fighter & precise on the pulsars).

The tournament version was a better balanced one.

The White Star's fifth incarnation is the one brought about by the changes in Armageddon.

 

[Voronesh]

thx. for clearing that up.

But isnt the armageddong White star the one form the tourney? Just to make sure.....

 

[Greg Smith]

No it is slightly different.

 

[Voronesh]

How is that?

Unless its too much of a stat to be posted......

 

[katadder]

AA does not give you the equivalent of 20 damage as one hit will still caause one damage, take 10 hits from 10 seperate weapons and yuo're dead. the dodge 4+ does help obviously so that takes it upto a 15 damage ship, maybe 20 with all combined.
it now has only 4 AD on the molecular pulsars and they are no longer precise, whilst it is a good ship i really dont think its as capable as other believe.

 

[Greg Smith]

The Armageddon White Star is the SFoS White Star, with dodge 4+, 4AD and no Precisce on the Pulsars. So it has less damage but more laser range than the tourney one.

 

[Triggy]

AA does not give you the equivalent of 20 damage as one hit will still caause one damage, take 10 hits from 10 seperate weapons and yuo're dead. the dodge 4+ does help obviously so that takes it upto a 15 damage ship, maybe 20 with all combined.
it now has only 4 AD on the molecular pulsars and they are no longer precise, whilst it is a good ship i really dont think its as capable as other believe.

Your point about small weapons hitting it and being more effective (due to AA minimum of one point of damage) is valid but of course the big weapons are reduced in effectiveness too (due to rounding down with AA). In my experience these tend to even each other out.

As has been said, manoevrability is key with White Stars, that and not relying on any single round of shooting doing the business - they don't have fantastic weapons but they are the most survivable Raid level ship in the game and that's not mentioning their ability to avoid enemy fire by staying out of arc. Combining the two, the tourney/Armageddon WS is pretty much comparable with every other Raid level ship out there for potential.

 

[lastbesthope]

Playing LBH isn't a good example of how to use them best.

Too true,

I have the pre SFOS, SFOS and tourney WS stats on the different versions of my Shipviewer, linked below in my sig.

I don't have the original stats, but IIRC they are as Greg said above.

LBH