Traveller technology...is it current?

[MrHemlocks]

Hello

Does Mongoose Traveller still use technology ideas that the original 1970s game had about the future or is it modernized? Let's face it back in the 70s the designers had no idea as to what the world would look like now let alone in the far future.

 

[Nathan Brazil]

Hi. I see that you have at this time few postings on this board, but you aware of Traveller's origins.
So we can all be on working from the same starting point in this discussion, what version of Traveller do you have experience with?
That way we all can go with "well this is still klunky and hasn't changed, but this has changed".

 

[F33D]

Hello

Does Mongoose Traveller still use technology ideas that the original 1970s game had about the future or is it modernized? Let's face it back in the 70s the designers had no idea as to what the world would look like now let alone in the far future.

Computers have moved forward. Pretty much everything else is similar to the 70's editions but more details.

 

[rust]

Does Mongoose Traveller still use technology ideas that the original 1970s game had about the future or is it modernized?

It is basically still the technology of Classic Traveller, although there
have been some minor changes in a couple of technologies. Overall
Mongoose Traveller feels a little "retro" compared to more modern
science fiction games, but not to the point that it could be called a
steampunk game.

 

[Nathan Brazil]

As an example from Classic Traveller to Mongoose Traveller. Is everything we currently use in the rules? My opinion is no.
Have there been changes to reflect our current knowledge and tech since that time? Yes there has been progress.
My views:

Computers: Yes, there are better examples reflecting the real world now in the equipment list as everything gets smaller and lighter to use. More powerful computational abilities make for larger computers, but as tech increases the game now reflects better that things get smaller and more efficient. As far as what you can do with them and software, I am optimistic that things like the Computer Rating and Software Ratings reflect a higher order of computation and complexity. As an example people might argue that Library Data software should just be a given and take up no space at all. I look at it that the size and complexity Library Data represents ALL our current Internet (databases, web pages and all) in one self contained software package.

Spacecraft: Yes, there are fission reactors, reaction thrusters and fuel to reflect our current tech. Does it reflect actual efficiency? I don't know, not trained in that area, but I know that the real world has these things at some level.

Planets and UPP: A nod has been made to reflect the advanced real world knowledge of astronomy via "Hard Science World Creation", but the default rules don't get into generating three dimensional star maps, brown dwarfs and the like.
For this in-between versions of Traveller had more detailed information. And at that time details reflected more advanced or then recent knowledge.

 

[Nathan Brazil]

Traveller's practical futuristic tech (equipment lists and such) reflect the stuff you need to do stories and tropes it is focussed on. Those tropes are based on the "Imperial Space" trope from the 1970's and before in fiction. In some cases the science may be off entirely, but tells its story well enough. Some games better reflect some tropes than others and thus have "better" equipment lists and rules to reflect. Mongoose has included some newer actual science, but not all. In one sense it does not need to because it does it's tropes well.

An example of this would be like melee weapons. A game that does not concern itself about intricacy of melee weapons and melee combat would just have an equipment entry "Melee Weapon - 1D damage" to reflect each and every hand-to-hand weapon in it's game.

But waitaminute that's not realistic! What about Daggers, Swords, Axes, Polearms, etc. A game that wants to tell more detail and entertain have more details for each type of melee weapon.

But waitaminute that's not realistic! What about styles of attack. A more detailed game might have rules about the "Sabatini Defense Mode" for a curved Kopesh sword reflecting -2 Attack, +3 Defense and -1 on damage as opposed to "Salamanca Attack Mode" for a curved Kopesh sword reflecting -3 Attack, -2 Defense and +2D6 Damage"

 

[CosmicGamer]

technology ideas that the original 1970s game

Some of this comes down to the general game style.

1) At first, lets examine technology related game mechanics and ideals and not technological science details.

We are still cave men.
The general feel of the game has not changed. Technology advances. Thousands of years of society advances and learning from its mistakes have occurred. Emperors and nobles rule. We are still neanderthals that act on base instincts. Lots of stress on combat and violence. No change in this philosophy in the Mongoose release.

Ships still need crews.
People are still needed to push buttons, pull levers or just talk to the computer and tell it what to do. With the Mongoose release there are some technologies which seam like they would have capability exceeding the average meat bags capabilities. Autodocs to replace medics. Servitor bots to replace stewards. Combat Drones to replace security personnel. Repair Robots to replace engineers. "The number of crew on a ship varies depending on its level of automation and complexity" But no details are given to describe how automation, computers, and robotics could alter the crew requirements. The general concept is still that real people, the players characters, are needed to operate the ships.

2) Chapter tech breakdown.
CHARACTER CREATION
Still a good portion of skills that are low or non technical. Gambling, Streetwise, Admin,
Skills gained are still tech level independent. See more below in the skills chapter.
Mongoose does incorporate a home world in character generation. High tech worlds and low tech worlds provide a unique background skill. However whether a character comes from a high tech or low tech world makes no difference in what careers or specialties they have access to. Technology does not effect a characters ability to learn more technological skills like Engineering, Astrogation, Robotics and so on.

The chargen changes in Mongoose are more about starting the role playing experience off and have little to do with changes in technology.

SKILLS AND TASKS
Lots of new technological skills are available.
Skills are still tech level independent. Mechanic can work on a steamboat or an airlock. Gun combat (Slug Pistol) skill can be a TL3 antique pistol or a TL 13 Gauss Pistol. Engineer (Jump) is good for TL10 Jump one drives and TL15 Jump 6 drives.

......
Sorry, out of time. I gotta go.

Overall, technology changed little in regards to general game style and I believe the areas most needing an "update" between the '70s vers and Mongooses version were updated. Specifically equipment and some ship design (mostly computers).

 

[Nathan Brazil]

As an addition to CosmicGamer's excellent explanation.

For those who feel that TL dependence is needed (I am in that category), Book 6: Scoundrel has some rules if one desires to add them. Basically, TL categories listed in the Core Rules p.4 (Primitive, Industrial, Pre-Stellar, etc.) are used to determine if a character can make use of higher or lower tech. If the item's TL category is not the same as yours, you may suffer some penalties with regards to using said item or maybe you cant use it at all. Supplement 4: Central Supply Catalog has a different and more detailed system to simulate this as well.

 

[Infojunky]

Does Mongoose Traveller still use technology ideas that the original 1970s game had about the future or is it modernized? Let's face it back in the 70s the designers had no idea as to what the world would look like now let alone in the far future.

That is a hard question to answer, to me Traveller has always been current as much as a bunch of English majors can represent it.

Mongoose has a great flair for character creation and task system unification, that is generic enough to represent "modern" sf-characters.

As for their representation of even current tech... sigh... Sometimes they get it... Mostly in working and rules details they come close, but often the flavor text shows that they haven't a clue the thing they are writing about. But, I can't really hold that against them illiteracy of science and technical matters is pretty much the norm in the general populace. (Note I have worked as a Science instructor at the college level, and was always surprised at the low level of basic science education my students entered with). But still the authors of Mongoose's edition of Traveller have done a way better job than say Star Frontiers and several other semi-popular SF themed RPGs whose specific names allude me at the moment.

The biggest thing to remember is that Traveller was written from a base of literary Science Fiction which is rather different than what is portrayed in Mass-Media Science Fiction.

 

[dragoner]

Hello

Does Mongoose Traveller still use technology ideas that the original 1970s game had about the future or is it modernized? Let's face it back in the 70s the designers had no idea as to what the world would look like now let alone in the far future.

Considering technology is really just a marketing buzzword, sure it is current. IME it is better to let people sit there in their wrongness rather than to correct them when talking about gameisms such as TL's versus real world systems; you don't ever win.

 

[phavoc]

While the tech talks about lasers and jump drives and other mythological (to us anyway) gear, it also glosses over some other things. Like where is the point defense missile and beam weapons? The vehicle books talk about point defense lasers, so where are the laser clusters and gatling lasers for ships? Surely something we have today at TL7-8 can be replicated in the near future?

And why are there only two sizes of missiles? Where's the nano-flavored bourbon?? Where's DATA??? (Star Trek Data... not like information data..)

So yeah...there's still some holes in the tech that's presented. There are plenty of others.

 

[Epicenter]

It's been somewhat modernized, but Third Imperium universe Mongoose Trav essentially wants to stay pretty close to the original Traveller for various reasons.

If you're looking for a Traveller that is more based upon current technology extrapolated into the future, try 2300.

Let's face it back in the 70s the designers had no idea as to what the world would look like now let alone in the far future.

Just as an observation: In 2013, we have no idea as to what the world will look like in the far future of 5600. Our best guesses aren't significantly better than the original writers in the 1970s when it's a gap of 3600 years.

 

[alex_greene]

It's been somewhat modernized, but Third Imperium universe Mongoose Trav essentially wants to stay pretty close to the original Traveller for various reasons.

If you're looking for a Traveller that is more based upon current technology extrapolated into the future, try 2300.

Let's face it back in the 70s the designers had no idea as to what the world would look like now let alone in the far future.

Just as an observation: In 2013, we have no idea as to what the world will look like in the far future of 5600. Our best guesses aren't significantly better than the original writers in the 1970s when it's a gap of 3600 years.

Unless we approach it from an Olaf Stapledon Last and First Men approach, and assume that the era of the year 5600 approaches the end of the last epoch in which human beings are relatable to us. A few hundred or thousand years beyond this point, and upload tech has advanced to the point where organic humans no longer exist, or some such evolutionary crisis.