Show the Type 99 some love

Mr Evil

Mongoose
ok im sorta feeling the type 99 needs some love here

Type_99_1.jpg


with it being slightly over costed in points or underpowered considering its main gun is possably better than the M1A2's from some reports, rules wise it has been shown little love.

so here we are what advise can we share on how to make the most of this tank.
 
On a serious note I couldn't agree more as you can see from my sig I have little repect for them at the moment. To me they are overpriced and severly lack firepower. Compared to the Challegener and the Abrams the tank is inferior although I'm not sure how realistic that is.

Maybe lowering the price of the Type 99 by 50pts might make it worth thinking about.
 
this is an overala thing with the pla though

for example the pla squad.

normal section comanders are costing zero or an extra 10 points, but for pla its 20 points and he doesnt evan have armour, or the fist system. if the pla guys had armour or fist then they would be worth the points just... i i do mean just in the loosest terms.

split the squad into fire teams and they become inefective, keep them as one unit and the mix of weapons doesnt work, the only good value bit in the unit is the machine gun section, that work out as 30 points ie the cost of the leader alone !!!!!!

lets put them at 10 points each thats 100 points wich means the extra 90 points is between squad leader and the 2 launchers, that are 60 points a section so from that the launcher is worth 3o points, so 2 launcher sections and 1 gun section comes to 150 points that means the squad leader comes in at a woping 40 points !!!!!!

is the squad leader realy worth 40 points ? 20 points maybe or 25 points just to represent first squad always costs a little extra.

that would make the squads cost 170-175 points wich to be hinest makes them worth while taking and reasonable value when you consider they got one more man that the usmc no armour and no fist like sytem. and their fire teams sizes are so small there prone to never shooting due to supression alone.

the type 99 has been placed at by some as 100 points over value, id say more around 50-75 points, probably 50 points overvalued and in need of a +1 to its gun to represent its rifled barrel and depleted uranium shells it packs, it also uses a few types of warheads that bypass modern armour that is made to protect against modern munitions and light shells of old fashioned conventional tanks.

the APc again over valued slightly id say stats feel about right but its cost is a little high id place it around 120-140 points rather than 150

in reflection id say the shadow is worth about 90 points overal or the ckem is over powered.

ive now gone to using the yanks as i like a good game being the underdog is fine but as games get bigger then the problem for the pla gets bigger, ok future units may help but 6k of pla of wave 1 and 2 should be just as viable as 6k of pla waves 1-6 included. as thats why we have points values.

not sure who the playtesting team were but it feels they showed the pla very few games, or interest.

i was going to collect pla big time, but im resorted now to have them as a 4th dragin army as nobody whats to use them as they just are not worth their points values.

serously mongoose, ive had another 3 games this week trying to sort them out, and they are definatly over valued.

please put somthing in the main rules to allow some sort of buy one get a 2nd half or 25%0ff in points to evan things out.
 
I think they aren't too bad, although the main gun should have a little more power....

In games we have had the PLA infantry has held up well against the USMC, although as the PLA player you have to find a way around the range disadvantage.

My biggest quibble is with the Shadows, as they can be devasting, mind you I have also seen them taken out by the PLA and EFTF before they have been able to do anything usefull..... So my complaint is more about dice hatred really :evil:
 
the range isnt evan factored into the points value of the pla it seems though. stay farenough away and you can shoot them with no retaliation fire being able to hit you back.
 
My main issue with the PLA is similar to Mr. Evils. My surprise is the fact that the PLA squad, while having an LAW capability, don't have enough men. The largest infantry squads that are fielded are not the MEA, they are not the PLA but the USMC. For 345 points you have a squad of 17.

For 380pts you can field 2 squads of PLA and although they have a ridiculous amount of LAWs, range and lack of armour seriously hamper their ability to operate effectively.

How does a wave humanity army end up looking like low tide compared to the advanced and well equipped USMC (who can use shadows and numbers to overwhelm them)?

I'd seriously consider dropping the price of PLA squads by 50 points at least or adding another MG team to the mix. Either that or provide them with additional options. The major problem though is that Mongoose needs to reflect what actually happens in the PLA's army and they need to actually try and make the army a financially viable option. The question is how are these two things reconcileable? How do you create an army that is like the IG but aren't as expensive?
 
or take a usmc squad drop a team and add a shadow.

or have a squad of pla ?

the second option is open to an idiot and a bafoon.

the pla arnt realy viable for their points, its like exspecting british with blue helmet to be 170 poinst and exspectiong brits with red helmets being 240 points, although the red helmets are different in looks only your not gonna want to use the red over blue in a game or a tournament.

ive realy taken what mat said about them being more flexable and i have to say for 40 points that flexablility will never pay for itself, infact the flexability is the units weekness. and should make them cheaper, not more exspensive.

lack of armour, comand range and other fist bonus bits should at least make a brit squad equal in points to a pla squad.

pla squad based on a mea unit cost would be 75 plus the rpg = 25 = the 30 points for the mg section = 130 points thats still 10 men !!!

so how the hell did they manage to become 190 points ???? thats 60 points out .. ok so you can have fire teams so were say 10 points per aditional fore team to be generouse to mongoose, thats still only 150 points !

so are we saying that the law is 20 point more value than the RPG ? if i had th choice id rather pay the 20 points extra for the rpg than the law so id say from efect its probably worth less points as range is more important than damage so again being generouse to mgp we shall say the law is 5 points better than the RPG so we now get to a points value of 160

160 points id accept that, 190 still got another 30 points to find ?

the pla squad id say is worth 150 points and would see them gettin used.

there comand range is 6" not 12" unlike the brits, they dont get any of the fist bounses, and the law is over many games less effective than the RPG as range has more effect than damage at killing tanks when cover is around.

160 points would allow the yarn about the law being better than the rpg.

and the yarn about adaptability of the uni is already been taken care of with a 20 points costing above.

pla on the table and on the card are not worth their points.

if they had armour and fist then they would be worth them 190 points but they dont.
 
Mr Evil said:
ok im sorta feeling the type 99 needs some love here
Well, it gets all the SABOT love it can handle. MMm... Type 99s burn well.

As for "reports of its gun being better than the M1's", well.... I believe this is a fair representation of the Type 99's capabilities.

Additionally, in the next few years what's the production rate one vechiles for the Chinese military? From my understanding the only Type 99s in service are all going to the Army near Beijing... so the increased points costs are fairly accurate.
 
the point is points costs should represent its use on the games table

the type 99 needs to go up in gun power to reflect real world and its points cost, or come down in points that represent its game ability.

has nothing to do with being chineese at all, the only china conection is that the points balance for the chinees in the game are unrealistic in comparison to other equipment, its like the person who playtested them wanted the chinees or exspected them to loose every game.

has nothing to do with were better than you hiro, its about points value and game ballance.
 
lol

interesting thing is if you look close there are only 13 taks in the pic !

isnt 13 an unlucky number in chineese ?

or is it 8 ?

im currently watchin a program at the moment on helicopers the blackhawk has had more loss of life from trying to lift stuff than from combat !!!

after open day if wave 3 is by some miracle available im gonna get a 8k game on to test the pla in after, i also think the pla need there troop transport copter as it would be able to carry 3 full squads apparently !!!
 
Mr Evil said:
lol

interesting thing is if you look close there are only 13 taks in the pic !

isnt 13 an unlucky number in chineese ?

or is it 8 ?

im currently watchin a program at the moment on helicopers the blackhawk has had more loss of life from trying to lift stuff than from combat !!!

after open day if wave 3 is by some miracle available im gonna get a 8k game on to test the pla in after, i also think the pla need there troop transport copter as it would be able to carry 3 full squads apparently !!!

I'd be happy to sell them some Blackhawks, if that would help, heh. :wink:
 
Hiromoon said:
Would you want to put three squads on one helicopter though? Nothing like an awsome target for Air Defense... :D

if the points value on the pla get corrected then yes, i would, the risk would be worth the gain if it worked :D plus id use attack copters to attack the air defence systems first befor sending in the MIL's
 
Hiro, I'm not quite sure I understand the logic behind the PLA's points cost still could you please explain in again?
I really want to know why they seem to be so expensive I'm just not sure how the answer that they are flexible and close to Beijing works.

Thanks that would be much appreciated.
 
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