Pirates of Drinax - GMs thread
- Thread starter Sven2300
- Start date
Old School
Mongoose
That's pretty funny. Makes the name even better. I wonder if the same word being used was intentional or inadvertent. Probably the latter. I still like it.
Old School
Mongoose
We hashed a few things over email to better avoid wasting time on logistics when we next get together. The salvage claim is amended to be a joint claim between the Navy and the Mendina for the two vessels, since the salvage hauler is a actually a Jump-2 ship my travellers would want to keep. Both ships will remain docked at Exe until the claim makes it way to the nearest Naval base (Imisaa) and back. I'm planning to rule that both ships are immediately identified as stolen vessels, so they will be returned to their owners with a 25% of value reward to the claimants for recovery. As both ships are already in the registry as stolen, and because you get expedited treatment at the Admiralty Court (which is run by the Navy) when the Navy is your co-claimant, this will only take as long as the message to get to Imisaa and back.
My travellers need crew members, so that was their next action item. So, in order to move things along a bit. . .The Martin II suffers the jump failure as described in the adventure, and is stuck at Exe for two weeks waiting on its escort to return. Torsa swallows his pride and hires the Travellers and their pocket warship as protection for those two weeks. In return for a bargain price (MCr 1mm per week) for such a large escort, Torsa agrees to release Willie from her service when they are ready to depart since his replacement crew should be passing through Exe within two weeks anyway). O'Leary and Ilin get in enough trouble to have Torsa ship them home, and the travellers agree to take them their first jump along the way - but course they just hire them as crew instead.
Henshaw is declared unfit for duty as she indicates that Salvesdes threatened her daughter. She claims she didn't come clean earlier because she was afraid she would be under suspicion, but she's too worried about her daughter not to say anything now. Because Torsa doesn't trust her now anyway, our travellers gladly agree to help ship her back to Imperial space as well, which of course they don't do. Torsa does immediately send a secure message via the first ship passing through back to the Navy to see to the safekeeping of the daughter. Between the xboat network and the normal movement of Navy ships, the message will almost certainly get to Cyan before the remaining pirate gang (if any) can get there. So we've gained three crew members to help them out. None of them are ideal, but a group of Navy flunkies is about the best crew you can hope for in the Borderlands.
Aslan ships aren't designed with automated firing in mind (rules say firing solution adds a DM as normal but can't be used in place of a gunner), so when the travellers ask to purchase Virtual Gunner software, I limit it to level 0, and at double the normal price. It's either that or they need to hire a bunch of gunners that I don't want to keep track of, so I just let them do it. They haven't decided what if anything they want to do with the launch bays for the now destroyed small fighters. That might come back around once they get some serious cash from the Admiralty court.
The Mendina leaves for a milk run to Acrid via Cordan, to check in on their infiltrators and also renew the impression of the Mendina being a reliable vessel for routine cargo. they also want to see if they can buy some military hardware at Cordan. We'll handle that later. A few rumors might get spread as well -- they are still working on that idea. To occupy the time in Exe the Vespexers are doing space boarding drills against the Marines and getting their asses handed to them. These training drills present even more of a golden opportunity to capture the Martin II, and I think they are sorely tempted, but still scared to piss off the Imperial Navy. But they have a plan for Acrid, and I think that's the focus.
They do, however, want another big ship, just so they can use the name they came up with the other day. It has to be worthy of the moniker Oleb's Redhead, though. The Eurisko (75,000 ton heavy cruiser) might be a bit more than they can chew. Maybe the Gorluun (8,000 ton Escort)? That adventure is a bit down the road. . .
My travellers need crew members, so that was their next action item. So, in order to move things along a bit. . .The Martin II suffers the jump failure as described in the adventure, and is stuck at Exe for two weeks waiting on its escort to return. Torsa swallows his pride and hires the Travellers and their pocket warship as protection for those two weeks. In return for a bargain price (MCr 1mm per week) for such a large escort, Torsa agrees to release Willie from her service when they are ready to depart since his replacement crew should be passing through Exe within two weeks anyway). O'Leary and Ilin get in enough trouble to have Torsa ship them home, and the travellers agree to take them their first jump along the way - but course they just hire them as crew instead.
Henshaw is declared unfit for duty as she indicates that Salvesdes threatened her daughter. She claims she didn't come clean earlier because she was afraid she would be under suspicion, but she's too worried about her daughter not to say anything now. Because Torsa doesn't trust her now anyway, our travellers gladly agree to help ship her back to Imperial space as well, which of course they don't do. Torsa does immediately send a secure message via the first ship passing through back to the Navy to see to the safekeeping of the daughter. Between the xboat network and the normal movement of Navy ships, the message will almost certainly get to Cyan before the remaining pirate gang (if any) can get there. So we've gained three crew members to help them out. None of them are ideal, but a group of Navy flunkies is about the best crew you can hope for in the Borderlands.
Aslan ships aren't designed with automated firing in mind (rules say firing solution adds a DM as normal but can't be used in place of a gunner), so when the travellers ask to purchase Virtual Gunner software, I limit it to level 0, and at double the normal price. It's either that or they need to hire a bunch of gunners that I don't want to keep track of, so I just let them do it. They haven't decided what if anything they want to do with the launch bays for the now destroyed small fighters. That might come back around once they get some serious cash from the Admiralty court.
The Mendina leaves for a milk run to Acrid via Cordan, to check in on their infiltrators and also renew the impression of the Mendina being a reliable vessel for routine cargo. they also want to see if they can buy some military hardware at Cordan. We'll handle that later. A few rumors might get spread as well -- they are still working on that idea. To occupy the time in Exe the Vespexers are doing space boarding drills against the Marines and getting their asses handed to them. These training drills present even more of a golden opportunity to capture the Martin II, and I think they are sorely tempted, but still scared to piss off the Imperial Navy. But they have a plan for Acrid, and I think that's the focus.
They do, however, want another big ship, just so they can use the name they came up with the other day. It has to be worthy of the moniker Oleb's Redhead, though. The Eurisko (75,000 ton heavy cruiser) might be a bit more than they can chew. Maybe the Gorluun (8,000 ton Escort)? That adventure is a bit down the road. . .
Old School
Mongoose
So I appear to be talking to myself in this thread now, but so what?. Isn’t any one else running a campaign?
So I recommended to the “ship guy” on the team the google sheets spreadsheet I use for ship design (MgT2 Ship Design v1.9) and am kinda regretting it. He’s like a kid with a toy. Has figured out how to make a 38 ton heavy fighter almost fit in the fighter bay of the Pocket Warship. Couple of walls need to be moved to trade docking space and fuel space for the fighter to fit. Ugly design, too. He’s asked if they procure these fighters can they launch from this bay, and what the “minor” modifications will cost.
The deck plans don’t actually show how the fighters launched, but I’m going with the idea that however 5 small fighters launched won’t work for one big one. He’s got a workable plan for a heavy fighter, but the only way I can see it launching is by opening a large hatch in the bottom of the vessel (doesn't appear to interfere with the below deck fuel tank as far as I can tell). The cost for this will be the cost of 40 tons of docking space: MCr10. Thats on top of about MCr35 for the fighter. So MCr90 for both sides. One fighter will be dual designed as a drop ship for a 12.5 ton Grav APC, the other will have a couple of staterooms for longer term defense boat type duty, but they will have the same combat characteristics: 9G maneuver, single pulse turret (advanced, long range) x2, 12 points armor, radation shielding, military sensors. Oh, and each would need a crew of four, so a very modest improvement over ten pilots for ten fighters.
Also wants to sell the two standard launches, and replace them with faster, armored launches. One as a people carrier / life boat, the other with room for a air raft. So another MCr 9-10 each for two new launches. At least they can se the exsting launch bays for those! Oh, and MCr 7 for the APC.
As for the rest of the warship, they want to rip a few things out to make it a proper flagship. Remove the shrine and four staterooms to put in a medical bay, two high staterooms, and a library. Also use a little bit of the leftover docking space for fuel processors. All that works easily with the existing deck plan. Maybe a workshop in the cargo bay. At least they've abandoned the dream of adding m drives to the ship, as the design doesn't really lend itself to that modification. Now all they need is about MCr120 to make this all happen.
I suggested they look into selling the warship and designing something they like, but no interest. Rao’s Revenge is their flagship, and by god they are going to make it a good one. Might need to steal a Gazelle to pay for it all, unfortunately.
So I recommended to the “ship guy” on the team the google sheets spreadsheet I use for ship design (MgT2 Ship Design v1.9) and am kinda regretting it. He’s like a kid with a toy. Has figured out how to make a 38 ton heavy fighter almost fit in the fighter bay of the Pocket Warship. Couple of walls need to be moved to trade docking space and fuel space for the fighter to fit. Ugly design, too. He’s asked if they procure these fighters can they launch from this bay, and what the “minor” modifications will cost.
The deck plans don’t actually show how the fighters launched, but I’m going with the idea that however 5 small fighters launched won’t work for one big one. He’s got a workable plan for a heavy fighter, but the only way I can see it launching is by opening a large hatch in the bottom of the vessel (doesn't appear to interfere with the below deck fuel tank as far as I can tell). The cost for this will be the cost of 40 tons of docking space: MCr10. Thats on top of about MCr35 for the fighter. So MCr90 for both sides. One fighter will be dual designed as a drop ship for a 12.5 ton Grav APC, the other will have a couple of staterooms for longer term defense boat type duty, but they will have the same combat characteristics: 9G maneuver, single pulse turret (advanced, long range) x2, 12 points armor, radation shielding, military sensors. Oh, and each would need a crew of four, so a very modest improvement over ten pilots for ten fighters.
Also wants to sell the two standard launches, and replace them with faster, armored launches. One as a people carrier / life boat, the other with room for a air raft. So another MCr 9-10 each for two new launches. At least they can se the exsting launch bays for those! Oh, and MCr 7 for the APC.
As for the rest of the warship, they want to rip a few things out to make it a proper flagship. Remove the shrine and four staterooms to put in a medical bay, two high staterooms, and a library. Also use a little bit of the leftover docking space for fuel processors. All that works easily with the existing deck plan. Maybe a workshop in the cargo bay. At least they've abandoned the dream of adding m drives to the ship, as the design doesn't really lend itself to that modification. Now all they need is about MCr120 to make this all happen.
I suggested they look into selling the warship and designing something they like, but no interest. Rao’s Revenge is their flagship, and by god they are going to make it a good one. Might need to steal a Gazelle to pay for it all, unfortunately.
paltrysum
Emperor Mongoose
Think of it as a positive. Having the players get skin in the game enhances the experience. I know it's tempting to feel like you're ceding territory, but managed well, RPGs can be a fully collaborative experience. You just have to draw the line sometimes.
I have players who contribute things such as a trade spreadsheet on Google docs (it's become almost a mini-game for them, managing their trade when they engage in it), ship designs, weapon designs, other tech. They submit it and I approve it. We have a few house rules for various things and I allow for some discussion of them. Unfortunately, players will sometimes feel that that gives them license to lawyer the heck out of every rule I lay down. That's when I politely say "This is the rule," and then I just stop discussing it. It's a two-edged sword, but all in all, I like having them involved in creating the setting as long as the role of the referee is still preserved.
As for talking to yourself, I read your posts in this thread avidly! I enjoy seeing how different campaigns diverge from one another. We only play about once every three weeks, so I don't always have things to report.
We played last night and the group has now unwittingly embarked upon "Ihatei!" The Ihateisho scout was seen trying to escape and they thrashed it with the Ghost of Sindal (Harrier). They spoke with the king and Kasiyl, and despite the dangers that are apparently developing on Kteiroa, the group held fast with their plans to travel to Hilfer > Paal > and then Tyokh. The king expressed that if ihatei are gathering effectively at their border, Drinax could be in danger. And the players just sort of put it off! I have to recalibrate things a bit as to what is going on there since the players essentially ignored the danger. They intend to get there eventually, but the adventure is pretty explicit about its timeline. The adventure says there are 16 weeks before Iykhi assembles his forces and the ihatei launch their attack, which means there is plenty of time...BUT...major decisions are made on Kteiroa long before that.
I have players who contribute things such as a trade spreadsheet on Google docs (it's become almost a mini-game for them, managing their trade when they engage in it), ship designs, weapon designs, other tech. They submit it and I approve it. We have a few house rules for various things and I allow for some discussion of them. Unfortunately, players will sometimes feel that that gives them license to lawyer the heck out of every rule I lay down. That's when I politely say "This is the rule," and then I just stop discussing it. It's a two-edged sword, but all in all, I like having them involved in creating the setting as long as the role of the referee is still preserved.
As for talking to yourself, I read your posts in this thread avidly! I enjoy seeing how different campaigns diverge from one another. We only play about once every three weeks, so I don't always have things to report.
We played last night and the group has now unwittingly embarked upon "Ihatei!" The Ihateisho scout was seen trying to escape and they thrashed it with the Ghost of Sindal (Harrier). They spoke with the king and Kasiyl, and despite the dangers that are apparently developing on Kteiroa, the group held fast with their plans to travel to Hilfer > Paal > and then Tyokh. The king expressed that if ihatei are gathering effectively at their border, Drinax could be in danger. And the players just sort of put it off! I have to recalibrate things a bit as to what is going on there since the players essentially ignored the danger. They intend to get there eventually, but the adventure is pretty explicit about its timeline. The adventure says there are 16 weeks before Iykhi assembles his forces and the ihatei launch their attack, which means there is plenty of time...BUT...major decisions are made on Kteiroa long before that.
Old School said:
I am, but don't often have time to post, and I'm relatively new to GMing and to Traveller, so I tend towards the hand-holding type of posts.
I'm about to start on Treasure of Sindal on the weekend, if the players take the hook.I'm looking forward to how they handle the hurricane boxing match against Oleb.
steve98052
Mongoose
I'm not running a game right now; I'm playing a non-Traveller game. But I really enjoy hearing how it goes.Old School said:
The other big catch for anything that happens in the shipyard, besides the cost, is the time. And is the shipyard they're contracting in a politically stable system? Do the shipyard contractors discover problems in the design after starting work? Are they on a fixed-price contract?will some problem leave them without the ship for longer than planned?
Old School
Mongoose
A spirited effort before subtlely letting the King win is a time honored tradition. Of course, the best adventures come from tradition being flouted.
Steve: shipyard issues can be a good adventure hook, or at least a plot device. The risk is taking agency away from the players in a sandbox campaign, but hey, sometimes you’re just not in charge.
That said, I’ll probably just let this one go snoothly if they actually get the cash to go through with it. I want to reward the players for taking intiative and ownership of the campaign.
Old School
Mongoose
So, wouldn’t a very thin atmosphere make the hurricane kinda not that big of a deal?
Bardicheart
Mongoose
Old School said:
I was enjoying reading your posts, some of your group sound like a bit like myself in regards to dreaming big and trying crazy stuff with ships. I don't know that they could get away with keeping the cruiser but if they could finesse a mutiny and then have it move to an undisclosed location, "for safety" while the ship and crew are "guests" of the Kingdom of Drinax until the players can contact the Imperial Navy and negotiate the peaceful return of its cruiser and the Gorluun in exchange for some "reasonable" compensation to take the form of say... an old light carrier and/or a couple of old light cruisers (TL12 base stuff), or if they're really good an aging strike cruiser, plus some support ships... well.. I suppose the Imperial Navy could see its way to help outfit a new friend and ally with a "proper little navy" in exchange for returning the ship and crew intact along with the moron admiral (for court martial no doubt... I wonder what the going sentence is for not only losing an 75,000 dT heavy cruiser but an entire task force? Needless to say, he ain't getting the girl). Plus the Imperium gets a new friendly polity and buffer state between the and the Aslan that now has enough of a navy to slow up the Aslan so its still a win for the Imperium at the cost of some obsolete ships slated to be mothballed or scrapped eventually anyway. On the upside for the players they've just handed Oleb another big win for Drinax and that ought to be worth quite the reward... say a nice 10,000 dT destroyer from that new fleet as me personal yacht. Yo ho... yo ho... :twisted:
What they would not tolerate is the complete loss (destruction) of said cruiser, that would likely warrant a very violent and overwhelming response (like blowing up everything in orbit around Drinax, then blasting the Floating Palace and then glazing the planet just for good measure before smugly jumping out). One does not screw with the Imperial Navy. Nor would they tolerate the outright piracy capture of the ship (especially if said pirates try to keep it). One does not steal heavy cruisers from the Imperial Navy, or if one does steal such a thing, one had better run a few sectors off charted space and stay there.
Sounds like your group is having fun though, wish I was there.
Old School
Mongoose
Thanks,Sean. Glad you are enjoying it.
I think taking a capital ship is pretty unrealistic, and I agree with you on the consequences. Pirating the Gorluun would lead to the Eurisko destroying half a subsector, at least, and pirating the Eurisko would lead to a fleet of Tigress class dreadnaughts destroying everything.
The author thinks it is possible, however. His sample list of a “large” pirate fleet includes the Eurisko. My players see the Imperium as the good guys, so they wont be capturing as much as a Gazelle unless something seriously changes. Like The anti pirate fleet destroying one of their ships and killing the B team :twisted:
I havent decided what to do after they blow Acrid to kingdom come next session. Im thinking they are going to be summoned to Drinax because the king is unhappy with the lack of piracy. He may also hint as to the blockade plan for down the road. Both of these should encourage them to rapidly build their fleet. They want to track every movment of of every ship currently, but I think I can get them to let that go and just have some pirate ships running around with their secret sponsorship.
They really want their heavy fighters and refit Pocket Warship. After that they want a hidden base. I give them full credit for being proactive. There are at least four possible hidden bases in the campaign. Three opposite corners of the campaign map, and one in Exe which could be fun. Especially with the Harrier stealth jumping in and out.
I think taking a capital ship is pretty unrealistic, and I agree with you on the consequences. Pirating the Gorluun would lead to the Eurisko destroying half a subsector, at least, and pirating the Eurisko would lead to a fleet of Tigress class dreadnaughts destroying everything.
The author thinks it is possible, however. His sample list of a “large” pirate fleet includes the Eurisko. My players see the Imperium as the good guys, so they wont be capturing as much as a Gazelle unless something seriously changes. Like The anti pirate fleet destroying one of their ships and killing the B team :twisted:
I havent decided what to do after they blow Acrid to kingdom come next session. Im thinking they are going to be summoned to Drinax because the king is unhappy with the lack of piracy. He may also hint as to the blockade plan for down the road. Both of these should encourage them to rapidly build their fleet. They want to track every movment of of every ship currently, but I think I can get them to let that go and just have some pirate ships running around with their secret sponsorship.
They really want their heavy fighters and refit Pocket Warship. After that they want a hidden base. I give them full credit for being proactive. There are at least four possible hidden bases in the campaign. Three opposite corners of the campaign map, and one in Exe which could be fun. Especially with the Harrier stealth jumping in and out.
paltrysum
Emperor Mongoose
Under what circumstances would acquisition of a capital ship be acceptable? Some kind of arrangement made with Admiral Darrokyn in order to maintain his secret? In trade for the WMDs in “Treasure of Sindal”? As the result of a favorable outcome of “Sun and Shadow”? All of the above? There might be some way for it to happen that would not result in an Imperial scorching of the earth.
As for the hidden base, it’s amazing how many opportunities there are in this campaign to obtain one or more of them. Redthane’s fuel dump, a captured Treasure Ship, the “Treasure of Sindal” base. With all the 2-3 parsec gaps between worlds of the Void, there are ample opportunities to invent their own.
As for the king getting ticked off at a lack of piracy, I’m in full support of that. We had it happen in ours. Makes sense. A king doesn’t give orders and then show a lot of flexibility. “Well, we’d rather establish trade agreements,” says the players. “Screw you. I’m a king. It’s my way or the highway,” says Oleb.
As for the hidden base, it’s amazing how many opportunities there are in this campaign to obtain one or more of them. Redthane’s fuel dump, a captured Treasure Ship, the “Treasure of Sindal” base. With all the 2-3 parsec gaps between worlds of the Void, there are ample opportunities to invent their own.
As for the king getting ticked off at a lack of piracy, I’m in full support of that. We had it happen in ours. Makes sense. A king doesn’t give orders and then show a lot of flexibility. “Well, we’d rather establish trade agreements,” says the players. “Screw you. I’m a king. It’s my way or the highway,” says Oleb.
Old School
Mongoose
Bases:There’s also the hdden base at Wildeman (patron missions in the back of the book), The pirate outpost near “The World”, and Zhuekvi’s base in Exe. All kinds of options.
As for capital ships, maybe you could negotiate for one, but you’re not stealing one without a bunch planets getting glassed.
As for capital ships, maybe you could negotiate for one, but you’re not stealing one without a bunch planets getting glassed.
Bardicheart
Mongoose
So full disclosure: Personally I have no problem with players having a capital ship... each... or even several... each. If I really need a bigger stick the Imperium will always have more and bigger ships. But that's not how I like to handle it. Instead if I'm the referee I prefer to let the ships become their own challenge, where do you get crew... can you trust said crew or are you going to be looking over your shoulder for a mutiny constantly? Want to see players fully embrace Epicenter's comments in another thread about compartmentalization, watch a group that has a capital ship with a crew of a few hundred that they don't trust... suddenly everything gets compartmentalized! What about logistics, where do you get more missiles? Repairs and refits? You can't do that with a 10,000 dT+ ship at just any port. In games where that was where things went the players (or me in a few games where I was playing and got to have such) spent a lot of time building infrastructure, negotiating deals for parts and support, recruiting (and even setting up crew training) and so forth. Instead of having such a ship ending the campaign it launched a whole new one with its own set of challenges and problems to be solved. If you've a mind for it it can be an interesting change of pace from being stuck in 200 dT Free Trader named the Serenity with everyone arguing over who gets to be Mal (except me, I wanna be Jayne :lol: or the doctor, or Shepherd... there still so much we don't know about his back story).
Anyway, that said...
Getting a capital ship... legitimately. If you're campaign is in the Imperium its probably not happening. There seems to be a general prohibition against this and against private ownership of anything over 2000 dT which frankly I've always thought was silly (one of these day I'm going to finish my Traveller to Fading Sun setting conversion, I love the setting but I hate the VPS rules. That setting with the Traveller rules though just rocks). Bulk freighters should be like modern super freighters, big container carriers that literally are as big as a battleship (say 200,000 dT) and while I think there is one example of such in one supplement somewhere, Traveller seems to have kind of a schizoid attitude about such ships... sometimes its okay, sometimes not. Then again, a lot of the OTU seems stuck in pre High Guard when 2000 dT was the biggest thing possible so there's that.
But outside the Imperium there's no Imperial law stopping anyone so its more a matter of logistics and where do you get one. As we've already covered, one does not steal from the Imperial Navy... period. I think Drinax presents a unique situation where the Imperium would be willing to provide some older ships precisely because in this case it benefits the Imperium in the long run by giving them the buffer state they want and helping solve a long term issue with regards to the Aslan (there's a case to be made the Imperium might even be looking for a good excuse to do so). But they are not going to give up brand new TL 15 ships, no way no how. They'd also try to talk Drinax into taking more smaller ships with less focus on more than one or two big ships, because the Imperium knows their big problem will be the ihatea which means swarms of ships and they'll need a fleet flexible enough to deal with that. Lots of smaller ships is better for that. They might even be happy to help your one player make his heavy fighter dream happen, fighters are a good way to deal with ihatea troop ships. Who knows, they might even offer up some help with training crews and so forth, maybe offer to supply them with spare parts and munitions... not out of the generosity of the big warm heart of their new pal the Imperium but out of pure self interest. If you're crew is trained by Imperial cadres they're also indoctrinated by them, and if you get most of your spare parts and munitions from the Imperium that just adds to the dependency. It gives the Imperium control while keeping the whole mess and inevitable conflict with the Aslan at arms length. In short, they're setting Drinax up to fight a proxy war with the Aslan. Drinax ends up another client state and possibly one day even voluntarily becomes part of the Imperium as another Duchy... its the long view. (And that kids is how great great grand dad founded our fine and noble family and we eventually became subsector Dukes in the Imperium. Tell it again grandpa... especially the part about how great great grand dad was pirate, that's the best part! Oh, alright kids, one more time and then off to bed with you. ::read that in a Peter Jurasik / Londo Mollari voice for full effect:
There are some ports in the Borderworlds area that have the potential to produce big ships. Tech World, Drinax and Strend all have the technology but not the infrastructure. Infrastructure is more than just a starport, its the industry producing all the components that get assembled at a starport shipyard. Tech world lacks the manpower and industry, it could make up the manpower with robots (which it seems to have, it just needs LOTS more of them) but still lacks the industry. Strend has more manpower but its questionable how much industry they have. Drinax just has the tech, but neither manpower nor industry and no viable way to make up for either. Both TechWorld and Strend might be good stops for automating parts of your ship as well.
Of course the Aslan have both the industry and the manpower (paw power?) and an alliance with the right clan might be a good source for ships, imagine Drinax tech at a Aslan shipyard producing a some strange blend of old Sindalian and Aslan designs. Course doing that would set off alarms in the Imperium since the last thing they want out of this is the Aslan ihatea armed with 200,000 dT TL 15 battleships and a friendly forward base... that's going from bad to WAY worse. Smart players might leverage that knowledge (if they figure it out) to further pressure the Imperium into supplying them with some nice toys, but of course the Imperium will attach strings to that. Its gonna be complicated any way you look at it and the Imperium is always going to look out for its best long term interest while maintaining as much control as they can. On the flip side the Aslan, at least a few wiser heads among them, likely view the Imperium in exactly the same light. The Imperium didn't get to be 10,000 worlds by not being expansionistic; and just as the Imperium doesn't want the Aslan expanding near their expanding borders, neither do the Aslan want the Imperium expanding in the way of their own expanding borders... its all about elbow room. So maybe players could take a page from Sun Tzu and play off three super powers (the Imperium, the Aslan and the Zhodani) for all the toys they can milk out of it while treading a very fine line between them. Good luck with that. If you REALLY want to play a dangerous game, deal with the Sword Worlds who do have the infrastructure and would simply LOVE to get their hands on some old Sindalian blueprints and technical schematics making them quite eager to make some deals. But that's gonna piss off a lot of people so... interesting times ahead. Or like the man said, choose your enemies wisely.
More creatively, players might go looking around for salvage. The old Sindalian Empire did have big capital ships and who knows what you might find if you dug through some historical archives and checked out some old naval battle sites... maybe a badly damaged 200,000 dT TL 15 Sindalian hulk that with some hard work could be repaired and brought back online? Or maybe not... maybe turns out to be a 30,000 dT TL 15 Sindalian light cruiser... but still... that's a sweet ship to score (and with the original oak paneling no less... they just don't build them like that anymore Viir). Course there's still that pesky problem of where do you get the spare parts, crew, munitions, etc. Setting up those deals through third parties and such could spawn quite a few adventures. Chasing rumors of such things could keep players poking around here and there with a salvage ship for quite some time. Especially if it sometimes does yield some usable ships, a few more Harriers, maybe some 800 dT gunboats, a 2000 dT frigate or something. Eventually they get a salvageable cruiser or battleship if you want to allow that and by that time they've also got a nice group of support ships and something resembling a fleet. They've also had time to figure out and solve some logistics problems, crew and marine training, etc.
For the really far out, go for robotics, then use that to do robotic mining, then robotic industry, and long story short you build a highly automated infrastructure ending with a ship yard capable of constructing old Sindalian designs from the keel up. That would be a HUGE undertaking but hey, if the players are up for it. :wink: Drinax likely has the tech for that, anything they lack TechWorld and/or Strend could fill in so its just a matter of taking it from dream to reality. Course there would be challenges along the way, and there might be some interested parties (like the Imperium, some Aslan, other polities in the area) who don't want to see that happen so lots of adventures to be had in the process whether it actually works or not. Be a heck of a story though. Just be careful of anyone who wants to install a planetary internet called Skynet... :shock:
In short, if you want a capital ship the options seem to be, talk either the Imperium, Zhodani or Aslan into supplying them (or the Sword Worlds if they're feeling like living dangerously). Find and salvage one with all the challenges that entails. Build your own but that likely means first building the entire infrastructure needed to do so. Other than that, I don't see much else in the way of viable options. Well, there is that one time a certain group in the 80's used a whole series of shell corporations to funnel materials, personnel and resources to a secret shipyard in the Glimmerdrift Reaches where they constructed a full scale battlestar (as in Battlestar Galactica)... all 12,000,000 dT of her... but that's just a crazy rumor. 8) :lol:
Those are my thoughts, YMMV (and probably will).
Anyway, that said...
Getting a capital ship... legitimately. If you're campaign is in the Imperium its probably not happening. There seems to be a general prohibition against this and against private ownership of anything over 2000 dT which frankly I've always thought was silly (one of these day I'm going to finish my Traveller to Fading Sun setting conversion, I love the setting but I hate the VPS rules. That setting with the Traveller rules though just rocks). Bulk freighters should be like modern super freighters, big container carriers that literally are as big as a battleship (say 200,000 dT) and while I think there is one example of such in one supplement somewhere, Traveller seems to have kind of a schizoid attitude about such ships... sometimes its okay, sometimes not. Then again, a lot of the OTU seems stuck in pre High Guard when 2000 dT was the biggest thing possible so there's that.
But outside the Imperium there's no Imperial law stopping anyone so its more a matter of logistics and where do you get one. As we've already covered, one does not steal from the Imperial Navy... period. I think Drinax presents a unique situation where the Imperium would be willing to provide some older ships precisely because in this case it benefits the Imperium in the long run by giving them the buffer state they want and helping solve a long term issue with regards to the Aslan (there's a case to be made the Imperium might even be looking for a good excuse to do so). But they are not going to give up brand new TL 15 ships, no way no how. They'd also try to talk Drinax into taking more smaller ships with less focus on more than one or two big ships, because the Imperium knows their big problem will be the ihatea which means swarms of ships and they'll need a fleet flexible enough to deal with that. Lots of smaller ships is better for that. They might even be happy to help your one player make his heavy fighter dream happen, fighters are a good way to deal with ihatea troop ships. Who knows, they might even offer up some help with training crews and so forth, maybe offer to supply them with spare parts and munitions... not out of the generosity of the big warm heart of their new pal the Imperium but out of pure self interest. If you're crew is trained by Imperial cadres they're also indoctrinated by them, and if you get most of your spare parts and munitions from the Imperium that just adds to the dependency. It gives the Imperium control while keeping the whole mess and inevitable conflict with the Aslan at arms length. In short, they're setting Drinax up to fight a proxy war with the Aslan. Drinax ends up another client state and possibly one day even voluntarily becomes part of the Imperium as another Duchy... its the long view. (And that kids is how great great grand dad founded our fine and noble family and we eventually became subsector Dukes in the Imperium. Tell it again grandpa... especially the part about how great great grand dad was pirate, that's the best part! Oh, alright kids, one more time and then off to bed with you. ::read that in a Peter Jurasik / Londo Mollari voice for full effect:
There are some ports in the Borderworlds area that have the potential to produce big ships. Tech World, Drinax and Strend all have the technology but not the infrastructure. Infrastructure is more than just a starport, its the industry producing all the components that get assembled at a starport shipyard. Tech world lacks the manpower and industry, it could make up the manpower with robots (which it seems to have, it just needs LOTS more of them) but still lacks the industry. Strend has more manpower but its questionable how much industry they have. Drinax just has the tech, but neither manpower nor industry and no viable way to make up for either. Both TechWorld and Strend might be good stops for automating parts of your ship as well.
Of course the Aslan have both the industry and the manpower (paw power?) and an alliance with the right clan might be a good source for ships, imagine Drinax tech at a Aslan shipyard producing a some strange blend of old Sindalian and Aslan designs. Course doing that would set off alarms in the Imperium since the last thing they want out of this is the Aslan ihatea armed with 200,000 dT TL 15 battleships and a friendly forward base... that's going from bad to WAY worse. Smart players might leverage that knowledge (if they figure it out) to further pressure the Imperium into supplying them with some nice toys, but of course the Imperium will attach strings to that. Its gonna be complicated any way you look at it and the Imperium is always going to look out for its best long term interest while maintaining as much control as they can. On the flip side the Aslan, at least a few wiser heads among them, likely view the Imperium in exactly the same light. The Imperium didn't get to be 10,000 worlds by not being expansionistic; and just as the Imperium doesn't want the Aslan expanding near their expanding borders, neither do the Aslan want the Imperium expanding in the way of their own expanding borders... its all about elbow room. So maybe players could take a page from Sun Tzu and play off three super powers (the Imperium, the Aslan and the Zhodani) for all the toys they can milk out of it while treading a very fine line between them. Good luck with that. If you REALLY want to play a dangerous game, deal with the Sword Worlds who do have the infrastructure and would simply LOVE to get their hands on some old Sindalian blueprints and technical schematics making them quite eager to make some deals. But that's gonna piss off a lot of people so... interesting times ahead. Or like the man said, choose your enemies wisely.
More creatively, players might go looking around for salvage. The old Sindalian Empire did have big capital ships and who knows what you might find if you dug through some historical archives and checked out some old naval battle sites... maybe a badly damaged 200,000 dT TL 15 Sindalian hulk that with some hard work could be repaired and brought back online? Or maybe not... maybe turns out to be a 30,000 dT TL 15 Sindalian light cruiser... but still... that's a sweet ship to score (and with the original oak paneling no less... they just don't build them like that anymore Viir). Course there's still that pesky problem of where do you get the spare parts, crew, munitions, etc. Setting up those deals through third parties and such could spawn quite a few adventures. Chasing rumors of such things could keep players poking around here and there with a salvage ship for quite some time. Especially if it sometimes does yield some usable ships, a few more Harriers, maybe some 800 dT gunboats, a 2000 dT frigate or something. Eventually they get a salvageable cruiser or battleship if you want to allow that and by that time they've also got a nice group of support ships and something resembling a fleet. They've also had time to figure out and solve some logistics problems, crew and marine training, etc.
For the really far out, go for robotics, then use that to do robotic mining, then robotic industry, and long story short you build a highly automated infrastructure ending with a ship yard capable of constructing old Sindalian designs from the keel up. That would be a HUGE undertaking but hey, if the players are up for it. :wink: Drinax likely has the tech for that, anything they lack TechWorld and/or Strend could fill in so its just a matter of taking it from dream to reality. Course there would be challenges along the way, and there might be some interested parties (like the Imperium, some Aslan, other polities in the area) who don't want to see that happen so lots of adventures to be had in the process whether it actually works or not. Be a heck of a story though. Just be careful of anyone who wants to install a planetary internet called Skynet... :shock:
In short, if you want a capital ship the options seem to be, talk either the Imperium, Zhodani or Aslan into supplying them (or the Sword Worlds if they're feeling like living dangerously). Find and salvage one with all the challenges that entails. Build your own but that likely means first building the entire infrastructure needed to do so. Other than that, I don't see much else in the way of viable options. Well, there is that one time a certain group in the 80's used a whole series of shell corporations to funnel materials, personnel and resources to a secret shipyard in the Glimmerdrift Reaches where they constructed a full scale battlestar (as in Battlestar Galactica)... all 12,000,000 dT of her... but that's just a crazy rumor. 8) :lol:
Those are my thoughts, YMMV (and probably will).
Pyromancer
Mongoose
In my campaign, the Tobia Commerce Guild underhandedly sold two old 20,000 dton TL12 battleships to Inurin. They originate from the "Trojan Reserve" in Empire/Tobia (Trojan Reach 2711). They are hardly working, and Inurin doesn't have qualified crews for them yet, but they have also hired military advisors and slowly want to built up the institutional knowledge to operate big ships over the next decades.
My players haven't stumbled across this yet, but if they manage to form an alliance with Inurin, that's two capital ships for them right there.
My players haven't stumbled across this yet, but if they manage to form an alliance with Inurin, that's two capital ships for them right there.
Old School
Mongoose
Thats a lot to digest, but I think all your ideas are plausible. . .after the Kindom of Drinax (or Empire of Sindal) is reborn. Once the empire is established, if it negotiates a good treaty with the Imperium some old TL12 warships could definitely be headed their way. Of course, within the campaign setting, that would after after the big battle in Finale. I could also see a small fleet permanently stationed at Byrni before that..but no capital ships, as that will upset the balance with the Hierate. I don’t see the Imperium equipping my travellers during the campaign, as they are barely one step above freelancers at this point. They also need the revenue that comes with trade duties, which will be Drinax’s dominant source of revenue for the immediate future.
As far as building/supporting/supplying a fleet of large warships: all would be ongoing issues. That doesn't seem feasible in the short term without the support of GeDeCo. For some other major power willing to make a massive investment in the Borderlands and Tliaowaha, which GeDeCo already has, would require years, maybe not better as a successful Empire of Drinax building the infrastructure itself.
I think I’m gonna run the Game of Sun and Shadow with a few of the travellers tagging along with the fleet as liasons from Drinax. The Navy will want those liasons to be their own former officers, whereas Oleb will want it to be people who are from the floating palace and theortically dont have divided loyalties. (It hasnt come up yet so the players arent aware, but Oleb’s level of trust definitely varies for different travellers.
As far as building/supporting/supplying a fleet of large warships: all would be ongoing issues. That doesn't seem feasible in the short term without the support of GeDeCo. For some other major power willing to make a massive investment in the Borderlands and Tliaowaha, which GeDeCo already has, would require years, maybe not better as a successful Empire of Drinax building the infrastructure itself.
I think I’m gonna run the Game of Sun and Shadow with a few of the travellers tagging along with the fleet as liasons from Drinax. The Navy will want those liasons to be their own former officers, whereas Oleb will want it to be people who are from the floating palace and theortically dont have divided loyalties. (It hasnt come up yet so the players arent aware, but Oleb’s level of trust definitely varies for different travellers.
paltrysum
Emperor Mongoose
Great ideas, guys. I hadn’t even considered the Sword Worlds but it makes sense. My Pirates campaign is in mid-1107 and the Fifth Frontier War is looming.
Given the Sword Worlds’ actions against the Imperium in the Spinward Marches, it might make sense for them to offer to sell an old ship to a burgeoning empire on the Imperium’s rimward flank. Perhaps in exchange for certain WMDs?
Introduction of a capital ship could enable us to use Mongoose’s new naval campaigns book, too.
Given the Sword Worlds’ actions against the Imperium in the Spinward Marches, it might make sense for them to offer to sell an old ship to a burgeoning empire on the Imperium’s rimward flank. Perhaps in exchange for certain WMDs?
Introduction of a capital ship could enable us to use Mongoose’s new naval campaigns book, too.
PsiTraveller
Cosmic Mongoose
The Treasure of Sindal computers might have archives of ships being sent somewhere, even ships hidden away and mothballed. Ships left hiding in empty sectors waiting for the need to be pressed into service.
Of course the robot sentinels could be a problem....
The hidden base may also have plans for construction, spare parts and machinery to refurbish and maintain Sindalian ships.
Of course the robot sentinels could be a problem....
The hidden base may also have plans for construction, spare parts and machinery to refurbish and maintain Sindalian ships.
