lastbesthope
Mongoose
Nightmares about Minbari said:
I think the monkey magic thread holds the record
http://www.mongoosepublishing.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=194
LBH
Nike Class Battlecruiser
- Thread starter prelude_to_war
- Start date
I think the monkey magic thread holds the record
http://www.mongoosepublishing.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=194
LBH
kritikalfailure
Mongoose
Playtesting results, first two ships:
Here's the stat line I'm going to be using:
Ship Type: Nike-class Advanced Battlecruiser
Priority Level: War
Hull: 6
Speed: 10
Turn: 2/45°
Damage: 70/18
Crew: 70/20
Max Craft: 2 T-Bolt Flights
Troops: 3
Special Rules: Advanced Jump Point, Interceptors 4, Flight Computer, Self-Repairing 2
Weapons
Heavy Particle Cannon ----------- B - 25" - 4AD - Beam, SAP, TD
Advanced Missile Rack ----------- F - 30" - 4AD - Precise, SAP, SL*
Q-Lasers ---------------------------- F - 10" - 4AD - MB, AP
Heavy Pulse Cannons ------------ F - 12" - 8AD - TL
Q-Lasers ---------------------------- P - 10" - 3AD - MB, AP
Heavy Pulse Cannons ------------ P - 12" - 6AD - TL
Q-Lasers ---------------------------- S - 10" - 3AD - MB, AP
Heavy Pulse Cannons ------------ S - 12" - 6AD - TL
Particle Beams --------------------- T - 6" --- 8AD - AF, TL
Railguns ----------------------------- T - 20" -- 6AD - AP. DD
* This weapon Ignores slow-loading trait unless crippled
All right, I've run the first six playtesting games.
Nike vs Octurian:
Round 1: Octurian Wins.
This one wasn't even close. The Octurian managed to win initiative (surprise there) all three turns this one lasted. He CAF'd the first turn, doing tremendous damage with the beam. Second turn he got in range for close range weaponry, doing even more damage and taking mediocre in return. Third turn was mostly a formality, as his beams finished off the Nike.
Round 2: Nike Wins
This one was more of a slugfest. Both ships ended up crippled and on skeleton crew. This round the Nike managed to get to the Octurian's sides and dish out quite a bit of punishment. However the Centuari player was pretty hot on his crit rolling as well. When all was said and done, the Nike stood victorious with a whopping 5 hits and 10 crewmen left on board.
Round 3: Octurian Wins
Another slugfest. Both ships gradually eroded one another with the Nike trying to stay on the Octurian's sides. On turn 4, the Octurian did 30 or so damage with the aft battle laser (figuring in crits as well). That was the end of it.
Nike vs Sharlin
Round 1: Sharlin wins
This one made me sorta sick. First turn of the game the Sharlin does 37 damage to the Nike with a CAF'd Neutron Laser. Second turn wasn't quite as bad, but enough that the third round spelled the doom for the Nike. The Sharlin took no damage, as I never got past its stealth.
Round 2: Nike wins
Bloody on both sides. However I've now learned that if you ever get past the Sharlin's stealth, it folds like paper mache. Between the Heavy Particle Cannon and the Heavy Missiles, it died on turn three. The nike had taken roughly 30 damage and 40 odd crew losses.
Round 3: Nike wins
This one was very, very close. The two ships pounded each other and ended up both with Speed 0 within 10" of one another. The Nike got lucky with a crit from a Heavy Missile and managed to finish the Sharlin off. The Nike had 20 damage and 10 crew remaining.
Conclusions:
After the first rounds of playtesting, I'm fairly happy with the results on both sides. Without the 2 turns, however, the Nike would have gone 0 and 3 with the Octurian. At first I thought the 8 ADs on the turret Particle Beams would be too much, but this configuration has nothing to the rear so it subs in there.
Here's the stat line I'm going to be using:
Ship Type: Nike-class Advanced Battlecruiser
Priority Level: War
Hull: 6
Speed: 10
Turn: 2/45°
Damage: 70/18
Crew: 70/20
Max Craft: 2 T-Bolt Flights
Troops: 3
Special Rules: Advanced Jump Point, Interceptors 4, Flight Computer, Self-Repairing 2
Weapons
Heavy Particle Cannon ----------- B - 25" - 4AD - Beam, SAP, TD
Advanced Missile Rack ----------- F - 30" - 4AD - Precise, SAP, SL*
Q-Lasers ---------------------------- F - 10" - 4AD - MB, AP
Heavy Pulse Cannons ------------ F - 12" - 8AD - TL
Q-Lasers ---------------------------- P - 10" - 3AD - MB, AP
Heavy Pulse Cannons ------------ P - 12" - 6AD - TL
Q-Lasers ---------------------------- S - 10" - 3AD - MB, AP
Heavy Pulse Cannons ------------ S - 12" - 6AD - TL
Particle Beams --------------------- T - 6" --- 8AD - AF, TL
Railguns ----------------------------- T - 20" -- 6AD - AP. DD
* This weapon Ignores slow-loading trait unless crippled
All right, I've run the first six playtesting games.
Nike vs Octurian:
Round 1: Octurian Wins.
This one wasn't even close. The Octurian managed to win initiative (surprise there) all three turns this one lasted. He CAF'd the first turn, doing tremendous damage with the beam. Second turn he got in range for close range weaponry, doing even more damage and taking mediocre in return. Third turn was mostly a formality, as his beams finished off the Nike.
Round 2: Nike Wins
This one was more of a slugfest. Both ships ended up crippled and on skeleton crew. This round the Nike managed to get to the Octurian's sides and dish out quite a bit of punishment. However the Centuari player was pretty hot on his crit rolling as well. When all was said and done, the Nike stood victorious with a whopping 5 hits and 10 crewmen left on board.
Round 3: Octurian Wins
Another slugfest. Both ships gradually eroded one another with the Nike trying to stay on the Octurian's sides. On turn 4, the Octurian did 30 or so damage with the aft battle laser (figuring in crits as well). That was the end of it.
Nike vs Sharlin
Round 1: Sharlin wins
This one made me sorta sick. First turn of the game the Sharlin does 37 damage to the Nike with a CAF'd Neutron Laser. Second turn wasn't quite as bad, but enough that the third round spelled the doom for the Nike. The Sharlin took no damage, as I never got past its stealth.
Round 2: Nike wins
Bloody on both sides. However I've now learned that if you ever get past the Sharlin's stealth, it folds like paper mache. Between the Heavy Particle Cannon and the Heavy Missiles, it died on turn three. The nike had taken roughly 30 damage and 40 odd crew losses.
Round 3: Nike wins
This one was very, very close. The two ships pounded each other and ended up both with Speed 0 within 10" of one another. The Nike got lucky with a crit from a Heavy Missile and managed to finish the Sharlin off. The Nike had 20 damage and 10 crew remaining.
Conclusions:
After the first rounds of playtesting, I'm fairly happy with the results on both sides. Without the 2 turns, however, the Nike would have gone 0 and 3 with the Octurian. At first I thought the 8 ADs on the turret Particle Beams would be too much, but this configuration has nothing to the rear so it subs in there.
prelude_to_war
Mongoose
Hm, interesting playtest...I still maintain we stick with the following:
Hull: 6
Speed: 8 (shouldn't be faster than a Hyperion IMO)
Turns 2/45
Damage: 70/15
Crew 70/20
Craft: 2 Thunderbolts (enough for escort, not fighter delivery)
Troops: 2 (enough for some protection - not designed for close assault, but battle)
Traits: Interceptors 4, AJP, Flight Computer (drop self-repair to maintain Battle PL)
Heavy Particle Cannon, 25", 4AD, TD, B, SAP, Boresight
Railguns: 20", 6AD, AP DD, T
Q-Laser Array: 12", 6AD, AP, TL, All Arcs (MB removed, since ultimately it will hinder the other weapons against interceptors)
Advanced Missile Rack: 30" 4AD, SAP, Precise, Slow loading unless crippled, Turret (Turret added back in, the nuclear missile sub type missile bays along the hull suggest top firing missiles, which could change direction and go anywhere - and for Battle PL, I think 4AD is fair)
Particle Beams: T - 6", 6AD - AF (added back in since MB were removed from the Q-lasers)
The idea is after closing with the enemy (and using the Particle Cannon and missiles from range), it would use its Q-lasers to take down intereptors (assuming the enemy has them, if not even better), then missiles & railguns to inflict serious damage. With these weapons either in all arcs or T, it gives the Nike a measure of flexibility lacking in your typical EA brick.
I'm not crazy about the afterburner idea, as that seems unique to the Victory...
Hull: 6
Speed: 8 (shouldn't be faster than a Hyperion IMO)
Turns 2/45
Damage: 70/15
Crew 70/20
Craft: 2 Thunderbolts (enough for escort, not fighter delivery)
Troops: 2 (enough for some protection - not designed for close assault, but battle)
Traits: Interceptors 4, AJP, Flight Computer (drop self-repair to maintain Battle PL)
Heavy Particle Cannon, 25", 4AD, TD, B, SAP, Boresight
Railguns: 20", 6AD, AP DD, T
Q-Laser Array: 12", 6AD, AP, TL, All Arcs (MB removed, since ultimately it will hinder the other weapons against interceptors)
Advanced Missile Rack: 30" 4AD, SAP, Precise, Slow loading unless crippled, Turret (Turret added back in, the nuclear missile sub type missile bays along the hull suggest top firing missiles, which could change direction and go anywhere - and for Battle PL, I think 4AD is fair)
Particle Beams: T - 6", 6AD - AF (added back in since MB were removed from the Q-lasers)
The idea is after closing with the enemy (and using the Particle Cannon and missiles from range), it would use its Q-lasers to take down intereptors (assuming the enemy has them, if not even better), then missiles & railguns to inflict serious damage. With these weapons either in all arcs or T, it gives the Nike a measure of flexibility lacking in your typical EA brick.
I'm not crazy about the afterburner idea, as that seems unique to the Victory...
prelude_to_war said:
I thought that these were the dedicated laser battery part of an advanced LPA. I was in two-minds about MB, and was wavering toward it being an actual Beam.
With your stats above, you have not included any of the Heavy (Phasing) Pulse Cannons
prelude_to_war said:
I was under the impression ENFILI indicated that the launch bays were mounted in the prow of the ship. I would maintain the Advanced part and the 4 AD and limit to a F arc. Also we are trying to go for a War PL.
prelude_to_war said:
These are better suited to point defense work anyway, and are a welcome addition.
prelude_to_war said:
As it stood in kriticalfailures stats the Q-Laser and HPPCs actually had less range, punch and versatility than an LPA mounted on a Warlock. However setting the weapons on seperate mounts meant that both could be fired in a turn. Also as I have said above I think the Q-lasers should be actual light/medium lasers (AP Beam) that way they will not worry too much about interceptors. The Heavy (Phasing) Pulse cannons should have the AD be able to significantly deplete any interceptors the enemy might have.
prelude_to_war said:
Me neither, it seems that speed 8 is still pretty nippy for a War level choice, it is the 2/45º turns that sets it well apart from the others War PL ships.
I don't know how well this might sit with people as a War PL choice.
Hull: 6
Speed: 8
Turn: 2/45°
Damage: 70/15
Crew: 70/20
Max Craft: 2 Thunderbolt Flights
Troops: 2
Special Rules: Advanced Jump Point, Interceptors 4, Flight Computer
Weapons
Heavy Particle Cannon ----------- B - 25" - 4AD - Beam, SAP, TD
Advanced Missile Rack ----------- F - 30" - 4AD - Precise, SAP, SL*
Q-LPA ------------------------------ F - 15" - 8AD - TL
Q-LPA ------------------------------ P - 15" - 6AD - TL
Q-LPA ------------------------------ S - 15" - 6AD - TL
Q-LPA ------------------------------ A - 15" - 4AD - TL
Particle Beams ---------------------T - 6" --- 8AD - AF, TL
Railguns ---------------------------- T - 20" -- 6AD - AP, DD
* This weapon Ignores slow-loading trait unless crippled
Q-LPAs may be fired with half attack dice at a maximum range of 12". They gain the AP and Beam traits but loose Twin-Linked.
Would the laser part of the Q-LPA benefit from a reduction to an 8 or 10" range and Super AP trait and add DD to the Twin-Linked elements, but again reduce the range to 12"?
kritikalfailure
Mongoose
prelude_to_war said:
I'm fine with your stats, Prelude. Although we are shooting for War PL, and thus I don't see a reason to drop self-repair. The emphasis with yours definately is on the railguns and missiles, while the Q-Lasers are now used to strip interceptors rather than bypassing them.
I also like the idea of the AD being equal on all arcs. Since the Nike is designed for ship-to-ship combat (rather than fleet to fleet, as in the Warlock's case), it'll have to rely upon massing turreted weapons to do any significant damage.
I'll test this one out today.
Q-lasers are AP TL, 12"? why not just call them a heavy plasma cannon?
edit
sorry, that probaby sounds harsher than intended, but the AP, TL stats match the EA's plasma cannon (hyperion) with a longer range.
I still think the background fits the minibeam description better.
Chern
edit
sorry, that probaby sounds harsher than intended, but the AP, TL stats match the EA's plasma cannon (hyperion) with a longer range.
I still think the background fits the minibeam description better.
Chern
prelude_to_war
Mongoose
Quick note: Batch 2 has been sent out, this time all domestic orders - with a couple of international orders filled. I'm still waiting on international shipping boxes to arrive (which should be today/tomorrow) before I send the rest of the orders out.
prelude_to_war
Mongoose
OUTSTANDING!!! Great to see other variations after staring at the prototype all summer long. Nice drybrushing - and I like the windows added to the bridge. Excellent work.
Sweet!!! Now I realy can't wait t'ill I get my own two!!!
But if I can ask to post a final stat line for a PL War lvl Nike so playtesting can comence. So everyone who wants to can playtest it and report his findings here.
(I'll start playteting using my warlock models :wink: )
Cyall 8)
But if I can ask to post a final stat line for a PL War lvl Nike so playtesting can comence. So everyone who wants to can playtest it and report his findings here.
(I'll start playteting using my warlock models :wink: )
Cyall 8)
kritikalfailure
Mongoose
Rynar said:
Hull: 6
Speed: 8
Turns 2/45
Damage: 70/15
Crew 70/20
Craft: 2 Thunderbolts (enough for escort, not fighter delivery)
Troops: 2
Traits: Interceptors 4, AJP, Flight Computer
Heavy Particle Cannon, 25", 4AD, TD, B, SAP, Boresight
Railguns: 20", 6AD, AP DD, T
Q-Laser Array: 12", 6AD, AP, TL, (F,P,S,A)
Advanced Missile Rack: 30" 4AD, SAP, Precise, Slow loading unless crippled, Turret
Particle Beams: T - 6", 6AD - AF (added back in since MB were removed from the Q-lasers)
This is the last thing LBH posted, so it's what I'm sticking with.
lastbesthope
Mongoose
Chernobyl said:
I cannot tell a lie, it was not me :lol:
LBH
prelude_to_war
Mongoose
I think he meant me...looking forward to see how it performs in the test.
FYI, I'll be packing the rest of ALL the orders tonight while watching LOST.
FYI, I'll be packing the rest of ALL the orders tonight while watching LOST.
kritikalfailure
Mongoose
Got mine in the mail today. I too seem to be suffering from wing breakage. I'm thinking I can perhaps glue them back on easily enough. If not I'll simply cut them off and either a. replace them with plasticard or b. leave them off, creating my own "lazy-ass" variant. I'll have pictures posted in the next few days.
P.S. This is my first time working with resin. Is there anything I need to know about what to/not to prime it with or such?
P.S. This is my first time working with resin. Is there anything I need to know about what to/not to prime it with or such?
