Future warfare

[Sigtrygg]

The aim of this thread is to look ad ground combat as TLs advance from 8 to 15, if you want to know how it works at TL7 watch youtube

I will base this initially on what was presented in CT LBB:4 Mercenary and welcome any one and everyone to update in light of the current Mongoose rules.

I will also be editing the LBB:4 stuff in light or real world developments - we are currently TL10 for tac missile and TL11 for drone technology

Comms and personal electronics are something that is likely to be in advance of what LBB:4 postulated.

 

[Sigtrygg]

So , let's take a look at TL8, with some liberties taken as you will see.

Infantry equipment - The assault rifle remains standard, but is supplemented by the laser carbine. The laser carbine has limited weapons potential, but is used primarily as a target designator and range finder. Ballistic cloth flak jackets are in universal use, with whole body cloth armour equipping front line infantry.
In-helmet communications, light amplification, and passive IR detection equipment are available, although not in universal use. Electronic sights are common on infantry assault rifles.

Infantry support - The RAM grenade replaces the early grenade launcher and most specialized anti-tank grenade launchers. Mortars are now capable of firing cluster bomblet rounds. The tac missile's guidance system now requires that the operator track only the target, not that he guide
the missile. Advanced forms of the tac missile incorporate laser target designation. Tac missiles now range up to 5 kilometers and incorporate follow-up IR sensors to achieve successive hits on composite armor as well as their own teleguidance.
Man-portable air defense missiles now have an effective range of 4 kilometers and a head-on engagement capability. Remotely piloted drones provide sensor capabilities and can be equipped with the equivalent of mortar rounds or RAM grenades.

Artillery - Weapons of 15 cm and larger can now deliver tactical nuclear devices, and guided rounds are available which home on laser painted targets. Towards the end of the period, teleguided munitions are introduced. The first computer fire control system is introduced with remote terminals placed with forward observers to speed response time and flexibility. Air defense artillery now includes man portable air defense missiles, some are heat seekers. Larger air defense missiles are more compact and lethal, and are available for forward area defense on selfpropelled chassis. Rapid fire radar directed auto-cannons provide most point defense.

Vehicles - Both horizontal and vertical stabilization are in use allowing firing of main armament of tanks at speeds up to 40 kph. Top speed for tanks is about 90 kph, with armored cars up to about 120 kph. Tank main armament is in the 10-15 cm range wlth more sophisticated battle computers. Many guns are smooth bores for firing high velocity fin stabilized rounds. Toward the middle of the period the first laser tanks are introduced, mounting a bulky pulse gatling-laser. Ablative anti-laser vehicle armor is available, as are anti-laser aerosols, although the latter are expensive. Most laser tanks mount coaxial auto-cannons to scrub ablative armor off target vehicles, thus limiting the effective range of the laser to that of the auto cannon. Composite armor with a high resistance to penetration is available, although its expense initially limits its use to main battle tanks (MBT).
A special piggy-back HEAP round is capable of achieving multiple hits on the same location, giving a limited composite armor defeating capability, but the primary means of knocking out MBT's becomes direct hits from high caliber HE rounds resulting in crew deaths from concusson.
The air/raft comes into limited military use as a utility transport craft.

So a bit more advanced, with the exception of the air/raft this could be the state of things within a few decades. Drone/robot/AI systems are the main breakthrough Traveller got wrong, and the adoption of individual electronic sights, comms, vision enhancement and AR displays.
There is also the noticeable lack of programable grenade launchers which the Chinese Army already have and the US military are introducing

 

[steelbrok]

IIRC LBB4: Mercenary had a breakdown of equipment by Tech Level with implications for how battles would be fought. Might be a bit dated but a good starting point for this.

 

[Sigtrygg]

That is what I am using, taken directly from the book, thing is some of the tech at TL10 and 11 already exists in real world militaries, so some updates are required, plus Mongoose has changed stuff as well.

 

[MasterGwydion]

I would love to join you all in this convo, but My Traveller Fu is not strong enough. Thank you for this topic though. I am sure I will learn many things that I did not know.

 

[rinku]

Quite dated as it turns out. No one foresaw cheap, portable drones. Some Autonomous vehicles maybe, but not recon using a toy you could pick up at a camera shop and control with your civilian phone.

 

[Condottiere]

To be fair, no one thought we'd be rather more reliant on basic artillery, either.

Or donkeys.

 

[Sigtrygg]

So what changes on the TL8 battlefield from today - drones have better AI, there are more anti drone measures, man portable missiles are a lot more effective, the 25-35mm programmable grenade launcher is included in infantry support weapons.

Artillery relies more on missiles and drones, is shoot and scoot, or even fires on the move.

What else, and what will be the next technology no one thought would have the impact it has (drones).

Will the next generation of chinese robots be battlefield capable?

 

[Condottiere]

James Cameron: Terminator, Aliens, and Avatar.

Terminator - autonomous mobile hunter killer.

Avatar - remote operations, biological.

Aliens - autonomous stationary gun sentry.

 

[MongooseMatt]

I will also be editing the LBB:4 stuff in light or real world developments - we are currently TL10 for tac missile and TL11 for drone technology

And here you bring up something that has been concentrating our minds a fair bit - tech advances in the real world over the past 20-odd years have kind of been kicking the TL progression's rear end. If we were to extrapolate from today's world, you would see a lot more use of drones (perhaps total, with manned systems only appearing in the extreme rear lines) and automated decision-making.

And that is not Traveller as we know it (works for 2300AD though). Traveller has always been, and will always be, about people. Ordinary people. So, bringing real world supposition about the nature of advanced (to us) technology and how that should affect Traveller is something that needs a great deal of careful thought. Reducing the size of computers is one thing. Eliminating people from conflict is a step too far.

There is also a strong argument to completely revise the TL system anyway, as it does have a rapid progression through what we call the 20th Century, and then stretches out many, many years after that. Not saying it needs to be linear, but their is currently a grouping of TLs that on the wider scheme of things may make little sense (it did in the 70s, not so much now).

However, that is a real can of worms that would require it riding on the back of a whole new edition of the game, and we are not even considering that right now, so...

At the current time, with regards to all of this, it is our thinking that we should let Traveller be Traveller. There are sacred cows of the game and setting that should not change, such as the week in jumpspace, slower-than-light comms... and that the focus of the game is very firmly fixed upon people. One path may be more 'realistic', but if it fundamentally changes Traveller, that is a backwards step.

Just some very, very surface thoughts on some very big issues, and we will be keenly watching this discussion to see where it goes!

 

[Condottiere]

Cats, dogs, living together.