Floating an idea: Battle groups

[emperorpenguin]

just some food for thought here's the battlegroups in the Centauri factbook

Castle Formation: 1-2 Primus, 4-8 Kutai, 6-12 Havens

Cavalry Formation: 2-4 Vorchans, 1 Balvarin, 1-3 Dargans, 6 Havens

Errant Formation: 1 Demos, 1-2 Dargans, 1-3 Havens

Tempest Group: 2 Octurians, 3 Balvarins, 4 Primus, 12 Vorchans, 8 Altarians, 2 Corvans

Cesti Group: 1 Octurian, 6 Primus, 18 Secundus, 24 Kutai

Harrier Group: 1 Primus, 4 Sulusts, 9 Dargans, 12 Darkners, 8 Centurions

Reaper Group: 2 Primus, 1 Balvarin, 4 Vorchans, 12 Kutai

Might generate some ideas....or not!

 

[Captain Kremmen]

Sounds interesting for a one off event.

Id still like to see some fleet composition rules/rarity levels in ships prevent people from taking entire fleets of variants, etc.

i would like to second that comment

most other rules have some restrictions against overtly unrealistic groupings of ships

K

 

[mthomason]

just some food for thought here's the battlegroups in the Centauri factbook
<snip>
Might generate some ideas....or not!

Thats perfect!

 

[Commador Q]

this might be a good way to replace the tournament list. It would be a lot easier to balance 3-5 battlegroups for each fleet than to try and balance every possible combination of ships.

although this should not be used in the context of a gampaigne.

 

[Chernobyl]

I like the idea; reminds me of the old company cards in Epic.

man, now you've got my brain working overtime...

I like it, because it encourages better fleet composition. I think it will make the game richer.

so, I picture a similiar system to the company card, support card, special card idea?

thoughts:

a company/task force card would be given 3 values: 1 PL above, 1PL below, and at PL. outside that the group isn't of the proper size for the engagement.

Add on-ships (support) might be restricted by PL of the battle, or by the PL of the task force, or not at all..."Special" ships would only be available on a one for one basis per task force. (no more fleet of Vaarls...)

yeah, I vote for it. if for nothing else, as a style of play, rather than as an official addendum. after its get playtest for a while maybe it can be brought into the fold, so to speak.

if you need help making up "army"cards, you know who to ask...! :lol:

Chernobyl

 

[Geekybiker]

I
a company/task force card would be given 3 values: 1 PL above, 1PL below, and at PL. outside that the group isn't of the proper size for the engagement.

Scouts would have to be a notable exception to something like that. As there are alot of patrol scouts that deffinately belong in large engaugements.

 

[Lord David the Denied]

I like SNJ's third idea best, but the task force card idea has merit, too.

 

[Chernobyl]

Right, I'm thinking scouts would come on "special" cards, and possibly some of the variants.

Chern

 

[mthomason]

I
a company/task force card would be given 3 values: 1 PL above, 1PL below, and at PL. outside that the group isn't of the proper size for the engagement.

Scouts would have to be a notable exception to something like that. As there are alot of patrol scouts that deffinately belong in large engaugements.

Oh, small ships that belong in large engagements, period. Thats another of the problems - people tend to gravitate towards a few large ships when in reality there would be numerous smaller support vessels as well.

The *cards* would be at the given level plus 1 above and 1 below, but I wouldn't exclude a war-level card from containing a whole host of skirmish and patrol-level ships

 

[Captain Kremmen]

Maybe the groups could be used in addition to the normal selection, like a set menu at a Chinese takeaway... you get better value for money (more FAP's worth) when choosing the set menu, but lose the versatility.

That is a VERY nice idea,

K

 

[Ripple]

I like the idea.

Not sure folks gravitate toward a few large ships. Most tournament fleets I've seen have a large number of smaller ships. Two of a lesser hull generally have more total firepower, more flexibly and with more total damage points.

I see a lot of spreading the PL's but not about the individual ships. This is a reasonably fast path right back to the fight your trying to solve. What folks will do is only choose the best out of the PL available. ie the Tertius, Prefect, Corvan squadrons.

I hate to be cautionary in a thread I wholeheartedly support as providing a wonderful alternative for running tourneys, special events or even one offs. More thought is going to have to be devoted to this idea before I can bring something positive to the party. Hopefully I'll have a chance soon to take the time. Really nice to see someone working on a great idea.

Ripple

 

[mthomason]

I hate to be cautionary in a thread I wholeheartedly support as providing a wonderful alternative for running tourneys, special events or even one offs.

If I didn't want constructive advice and even, dare I say, criticism - then I would not have posted

If it's not going to work because I didn't think of something, I'd rather someone told me so I can put it right.

 

[Reaverman]

what about really large battles?

 

[MustEatBrains]

what about really large battles?

You´d buy a whole fleet compsosition, buying additional support squadrons of smaller ships to complement the fleet points...

Going back to the comparison with Epic: While the original company cards of most armies told you what units you had to take if you used them, I remember that the tyranids (my original Epic army) were a little more flexible with what units they chose, as long as they kept to a certain organisation layout (you could field lots of tiny infantry, or loads of super-heavies; mostly just as you liked - armies were different that way, while still being balanced and diverse via the force organisation)...

Again, it makes me think of a B5 game in Fleet Action scale... :wink:

 

[mthomason]

Again, it makes me think of a B5 game in Fleet Action scale... :wink:

Yeah, you could have a whole Epic-scale battle in Armageddon, and call it Epic Arma... ah. Okay maybe not :lol:

 

[Lord David the Denied]

Nice... :lol:

For big battles I'd just say pick more task forces up to the agreed value. Maybe some bigger "fleet" cards could be done as well for huge games. Some kind of bulk purchase discount, perhaps...

 

[Chernobyl]

Sure, the "war level" task force would cost half as much in a "armageddon level" battle, so in theory War level is as high as you'd need. Then, bring in the Armageddon PL ships as specials...

Chern

 

[Reaverman]

Nice... :lol:

For big battles I'd just say pick more task forces up to the agreed value. Maybe some bigger "fleet" cards could be done as well for huge games. Some kind of bulk purchase discount, perhaps...

So you could have;

Errant Formation 1: 1 Demos, 2 Dargans, 3 Havens

Errant Formation 2: 1 Demos, 2 Dargans, 3 Havens

Errant Formation 3: 1 Demos, 2 Dargans, 3 Havens

Or with Narn;

Narn War Party 1: 6 Ka'tocs. 2 Thentus, 2 Sho'kar

Narn War Party 2: 6 Ka'tocs. 2 Thentus, 2 Sho'kar

Narn War Party 3: 6 Ka'tocs. 2 Thentus, 2 Sho'kar

Narn War Party 4: 6 Ka'tocs. 2 Thentus, 2 Sho'kar

Narn War Party 5: 6 Ka'tocs. 2 Thentus

 

[Hash]

Your Narn war party sounds suspiciously like your current Narn tourney fleet Reaverman...for the love of G'Quan don't give him a bonus for picking that! :twisted:

 

[Reaverman]

Your Narn war party sounds suspiciously like your current Narn tourney fleet Reaverman...for the love of G'Quan don't give him a bonus for picking that! :twisted:

Its just a suggestion, thats all :wink: