Do you use hull 4 ships?

[Celisasu]

I have to admit, while I don't play EA(EA needs more G'Quans before I consider them. ), I did like the look of the Olympus. Can't say much about it as we've only played a few casual games(other than Narn, we're stuck using cards out of the box. When I order the Centauri fleet box either tonight or tomorrow that'll hopefully change as soon as it arrives and I assemble it.....I do hope the Primuses are in better shape than the G'Quans though as far as assembly is concerned. Getting those upper and lower wings on is a royal pain in the ass. Plus half my G'Quans don't even have holes for the stands. :lol: ). Thus not much experience with a lot of ships in the game.


And I'm nominating the Sho'kos as my favorite hull 4 ship. Only because it's the first(and only) ship I've purchased from Mongoose that has no flash, dents, weird holes, missing holes, etc. :wink:

 

[Chernobyl]

Question: "Do you use hull 4 ships?"
Vree player: "Do I have a choice?"

Chern

 

[Tibour]

I can sum up my answer in just one word, Olympus. You want to see someone cry? Just bring 10 of them in a 5 point raid :twisted:

 

[JNG]

As much has I really prefer Hull 6, I'll use the occasionaly Hull 4 if there's no other choice or they're defended in some other way. For example, I love the Corvan despite the Hull 4 because the Stealth 4+ keeps them alive a lot longer than they oughta...mostly because people don't like wasting firepower and therefore don't shoot the lil guys unless there are no other targets in arc.

Besides Scouts, though, very rarely. The high damage/crew total and great firepower of an Olympus (and the fact that I don't much like anything else on the EA skirmish list) means I use a lot of those ships. One G'karith for area fighter-control ain't a terrible choice either.

But overall? Yeah, gimme a "brick" every damn time. Having played the Shadow Hunter Fleet from Hell a few times, I know damn well that anything less than Hull 6 costs you a lot, and Hull 4 is an automatic death sentence against the biggest guns in the game (Slicers, Lightning Cannons, Heavy Particle Cannons, Improved Neutron Lasers, etc).

 

[emperorpenguin]

So does anyone use Hull 4 ships that don't have the stealth or scout traits? Or as an initiative sink for a boresite fleet such as the Narn and Drazi? Sounds like other than the odd Vree and Drakh(who don't get a lot of choice about the matter) aside, hull 4 ships are only used if they have stealth.

I almost never do. If playing as Vree then you've no choice as Chern said

As Centauri I won't do it, even the darkner I'd rather the hull 5 or 6 ships

 

[Malarion]

I rarely use them, but then again theyre hard to find in the Narn fleet...... Dag'kars are kinda dunno, and G'Stens are skirmish lvl, Theyre good, but against the Ka'Tan from hell, pretty much nothing compares.....

 

[emperorpenguin]

In the narn fleet it's woryth taking one because of energy mines but the ka'toc,ka'tan and Thentus are better warships

 

[Malarion]

I simply dislike the fact that E-mines are anti-precise. Thats why i shy away from the Dag'kar, sure makes great for washing a Rothan to get rid of fighters, but if E-mines would do more damage, i might field one more often. I do have one, and it won me a game already ^^.

 

[Locutus9956]

Leshath 4tw.
How about hull 3 Vaarl's?

Stealth targets don't REALLY count as 'hull 4 ships' to me. Just about ANY stealth ship is highly fragile but its not the hull that keeps them safe. (That said the Leshath IS a great ship).

As for me, I DO like olympus and would use them in certain situations but most of the time Id swap two olympus for a Chronos or maybe a raid level Sag. I also like Tethys. Sure theyre tiny and weak and die almost instantly to any damage and have next to no weapons range... you know, Im not sure where Im going with this but I LIKE them anyway (in patrol and MAYBE a small skirmish level game (if nothing else theyre nippy little buggers that make good initiative sinks until your opponent decides to swat them )

 

[crucible_orc]

every ship has it's uses.. I frequently use Olympus and Xorrs when i play thier fleets. I Find most people tend for fire at larger ships of the have them in range, so your smaller ships are left open o explose flanks. hull 4 seems to make people think the ships aren't dangerous, but if you ignore them, then your jsut asking for somone to show you WHY you should never ignore ANY ship.

 

[tneva82]

So does anyone use Hull 4 ships that don't have the stealth or scout traits? Or as an initiative sink for a boresite fleet such as the Narn and Drazi? Sounds like other than the odd Vree and Drakh(who don't get a lot of choice about the matter) aside, hull 4 ships are only used if they have stealth.

Kutai and Darkner are requlary in my Centauri fleets. Both for same reason: Good speed and turns coupled with heavy firepower. Nice at flanking duties where you can avoid most of the beams(especially against EA).

 

[Lord David the Denied]

Problem there is the Vorchan is faster, better armed and better armoured than the Kutai. That little ship doesn't have a lot going for it, really...

 

[tneva82]

Problem there is the Vorchan is faster, better armed and better armoured than the Kutai. That little ship doesn't have a lot going for it, really...

It has dodge. Which increases survivability nicely. Especially against DD weapons since single dodge saves both points of damage from each hit.

 

[Lord David the Denied]

Dodge saves the entire hit. You only roll once for the entire attack.

 

[tneva82]

Dodge saves the entire hit. You only roll once for the entire attack.

Read the rules. That's what they are there for.

You roll once for each HIT.

Dodge is not renamed stealth.

 

[H]

Dodge saves the entire hit. You only roll once for the entire attack.

you re-roll per hit I believe, otherwise it would be way to powerful, almost like stealth

 

[Lord David the Denied]

Read the rules. That's what they are there for.

You roll once for each HIT.

Dodge is not renamed stealth.

"Whenever the ship suffers a hit, roll one die. If the die equals or exceeds the Dodge score listed for the ship, all effects of the attack are ignored. The ship has literally dodged the attack."

That's the rules for Dodge as printed in the Revised Boxed Set. See where it says "...all effects of the attack..." there? The attack is each weapon system firing at the ship. Not each point of damage scored by the attacking weapon.

Stealth, on the other hand, prevents the firing ship from rolling any attacks if it fails its stealth check. The two aren't difficult to tell apart.

 

[H]

so you are saying if I got 8 beam hits, my opponent only rolls 1 dodge for every beam hit, then one dodge for 6 pulsar hits, man thats Crap, EVERYone i know rolls per succesful hit, Dodge is now an all or nothing roll for each weapon system shooting then.

 

[Malarion]

Check again David.

It says:
"Whenever a ship suffers 'A HIT', roll one die.

It tells us whenever you siffer a single hit. A 6AD Matter cannon can score six hits, so you get 6 dodges.

When it goes down to "all effects" it pratcially means, that you dont get to check for crits or anything like that.


So keep rolling 6 dodges when you got 6 hits incoming, Dodge isnt stealth, only afterwards.........Dodge is dodge, and stealth is stealth.

 

[tneva82]

"Whenever the ship suffers a hit, roll one die. If the die equals or exceeds the Dodge score listed for the ship, all effects of the attack are ignored. The ship has literally dodged the attack."

That's the rules for Dodge as printed in the Revised Boxed Set. See where it says "...all effects of the attack..." there? The attack is each weapon system firing at the ship. Not each point of damage scored by the attacking weapon.

Yes. Notice the word HIT there? Then if you check shooting rules you notice that each invidual AD will result in INVIDUAL hits. They are not put into ONE hit consisting all damage but to separate hits. Dodge saves each hit. It saves each hit separatly.

All effects simply refer to ignoring hull damage, crew damage and criticals.

It's not all or nothing. Stop trying to twist rules in your favour(and this one isn't only one. DD/TD weapons don't ignore bulkheads completely btw...). That's poor sportmanship. Or worse...