daxos232 said:
Thanks for telling me where you got that information. Unfortunately I don't think I will be seeing it anytime soon, here in america. I keep forgetting most people on the forum are in europe or australia.
I'm still divided on how to implement this. Penalties to parrying and attacking for the long weapon user don't really balance out the lack of ability for a short weapon user to attack at all when not closed. But then again mrqII isn't really trying to be "balanced".
I think I will just leave it as is, but a new combat maneovere sounds good. I will leave that up to others more skilled than I.
Do note that weapons with a shorter range can still parry at the long range, and can if succesful use the change distance CM. Which gets you close up faster. Also you could disarm or trip your opponent, in which case getting closer to him would be no problem.
Also, it seems that unless you go full out with a two-hander, it seems longer reach weapons tend to deal slightly less damage, or have slightly fewer options than the shorter reach weapons.
All in all, this makes the evade skill immensely powerful in combat, since it is needed to close ranges, and to avoid attacks when you are close in.
Tamerlin said:
In our regular Kobudo training, we do a lot of paired training, and frequently that involves using a short weapon pair (e.g. tonfa, nunchiaku, sai) against a long weapon like a bo (ours are six feet long). The first thing that tends to take everyone by surprise once the person with the shorter weapon closes is how incredibly fast the short weapons seem when they're that close, and your bo is jammed up against you. Plus, we always use the shorter weapons in pairs, so the safest thing to do at that point is escape... but sometimes hammering the person with your bo is a good way to do that, if they don't have it locked up somehow. Parrying tends to be unlikely just because it's so difficult to maneuver a long weapon that close, so the only attack left tends to be a bash, followed by an escape.
That said, a solid bash can do quite a bit of damage if you get it in the right spot, unless the person's wearing armor. If that's the case, you're generally hoping to get them off balance enough to escape so that you can take advantage your reach and leverage again.
Another thing that tends to come up is how vulnerable your hands are on the staff, particularly when compared to sai and tonfa and the like, where the wielder's hands are far safer, though still not what I'd call safe.
Up close, hammering someone with the pommel of a greatsword would probably be quite a bit easier than with a bo or spear, regardless of whether or not you can get the point into the fray.
Well, what you tell me here is that RQ is pretty accurate, I keep thinking of such a fighter would come up and here is what I think will end up happening:
Alf is using a VL reach weapon (such as a halberd). While Tim is using a M reach War Sword, and a S reach Shield.
---First combat round---
Alf has 2 CA and Tim have 3 (2+1 for using two weapons).
Alf starts and engages to his VL distance of fighting. He attacks, gets a critical, Tim Parries with his Shield, and it is disarmed (Alf chooses to disarm it because he can get around the M warsword (with half damage though) if it should be used to parry).
Tim tries to engage to his distance (M distance), Alf decides to hit him with his halberd, thinking he can stop him with his halberd for trying such folly. Let's assume Tim wins this roll and engages Alf at his range.
Tim is now at his range, but since his last action was Evading, he can't attack. Therefore he instead decides to use his last CA to draw his back up Dagger.
---2nd combat round---
Tim has 3 CA (having 2 weapons again), Alf has 2
Alf has two options, he can try to get to his distance, and possibly making an opposed roll with his evade, but since his Evade isn't that good, he decides to go for it and swing at Tim. He swings and hits, but Tim parries, so Alf rolls damage and deals, 8 damage, halved so he deals 4 damage to Tim. Luckily Tim has enough armour to reduce this to merely a scratch.
Tim then goes and attacks with his longsword. Alf now has the decision to evade or not. Not wanting Tim to get a CM that could potentially Trip, Bleed or Impale him. He decides to evade, thinking that he will be able to use his next CA for getting away. Let's assume Tim hits, but doesn't get a CM. Full on damage to Alf deals 6 damage, Alf took heavy damage to his arm, and suffers a Serious Wound, passes his resilience, but he is distracted for 2 CAs (so the next 3 CA with the one from evading he can't attack, now is the time to run away).
Alas before Alf can act again, Tim has another CA left and attacks again. Alf is defenseless, and as Tim hits he can either decide to hit Alfs weakpoint (his damaged arm) and probably kill him. Let's assume he is a merciful fellow and decides to attempt a disarm, which we'll assume succeeds. Alf, heavily wounded, unarmed, and on the wrong distance to fight Tim, decides to surrender. The combat ends. Tim wins by having used his superior amount of CAs (and a little luck), to get close to Alf and damage him hard.
All in all this sums up why I think the reach issues are just fine. While the longer reach two-handers can some times cut down enemies before they get close, having an extra CA makes you able to get in close and finish the job without worrying about parries.
All in all I find it nicely balanced. Although with slight objections against a few of the weapons (Shortspear and Military Flail spring to mind as the best one hand weapons, and greatsword as the best two-hander due to that massive damage and huge size).
