Are the Minbari as bad as the Dilgar?
- Thread starter Greg Smith
- Start date
eldiablito
Mongoose
Only to extend the metaphor of the Dilgar War as WWII:
We never get to see the Dilgar people AFTER the war because they were wiped out. In Germany, many of the local population was mortified by their arrogance and (even today) are much of Germany is abhorant of their fascist past. Likewise, much of Japan see the decade preceding WWII and their eventual downfall is regarded as "the dark times". They are ashamed of what they did and thus, do not like to talk about it. Both Germany and Japan today are some of our greatest allies. This is possibly because of the decades of reconstruction after WWII.
This seems very close to the Minbari/ Earth relationship. After years of war and possible war crimes, the Minbari aid Earth's reconstruction and even help develop 2 of the most advanced vessels in the galaxy, the Excalibur and Victory!
So, should we hate all Minbari for their actions in a horrible and regrettable war? I guess we should also hate the current Porsche, VW, Yamaha and Kawasaki for the concentration camps of the 1940s....
We never get to see the Dilgar people AFTER the war because they were wiped out. In Germany, many of the local population was mortified by their arrogance and (even today) are much of Germany is abhorant of their fascist past. Likewise, much of Japan see the decade preceding WWII and their eventual downfall is regarded as "the dark times". They are ashamed of what they did and thus, do not like to talk about it. Both Germany and Japan today are some of our greatest allies. This is possibly because of the decades of reconstruction after WWII.
This seems very close to the Minbari/ Earth relationship. After years of war and possible war crimes, the Minbari aid Earth's reconstruction and even help develop 2 of the most advanced vessels in the galaxy, the Excalibur and Victory!
So, should we hate all Minbari for their actions in a horrible and regrettable war? I guess we should also hate the current Porsche, VW, Yamaha and Kawasaki for the concentration camps of the 1940s....
Just a quick note there were concentration camps around far before WWII but those were run by the winners and so aren't war crimes because the winners don't get put on trial. Hell there have been concentration camps since and even the allies had concentration camps during WWII. They where just called relocation camps or some such crap.
Where were all the expatriotes of the axis countries during the war in the allied countries. With a few exceptions they were locked in camps and treated like shit.
Where were all the expatriotes of the axis countries during the war in the allied countries. With a few exceptions they were locked in camps and treated like shit.
cthol24601
Mongoose
But the transforming of concentration camps into forced labour camps or death camps seemed to be a particularly Soviet, German and Japanese development of the older models which, while being occasionally neglectful, don't seem to be on whole as deliberately viscious. Since then of course such things have become unfortunately commonplace by most protagonists in wars. Particulrly those with a strong ethnic conflict bent.
As previously stated with the Dilgar though we never see them after the war because of the ironic and inadvertent genocide of the allies. There are some RPG exceptions though such as "Into the Crucible". I think though the Dilgar's actions in their war was approximate to the way Earther's have ated in similiar situations and I see no reason to see they wouldn't run the emotional and ethical gammut of every other race of B5. Indeed the total loss against inferior species would have to shake the ideological foundation of the regime to its core and in the long term I think lead to the kind of response seen by Germany and Japan after the war.
I think you'd also see the kinds of splits suffered by the Minbari with a large portion being shamed by their actions and another frustrated that they were held back and could have won if not betrayed by their civilian administration... (Kind of makes the Minbvari sound like the Germans after WWI...)
As previously stated with the Dilgar though we never see them after the war because of the ironic and inadvertent genocide of the allies. There are some RPG exceptions though such as "Into the Crucible". I think though the Dilgar's actions in their war was approximate to the way Earther's have ated in similiar situations and I see no reason to see they wouldn't run the emotional and ethical gammut of every other race of B5. Indeed the total loss against inferior species would have to shake the ideological foundation of the regime to its core and in the long term I think lead to the kind of response seen by Germany and Japan after the war.
I think you'd also see the kinds of splits suffered by the Minbari with a large portion being shamed by their actions and another frustrated that they were held back and could have won if not betrayed by their civilian administration... (Kind of makes the Minbvari sound like the Germans after WWI...)
eldiablito
Mongoose
Swampy said:
Academically true but the Dilgar were far closer to the Japanese and Germans in that time period than most. The USA, for all their spit and polish on WWII DID have camps for Japanese-Americans, but they did not flay the outspoken rebels like the Japanese did in China, nor did they do experiments on Jews like the Germans did in Eastern Europe.
Now, the actions of the Minbari DO resemble that previous comment: the Romans in Carthage. If I recall, the Roman General, after sacking and razing the city to the ground, wept for the loss of that beautiful city. So what if they were crocodile tears?!? There was at least some hint of self-awareness and the immorality of his actions.
Greg Smith
Mongoose
The Spanish used 're-concentration' camps in Cuba in the 1890s. The term concentration camp was coined by the British in the Boer war shortly afterwards. It originally applied to large prison camps where non-combatants were imprisoned or interned.
The Nazis used the phrase 'concentration camp' to cover up the fact that what they had instuted were essentally death camps.
'Concentration camp' is now synonymous with the Nazi death camps. But that wasn't it's original meaning.
The Nazis used the phrase 'concentration camp' to cover up the fact that what they had instuted were essentally death camps.
'Concentration camp' is now synonymous with the Nazi death camps. But that wasn't it's original meaning.
eldiablito
Mongoose
Well put Greg ...And let us not forget the "camps" that the Catholics used during the Inquisition... 
...Auto da fe... Acts of faith my a$$...
...Auto da fe... Acts of faith my a$$...
