Court Jester
Mongoose
Hammer of Ulric said:We start with the largest battleship of WW2, and arrive at medieval weapons.
Time to end this topic methinks.
yes sir... :roll:
:wink:
Hammer of Ulric said:We start with the largest battleship of WW2, and arrive at medieval weapons.
Time to end this topic methinks.
Yes, a good heavy crossbow. As opposed to the ordinary ones of around 150 lbs shooting quarrels half the length and double the weight of longbow arrows - with a shorter accurate range and virtually the same momentum. And with that loss of accuracy, they could only be aimed straight at the target, without the more lethal plunging shot of a longbow arrow.Lord David the Denied said:A good heavy crossbow or arbalest had a draw weight around 300lbs, about double the biggest longbows, and delivered a solid iron quarrel at much higher velocities. It both outranged the longbow and outperformed it as an armour-piercing weapon.
msprange said:I wonder if you and I have been at the same reference material. Thing is, I am not sure I entirely buy the conclusions. I have a feeling it is impossible to fully replicate a longbow and the arrows used so long ago, and there is just too much anecdotal evidence (stories) of the effect of the longbow.
Not convinced, not convinced. . .
Wulf Corbett said:Yes, a good heavy crossbow. As opposed to the ordinary ones of around 150 lbs shooting quarrels half the length and double the weight of longbow arrows - with a shorter accurate range and virtually the same momentum. And with that loss of accuracy, they could only be aimed straight at the target, without the more lethal plunging shot of a longbow arrow.
I didn't say that, I said the knight had more to fear from the longbow. Armour penetration is only one factor, and evidence is disputed. But when he's sitting in his invulnerable tin can, on top of his huge fleshy soft target he calls a horse and my archers call emergency rations, charging at full tilt with 100 of his buddies behind him, is he going to fear one crossbow bolt or a dozen longbow arrows? Put one 3 foot long ash shaft into that horse, and he'll be in the mud right in the path of the rest of his troop. A half-ton of warhorse WILL penetrate armour.Lord David the Denied said:Horses for courses, really, but saying the longbow was the better anti-armour weapon is just not correct.
Wulf Corbett said:I didn't say that, I said the knight had more to fear from the longbow. Armour penetration is only one factor, and evidence is disputed. But when he's sitting in his invulnerable tin can, on top of his huge fleshy soft target he calls a horse and my archers call emergency rations, charging at full tilt with 100 of his buddies behind him, is he going to fear one crossbow bolt or a dozen longbow arrows? Put one 3 foot long ash shaft into that horse, and he'll be in the mud right in the path of the rest of his troop. A half-ton of warhorse WILL penetrate armour.
Wulf
Actually, it's virtually impossible to effectively protect a horse from arrows. You can plate bard the head, neck, and back fore and aft of the saddle, but not the legs or flanks - too much movement is needed there. That's good against falling shot, but chain is the best you'll get on the flanks, and arrows just love chain... And meanwhile, you'll slow the horse down drastically. The cataphractoi were the heaviest ever horses, and could barely manage a trot. A bit like being charged by angry bulldozers...Lord David the Denied said:By the time the arbalest was in commun use, though, horses were well protected with plate barding, and longbows had largely fallen out of favour. It was the arbalest that did for these late medieval knights.
lol... awesome!Wulf Corbett said:A bit like being charged by angry bulldozers...
Wulf
Wulf Corbett said:Actually, it's virtually impossible to effectively protect a horse from arrows. You can plate bard the head, neck, and back fore and aft of the saddle, but not the legs or flanks - too much movement is needed there. That's good against falling shot, but chain is the best you'll get on the flanks, and arrows just love chain... And meanwhile, you'll slow the horse down drastically. The cataphractoi were the heaviest ever horses, and could barely manage a trot. A bit like being charged by angry bulldozers...
Wulf