What if we had a Traveller Setting like Medieval Europe?

[Tom Kalbfus]

I know the Imperium is your typical "Roman Empire" in Space, the Space Roman Trope. How would it be different if we modeled the political situation after what followed the Roman Empire, that is the Middle Ages, how come that is not as popular as the Roman Empire in Space or sometimes the Galactic Empire trope?

 

[simonh]

I think it's a case of influential early practicioners of the art having magnified influence on the later shape of the genre. Asimov set the agenda for SF in much the same way that Tolkien set it for fantasy, and Asimov wrote about galactic empires. He wasn't the first to do so, but he's certainly the most widely read of the golden age authors.

I don't really midnd it, and there are distinct advantages. after all if you posit a dominant space empire, you know there are always going to be border regions and areas beyond Imperial influence so it doesn't really close off all that many options. Conversely if you state up front that there is no Empire, that rules out adventures in an Imperial setting completely.

Also, consider that the actual world generation system in Traveller produces a map in which each world is assumed to have a completely separate government, complete with different law levels and even different technology. It produces a naturally balkanised and highly diverse region of space. Filing off the small bits of chrome that imply some kind of unified polity (naval bases and scout bases mostly) is pretty much effortless. I'd love to see you expand on the concept though.

Simon Hibbs

 

[Reynard]

Very true Simon. Generating sector without pre-supposing a overall galactic entity, I look at the individual worlds and group them based on technology, government and economic power creating big and small communities with particular personalities.

 

[Tom Kalbfus]

Very true Simon. Generating sector without pre-supposing a overall galactic entity, I look at the individual worlds and group them based on technology, government and economic power creating big and small communities with particular personalities.

But what if there was a Galactic Entity, but it now no longer exists, there are a bunch of successor states, that hold to the same traditions that the fallen Galactic Entity upheld, but the cultures of those successor states and languages have diverged somewhat, and there are also hordes of barbarians. (High tech Barbarians, but their attitude is barbaric) This is what I was thinking of a Medieval setting. Basically each successor state thinks it can rebuild that fallen empire with itself as the head of it, so there are constant wars as none of the states can quite succeed.

 

[Balfuset790]

Very true Simon. Generating sector without pre-supposing a overall galactic entity, I look at the individual worlds and group them based on technology, government and economic power creating big and small communities with particular personalities.

But what if there was a Galactic Entity, but it now no longer exists, there are a bunch of successor states, that hold to the same traditions that the fallen Galactic Entity upheld, but the cultures of those successor states and languages have diverged somewhat, and there are also hordes of barbarians. (High tech Barbarians, but their attitude is barbaric) This is what I was thinking of a Medieval setting. Basically each successor state thinks it can rebuild that fallen empire with itself as the head of it, so there are constant wars as none of the states can quite succeed.

More experienced Traveller players can correct me if I'm wrong about this, but isn't this the general feel that The Rebellion era of MegaTraveller had? Warring States seeking to pikc up the pieces after the fall of the Third Imperium?

 

[frostvarg]

that sounds alot like the 2048 setting

 

[Reynard]

The Rule of Man would be that 'Galactic Entity' followed by the Long Night representing the Dark Ages or Medieval period. The time of exploration and expansion thereafter would be a renaissance period.

I think the Rebellion Era was more being bombed back to the stone age with the destruction of electronics throughout the Imperium.

 

[Rick]

I think the idea of galactic nobility owed more to the Flandry books, as does the concept of the Long Night.
We have discussed some aspects of this in previous threads - ie using the Rebellion/New Era concept without Virus. It has a lot of potential - core pocket empires surrounded by a wilderness of lower/scavenged tech areas, where the long term goals are restoration/continuation of civilisation in your particular area.

 

[GypsyComet]

The New Era, Virus-based or not, meets the Middle Ages model fairly well, even including the Regency as the Byzantium analog. That period still had a "Roman Empire", it was just off to one side instead of being in the middle. Whether you want to equate the Dominate with the Moorish invasion of Spain is up to you, but the post-Dominate War period of 1248+ starts to look more Renaissance-like.

I'd keep the Virus around, since it makes those wilds actually dangerous instead of just bleak. YMMV. Post 1248, with yet another war having ravaged parts of the map, the increasing presence of the re-evolved Cyms helps take a lot of the sting out of the Virus Wilds.

That period bears another significant similarity to the late ME-early Renaissance Europe, in that the population has crashed. The Black War period of the Rebellion, Virus, and then the Dominate War, have between them wiped most of the high population worlds off the map everywhere except Regency space. it is quite possible that whole sectors can't meet the population of Terra, or Rhylanor, Mora, and Glisten. The ten-thousand year primacy of Vland is *over*.

 

[phavoc]

I would say there are a lot of parallel's between the Medieval Europe model and Traveller.

The Emperor (King) has the overall responsibility to govern the entire Imperium (kingdom). Nobles (same) have fiefdoms locally and are beholden to the Emperor (King) to help keep the Imperium (kingom) together. They have titles & wealth so that they have vested interests in doing so. The planets (lands) will have the entire range of governments. Each of the planets (lands) is more or less responsible for local defense, and during times of conflict may have local defense forces (levies) added to the larger army to fight. The people (serfs?) have certain inalienable rights.

In a lot of ways it's more medieval than Roman. Romans didn't really go for the royal class as much as the medieval Europe did. But they still had various class levels that ruled. Traveller would be more late medieval times, where the serfs were not bound to the land and the merchant class had much more clout and influence. Then again, most all human societal models has allowed wealth to be a great influencer.

 

[dragoner]

The 3I is more the Roman style Dux Bellorum "nobility", military dictatorship; than the later religious warlords that evolved from it in medieval Europe.

 

[Condottiere]

Actually, it feels more like the Renaissance than the Roman Empire.

Natural paranoia of being First Among Equals made the Imperator neuter the Patricians, the only ones that had the social and political standing to replace him on the throne, assuming they didn't want to recreate the Republic instead.

The Imperium seems more layered, with Nobility, Bureaucracy, Imperial counter intelligence, the Army and the Navy, requiring mutual cooperation in order to instigate a coup. What's missing seems to be the religious element.

 

[dragoner]

Imperator, is just a General, but really, after the mid millennium rebellion, where Emperors were declared by right of fleet control, there isn't a difference. In the medieval and renaissance times, it was divine right and only divine right, pretty much. The Imperial use of duty nobles is much more like Rome's Dux Bellorum system, even the Byzantines kept the spirit of the republic alive. The way the 3I dies is also somewhat congruent with the Roman system and how it self destructed.

 

[ShawnDriscoll]

I know the Imperium is your typical "Roman Empire" in Space, the Space Roman Trope. How would it be different if we modeled the political situation after what followed the Roman Empire, that is the Middle Ages, how come that is not as popular as the Roman Empire in Space or sometimes the Galactic Empire trope?

I don't see why planets couldn't still have medieval settings in the 3rd-Imperium setting.

 

[Tom Kalbfus]

The Rule of Man would be that 'Galactic Entity' followed by the Long Night representing the Dark Ages or Medieval period. The time of exploration and expansion thereafter would be a renaissance period.

I think the Rebellion Era was more being bombed back to the stone age with the destruction of electronics throughout the Imperium.

Actually, I think the Rule of Man would be analogous to Alexander's Empire, The Third Imperium would be the Romans.

 

[Gypsy Knights Games]

I know the Imperium is your typical "Roman Empire" in Space, the Space Roman Trope. How would it be different if we modeled the political situation after what followed the Roman Empire, that is the Middle Ages, how come that is not as popular as the Roman Empire in Space or sometimes the Galactic Empire trope?

Do you mean a setting where there is no Empire controlling everything? Where every system has its own culture and government and is, generally, looking out for their own system first?

If so, there is one. It is right here.

 

[locarno24]

Fading Suns has quite a medieval feel to it, as well - as does Dune (at least Pre-Paul Atreides messing up the universe).

There's no reason you couldn't have a medieval feel even in a third Imperium traveller - just make the Imperial Nobility much more hereditary, and increase the power of and quantity of local nobles relative to the central authority (including 'imperium-wide' organisations) - such that the system fleets, and subsector fleets, and noble huscarls form the majority of the Imperium's fighting power, not the Imperial Navy.

This also moves more towards a universe where most ships are sub-capital vessels, which I generally prefer..

 

[Rikki Tikki Traveller]

I believe there are several people working on such a "Recovering from the Great Empire's Collapse" type of setting. Not sure how far along they are as the ones I know about are hoping to publish something.