Weapons in Mercenary

[MadDog]

Color me a little confused here.

Are the "carbines" described in Mercenary really supposed to be SMG ? There is otherwise a glaring lack of SMG in either book.

Furthermore, what skill do you use to fire some of these weapons ?

Pistol skill when using a carbine ? What about 2 handed use ?

Does a LMG require Assault Weapon skill, or does the "Assault Weapon" listing in the table mean it has the range brackets of an assault weapon ?

Mad Dog

 

[RandyT0001]

Well don't look at the field artillery rules on p.104 and the support weapons on p.105 and find out the maximum range for the best MRL's is 1.5 kilometers. And according to a brief statement they were designed from the onset to have those handicapped ranges.

 

[Cleon the Mad]

Well don't look at the field artillery rules on p.104 and the support weapons on p.105 and find out the maximum range for the best MRL's is 1.5 kilometers. And according to a brief statement they were designed from the onset to have those handicapped ranges.

I'm trying to figure out how your reply answers the OP's question to be honest. What does that have to do with his questions about carbines at all? Anyway, there's already threads discussing what you mentioned, why turn his question into another?




To actually answer the OP, if I recall right they add a subskill with Mercenary, I think it's "Gun Combat (Slug Carbine)". I don't have my book in front of me but I'm pretty sure that's it. My take is the stats for one handed use are just modifications to the recoil and so forth, not a change in skill used.

I'd have to look at the actual weapon listing and all of the Gun Combat skills to answer your question about LMG's. But just going by memory, I think "Assault weapon" is it's range but not sure on that at all.

 

[Emperor Herdan]

Color me a little confused here.

Are the "carbines" described in Mercenary really supposed to be SMG ? There is otherwise a glaring lack of SMG in either book.

Furthermore, what skill do you use to fire some of these weapons ?

Pistol skill when using a carbine ? What about 2 handed use ?

Does a LMG require Assault Weapon skill, or does the "Assault Weapon" listing in the table mean it has the range brackets of an assault weapon ?

Mad Dog

Yes the carbines replace the SMG's (Thats why there are 2 recoil listed. One for 2 hands, 1 for 1 handed use.

Skill is Gun Combat (Slug Carbine)

the LMG uses the heavy weapon skill (I would use the man portable sub-skill). And the LMG uses the range and modifiers for assault weapons.

Take care

E. Herdan

 

[collins355]

the LMG uses the heavy weapon skill (I would use the man portable sub-skill). And the LMG uses the range and modifiers for assault weapons.

Take care

E. Herdan

Which is an extraordinary design decision. A light machine gun in MGT becomes less accurate (and hence effective) at ranges exceeding fifty metres than an antique rifle/rifle/autorifle. Do the authors believe an LMG is something like an SMG/carbine only for close in work? This runs completely contrary to the purpose of an LMG as providing a base of fire covering maneuver elements.

It is these kind of flaws that really expose Mercenary from a gameplay perspective, rather than some of the more commonly cited complaints about flaming balls of plasma, etc.

 

[Shiloh]

...the purpose of an LMG as providing a base of fire covering maneuver elements.

It is these kind of flaws that really expose Mercenary from a gameplay perspective, rather than some of the more commonly cited complaints about flaming balls of plasma, etc.

I sincerely doubt that the author(?s?) of Mercenary have any real idea about the military/tactical uses of the weapons they include. Perhaps this is a foul calumny, but on the evidence of Mercenary, I have difficulty concluding otherwise.

 

[klingsor]

I think we are all agreed that Mercenary does have its flaws. What we really need to do is patch it – such as new weapon stats that better reflect both reality and the settings – both core and potential.

Ranges for the lower tech items (<=8) can be worked out from easily available sources and the higher TL items extrapolated from those. The South Africans produced a 20mm rifle so even the LAG is real.

One change is going to be immediately apparent: artillery, even the small end stuff like mortars that PCs might run into is very, very dangerous indeed. This is unavoidable, Traveller is a somewhat realistic game, if you want to run through a stonk then you would be better off playing a superhero game.

 

[Emperor Herdan]

...the purpose of an LMG as providing a base of fire covering maneuver elements.

It is these kind of flaws that really expose Mercenary from a gameplay perspective, rather than some of the more commonly cited complaints about flaming balls of plasma, etc.

I sincerely doubt that the author(?s?) of Mercenary have any real idea about the military/tactical uses of the weapons they include. Perhaps this is a foul calumny, but on the evidence of Mercenary, I have difficulty concluding otherwise.

Just to clarify things (or muddy depending upon your point of view) I did not write that "the purposes of an LMG as providing..." That was written by Collins355.

I agree with klingsors' thoughts. With my background, I cannot suspend my disbelief of some of the items (and stats) in Mercenary. What I am doing is that I'm treating them as if they are akin to the WWII German/Russian battlefield Infantry Guns* (and not true "artillery" as most of us know it).

Take care

E. Herdan

* IG were very short ranged artillery pieces, usually of large bore (eg 150mm) but short calibre (eg 1 m barrel length) and were able to be used / pushed across the battlefield by 2 persons, fired (slowly) by 1. A tactical weapon rather than strategic... Do your own research as my memory isn't the best /salute

 

[klingsor]

Infantry guns!
What a clever idea. It makes sense too for limited small scale merc actions.

 

[MadDog]

Ahh, I see the new specialization in Mercenary for slug carbines. One wonders why a laser carbine doesnt have its own skill.

Of course, I thought the breakdowns in skill specializations is kind of odd anyway.

I also agree that some of the weapon stats are pretty odd.

Mad Dog

 

[klingsor]

Odd stats seem to be par for the course in any RPG. the Glocks and MP5s in STOCS were good because Eoin, the author, liked them.

It is a very, very difficult thing to model. Damage in particular causes a lot of hoo-ha in the real world with a lot of strongly held and radically different opinions in competition.

 

[atpollard]

It is a very, very difficult thing to model. Damage in particular causes a lot of hoo-ha in the real world with a lot of strongly held and radically different opinions in competition.

I suggest a duel to settle the issue definitively.

 

[rust]

Unfortunately they call this kind of duel to test weapon designs a "war"
in the real world ... :shock:

 

[SSWarlock]

Unfortunately they call this kind of duel to test weapon designs a "war"
in the real world ... :shock:

Naw. Weapons tests are known as "police actions". Optimizing weapons design is called a "war". Gotta use up all the Mark 1 inventory to get some good statistical analysis on performance first. :wink:

 

[Jame Rowe]

...the purpose of an LMG as providing a base of fire covering maneuver elements.

It is these kind of flaws that really expose Mercenary from a gameplay perspective, rather than some of the more commonly cited complaints about flaming balls of plasma, etc.

I sincerely doubt that the author(?s?) of Mercenary have any real idea about the military/tactical uses of the weapons they include. Perhaps this is a foul calumny, but on the evidence of Mercenary, I have difficulty concluding otherwise.

I would suggest that all the items be gone through and rewritten, especially where TL is concerned.

An ATGT, at TL-15, absolutely WILL NOT BE TRACKED - at TL-15 it darned well better be GRAV.

 

[MadDog]

While we could argue endlessly on the extent of the difference in damage, I think we could all agree on a rough general progression on damage:

pistols < SMG < assault rifle < battle rifle <~ machinegun << heavy weapons.

As is, its a little disconcerting that I can shoot your average shmoe with a light anti-tank rocket (TL6) and he will live most of the time.

A typical schmoe with a bullet proof vest will survive getting hit with an ANTI TANK gun !

Yet, a guy in combat armor + a Protec suit has a better armor rating than a tank ("hovertrak").

Just some weird disconnects there.

Mad Dog

 

[Delerium]

Mercenary, Weapons therein.

Don't get me started...

 

[Stainless]

Looks like a classic case where the OGL may come to the rescue. Anyone working on a thrid-party supplement by any chance?

 

[collins355]

Looks like a classic case where the OGL may come to the rescue. Anyone working on a thrid-party supplement by any chance?

Given the previous indications on this board from Mongoose that they have a weapons design sequence they are holding in reserve, that seems like a waste of time. Why spend ages drafting up an OGL booklet of more realistic weapons/vehicles only to find Mongoose releases a designers handbook that is contrary to your design decisions making your OGL booklet an anachronism?

 

[rust]

Given the previous indications on this board from Mongoose that they have a weapons design sequence they are holding in reserve, that seems like a waste of time.

Plus, given the dozens of opinions and debates about weapons both in
the real world and in roleplaying games, a majority of potential buyers
would probably hate it and consider it crap anyway. :roll:

If I would ever decide to write something of that kind (which is highly
unlikely, at least as long as I remain sane ...), I would definitely not
publish it under my real name ... :lol: