Vorlons cant jump point bomb in 2nd Ed? Scout needed?

[H]

I think the few in question are the design team.
The argument being "it is canon"
at the end of the day, they design the game, so if they put it in, they put it in, all we as mere players and purchasers can do is house rule it back out again, OR allow it, like in the show, to be performed by an elite crew, on the best warship in the galaxy, in a confined space at a pre-determined point.

 

[Da Boss]

oh, no matter what, I intend continuing to play the races I play now, and will not be buying any ISA, nor Minbari for that matter. I hope to bulk out my Brakiri with the new ships, and may one day own a drakh mothership too!

I just don't want to see the ISA beefed up ridiculously to become a new cheese fleet, but with the changes, their +1 crew quality may do just that!

best chance to AJP bomb of anyone, scout on their main warship, best chance to caf of anyone, as well as doing their own scout lockons if you don't caf.. Forward arc whitestars when they are clearly boresight in the show, able to take ships from any allied fleet. . .

Well at least CAF/Scout doesn't work on their beams!!!!!

 

[CZuschlag]

Why not?

I don't remember that bit.

 

[Burger]

Beams can't get re-rolls from CAF or scouts in 2e.
Scouts do help beams when fighting stealth ships, though...!

 

[CZuschlag]

Confirming then ---

The Drakh Scout is just about totally pointless in 2e.

Right?

 

[H]

he will lower stealth, and get re-rolls for any secondaries that may not be twin linked.

 

[Da Boss]

Confirming then ---

The Drakh Scout is just about totally pointless in 2e.

Right?

Well apart from above reducing Stealth - oh and the re rolls for set up and first turn and of course Jump point bombing!? :lol:

Least they get one - por old Vorlons (well they are old)

 

[Burger]

I'd like to see more scout abilities in 2e. For example, ECM... removing an enemy scout's stealth reduction or redirect fire. And other interesting things, too. Dunno if any will actually make it in, though.

 

[CZuschlag]

With a Mothership, you have an initiative of +6. You rarely, if every, really need a reroll for a Scout given that.

If you think AJP bombing is stupid, cheeseball, and verging on unethical, you won't do it.

There is only 2 secondary batteries in the entire Drakh fleet that isn't Twin-Linked -- and one is on the heretofore pointless Fast Destroyer! (The Light Cruiser's Pulse systems are the other.)

I'll tell you who got brutal -- the Centauri (again!). They now get CAF for free when everyone else has to work hard for it with the Twin-Linked DD Ion Cannons. And beams can't get it at all.

Almost all your fleet engages at range 8 (+1 stealth), and you get an additional +1 vs. stealth for being Drakh in the first place.

So what, again, does that Scout help you with that you already don't handle?

Oh, right.

That'd be precisely ..... nothing. The Drakh even already have built-in initiative sinks.

Priceless.

EDIT:

And oh, yeah .... Vorlons would get a scout just in time to .... never ever use it! You can't use scout with a beam system....

I don't think this does anything useful in and of itself for the Vorlon.

 

[Locutus9956]

The point is though that many people DONT think Jump point bombing is cheeseball/unethical/stupid. It is in my eyes a perfectly legitimate tactic, its just far far too EASY to do. I have no problem with people using it against me or vice versa but you should have to really work for it (make it as hard to pull off as ramming is currently for example!)

 

[Reaverman]

With a Mothership, you have an initiative of +6. You rarely, if every, really need a reroll for a Scout given that.

If you think AJP bombing is stupid, cheeseball, and verging on unethical, you won't do it.

There is only 2 secondary batteries in the entire Drakh fleet that isn't Twin-Linked -- and one is on the heretofore pointless Fast Destroyer! (The Light Cruiser's Pulse systems are the other.)

I'll tell you who got brutal -- the Centauri (again!). They now get CAF for free when everyone else has to work hard for it with the Twin-Linked DD Ion Cannons. And beams can't get it at all.

Almost all your fleet engages at range 8 (+1 stealth), and you get an additional +1 vs. stealth for being Drakh in the first place.

So what, again, does that Scout help you with that you already don't handle?

Oh, right.

That'd be precisely ..... nothing. The Drakh even already have built-in initiative sinks.

Priceless.

EDIT:

And oh, yeah .... Vorlons would get a scout just in time to .... never ever use it! You can't use scout with a beam system....

I don't think this does anything useful in and of itself for the Vorlon.

IMHO the Scouts in the Drakh fleet are next to useless. You could replace the scout with raiders, rather than try to reduce stealth.

 

[Da Boss]

With a Mothership, you have an initiative of +6. You rarely, if every, really need a reroll for a Scout given that..

depends on what level you are fighting, Minbari and Centauri can get +5/+6 with Command, and if you are fighting Shadows..............

If you think AJP bombing is stupid, cheeseball, and verging on unethical, you won't do it..

Quite true

There is only 2 secondary batteries in the entire Drakh fleet that isn't Twin-Linked -- and one is on the heretofore pointless Fast Destroyer! (The Light Cruiser's Pulse systems are the other.).

Don't know if that is still true or not.............
I'll tell you who got brutal -- the Centauri (again!). They now get CAF for free when everyone else has to work hard for it with the Twin-Linked DD Ion Cannons. And beams can't get it at all..[/quote]
Yes and beams keep hitting on 4+ all the time - which is potentially very nasty - try it instead of present rules.......

Almost all your fleet engages at range 8 (+1 stealth), and you get an additional +1 vs. stealth for being Drakh in the first place..

true but you can still fail - eg my battle report where the Octurion couln't see the Sharlin at less than 8" for three whole turns with its stealth reduced by my Ocrvan and that has happened more than once...........[/quote]

So what, again, does that Scout help you with that you already don't handle?

Oh, right.

That'd be precisely ..... nothing. The Drakh even already have built-in initiative sinks.

Priceless.

Its an option and some still don't get that option...........

 

[Reaverman]

The point is though that many people DONT think Jump point bombing is cheeseball/unethical/stupid. It is in my eyes a perfectly legitimate tactic, its just far far too EASY to do. I have no problem with people using it against me or vice versa but you should have to really work for it (make it as hard to pull off as ramming is currently for example!)

Its Cheesey, when its too easy to accomplish.

 

[CZuschlag]

I should take this rant to another thread so I don't hijack this one. Sorry, everybody.

Vorlons Jump Bombing .... discuss.

 

[Valen is my name]

what S&P cn the drakh be found in?

 

[Burger]

The point is though that many people DONT think Jump point bombing is cheeseball/unethical/stupid. It is in my eyes a perfectly legitimate tactic, its just far far too EASY to do. I have no problem with people using it against me or vice versa but you should have to really work for it (make it as hard to pull off as ramming is currently for example!)

Its Cheesey, when its too easy to accomplish.

Too easy, and risk-free. It costs nothing to attempt to JP bomb, there is no risk involved. Introduce risk, and it will happen less often (which is the way it should be).

what S&P cn the drakh be found in?

Not S&P, a separate book.

 

[Da Boss]

I should take this rant to another thread so I don't hijack this one. Sorry, everybody.

Vorlons Jump Bombing .... discuss.

Any word from the Powers that Be? Do the Vorlons get a Scout ship (much better than yet another "special " rule.............)

 

[Reaverman]

The point is though that many people DONT think Jump point bombing is cheeseball/unethical/stupid. It is in my eyes a perfectly legitimate tactic, its just far far too EASY to do. I have no problem with people using it against me or vice versa but you should have to really work for it (make it as hard to pull off as ramming is currently for example!)

Its Cheesey, when its too easy to accomplish.

Too easy, and risk-free. It costs nothing to attempt to JP bomb, there is no risk involved. Introduce risk, and it will happen less often (which is the way it should be).

what S&P cn the drakh be found in?

Not S&P, a separate book.

Well I was going to mention that too, but then I'd invoke the wrath of the Fanboys who think otherwise

 

[thePirv]

Ramming happens or is at least attempted in the show many times (way more than the JP bomb at any rate) but is insanely harder to do than a JP bomb.
Is t just me or does anyone else think that this is just stupid?

 

[Reaverman]

Ramming happens or is at least attempted in the show many times (way more than the JP bomb at any rate) but is insanely harder to do than a JP bomb.
Is t just me or does anyone else think that this is just stupid?

I thought it was blatant obvious 'Pirv', all starships in the B5 universe use 'Cheddarite' reactors. When the captains call for ramming, they have to fight the 'Navicom'. Since it mis-Interprets the command, and tries to JP bomb :twisted: