angelus2000
Mongoose
A thread to throw down all the yays and nays about changes to 3rd age EA.
Yays!!!
1. Avenger. Its at Raid! and it didn't lose hardly anything. Same fighters, nearly the same stats. Now a completely valid choice even for those that don't use fighters heavily. More importantly, the fighter deployment changes means all of its fighter can be out by second turn, and the Fleet Carrier recovery traits is now good on all fighters, not just its own ( Not sure about the last bit, might have been reading the rules wrong). The real winner of the 2e changes if your fighter happy.
2. Posiedon! More fighter goodness! Hull 5! Bigger nastier guns! Did I mention the 6 extra fighter flights?
3. Warlock back to war! Nuff said.
4. Artemis! I play 3rd Age EA, but this little bugger is now ridiculous. I had 2 pairs of these romping around the middle of a Vree fleet, they accounted for more damage to the Vree than even my omegas and Novas. I expect to hear the whistling of the Nerf bat soon..
5. Olympus! Virtually unchanged, but its no longer Beam bait!
6. More Broadside AD. I very much enjoy this change. Pulse Omegas are now ridiculous, Novas gained more AD as well. Hyperions got mroe viable Arcs now too, as its no longer F arc as dependent. The Command Omega benefitted more from this than any other ship.
7. Fighters! If 3rd Age was heavily fighter oriented before, its even more so now. Avengers are more easily taken, Posiedon got more of them. Even Patrol Wings have more flights (? I think). Only the Gaim can beat EA in this category now, and thats due to sheer numbers rather than quality. Hull 5 on Auroras is a huge improvement
8. Fighter Speeds! Both Auroras and T-Bolts gained 2 inchs of movement.
9. Badger Starfury! Quite nice from stats veiwpoint, I'd expect these to be a tourney and campaign fave due to its flexibility, for one off games Tbolts and Auroras are the better choice.
10. Omegas/Command Omegas! If you thought these were beastly before, you'll be drooling like I did upon seeing the stats. Omega gained Beam Dice, evened out the pulse cannon dice between P/F/S, and picked up some Mini beam in the P/S arcs. Command Omega got nothing but weapons improvements, its raw damage potential is staggering now. Lumbering trait kinda sucks, but not as big of a disadvantage as it is with the Nova.
Nays!!
1. Novas! I was really hoping this ship would get better, IMO its now the worst choice in Raid PL and worse in 2e than it was in 1e. The amount of things left unchanged or degraded is not made up by the improvements. Very hard to justify using 2 of these now over a Hyperion and Avenger. Lumbering especially hurts now.
2. Afterburners! Wah, I want them back. Not really a nay though, keeping track of which fighters had afterburned was a pain, and the 2 extra inchs of normal speed makes up for it.
3. Ship choices! The 3rd Age list is the smallet of three, it was like that in 1e, but even more so in 2e. Only the Omega at battle, most of the raid and Skirmish variants are gone, though the base line ships themselves are much better. Only War level gained in improvement, gaining the Warlock. I'd expect so see future 3rd EA lists to be heavily concentrated in the Battle/War PL range
4. Light Laser Cannons on Omegas! Still haven't quite figured what to do with these. Only 4 AD and SL, the Mini Beam and extra range are nice. Not really a Nay!, more like a WTF!, if they werent SL easily a Yay!
5. Anti-Fighter trait! Farily prevalent in Early and Crusade Era, seems to be lacking in 3rd age to a large degree. Not a big wrinkle though, as its even easier to field fighters now, and the starfury has now the speed to intercept almost anything.
6. Dodge 3+ on T-Bolts. What the Aurora gained, the T-Bolt lost. If the loss of Dodge on Tbolts was done to justify the Hull 5 on Auroras, I'd much rather it back to the old Arma stats.
Summary.
By and large I love the improvements. More and better fighters, the emphasis on P/S arcs over F arc, the Warlock back etc etc. I loved playing the only real EA Fleet list, and almost eveything is an improvement. Great Job!
However I did say.. . almost everything. My only serious rankle and whiff of nasty is the Nova. 2 AD more in the P/S arc do not justify the Lumbering trait in any way, shape, or form. Hoping for Hull 6? Nope. More Damage? nope. AP or DD? Nope. More range ? Nope. More inteceptors? nope. Its 2 real advantages in 1e were its fighters, which got seriosuly eaten away by the Avenger move, and its P/S broadsides, which is now questionable as its much harder to get into a position were its useful due to Lumbering. Either give it Hull 6 (which I think it should have always had), increase its Damage/Crew track (its very nearly as big as an Omega), or reduce the AD back to 12 and give it AP. Something, anything. The only real bonus it got in 2e is that its not as easy to kill with Beams, and thats a mere side effect, not an intentional change.
Yays!!!
1. Avenger. Its at Raid! and it didn't lose hardly anything. Same fighters, nearly the same stats. Now a completely valid choice even for those that don't use fighters heavily. More importantly, the fighter deployment changes means all of its fighter can be out by second turn, and the Fleet Carrier recovery traits is now good on all fighters, not just its own ( Not sure about the last bit, might have been reading the rules wrong). The real winner of the 2e changes if your fighter happy.
2. Posiedon! More fighter goodness! Hull 5! Bigger nastier guns! Did I mention the 6 extra fighter flights?
3. Warlock back to war! Nuff said.
4. Artemis! I play 3rd Age EA, but this little bugger is now ridiculous. I had 2 pairs of these romping around the middle of a Vree fleet, they accounted for more damage to the Vree than even my omegas and Novas. I expect to hear the whistling of the Nerf bat soon..
5. Olympus! Virtually unchanged, but its no longer Beam bait!
6. More Broadside AD. I very much enjoy this change. Pulse Omegas are now ridiculous, Novas gained more AD as well. Hyperions got mroe viable Arcs now too, as its no longer F arc as dependent. The Command Omega benefitted more from this than any other ship.
7. Fighters! If 3rd Age was heavily fighter oriented before, its even more so now. Avengers are more easily taken, Posiedon got more of them. Even Patrol Wings have more flights (? I think). Only the Gaim can beat EA in this category now, and thats due to sheer numbers rather than quality. Hull 5 on Auroras is a huge improvement
8. Fighter Speeds! Both Auroras and T-Bolts gained 2 inchs of movement.
9. Badger Starfury! Quite nice from stats veiwpoint, I'd expect these to be a tourney and campaign fave due to its flexibility, for one off games Tbolts and Auroras are the better choice.
10. Omegas/Command Omegas! If you thought these were beastly before, you'll be drooling like I did upon seeing the stats. Omega gained Beam Dice, evened out the pulse cannon dice between P/F/S, and picked up some Mini beam in the P/S arcs. Command Omega got nothing but weapons improvements, its raw damage potential is staggering now. Lumbering trait kinda sucks, but not as big of a disadvantage as it is with the Nova.
Nays!!
1. Novas! I was really hoping this ship would get better, IMO its now the worst choice in Raid PL and worse in 2e than it was in 1e. The amount of things left unchanged or degraded is not made up by the improvements. Very hard to justify using 2 of these now over a Hyperion and Avenger. Lumbering especially hurts now.
2. Afterburners! Wah, I want them back. Not really a nay though, keeping track of which fighters had afterburned was a pain, and the 2 extra inchs of normal speed makes up for it.
3. Ship choices! The 3rd Age list is the smallet of three, it was like that in 1e, but even more so in 2e. Only the Omega at battle, most of the raid and Skirmish variants are gone, though the base line ships themselves are much better. Only War level gained in improvement, gaining the Warlock. I'd expect so see future 3rd EA lists to be heavily concentrated in the Battle/War PL range
4. Light Laser Cannons on Omegas! Still haven't quite figured what to do with these. Only 4 AD and SL, the Mini Beam and extra range are nice. Not really a Nay!, more like a WTF!, if they werent SL easily a Yay!
5. Anti-Fighter trait! Farily prevalent in Early and Crusade Era, seems to be lacking in 3rd age to a large degree. Not a big wrinkle though, as its even easier to field fighters now, and the starfury has now the speed to intercept almost anything.
6. Dodge 3+ on T-Bolts. What the Aurora gained, the T-Bolt lost. If the loss of Dodge on Tbolts was done to justify the Hull 5 on Auroras, I'd much rather it back to the old Arma stats.
Summary.
By and large I love the improvements. More and better fighters, the emphasis on P/S arcs over F arc, the Warlock back etc etc. I loved playing the only real EA Fleet list, and almost eveything is an improvement. Great Job!
However I did say.. . almost everything. My only serious rankle and whiff of nasty is the Nova. 2 AD more in the P/S arc do not justify the Lumbering trait in any way, shape, or form. Hoping for Hull 6? Nope. More Damage? nope. AP or DD? Nope. More range ? Nope. More inteceptors? nope. Its 2 real advantages in 1e were its fighters, which got seriosuly eaten away by the Avenger move, and its P/S broadsides, which is now questionable as its much harder to get into a position were its useful due to Lumbering. Either give it Hull 6 (which I think it should have always had), increase its Damage/Crew track (its very nearly as big as an Omega), or reduce the AD back to 12 and give it AP. Something, anything. The only real bonus it got in 2e is that its not as easy to kill with Beams, and thats a mere side effect, not an intentional change.
