The Future of the Conan rpg

[Teodric]

My only issue with MRQ2 would be that it would be hard to be the uber-barbarian laying waste to scores of foes since the sysem in itself is rather deadly/"realistic"

Yes this is a issue in standard BRP. I am non familiar with MRQ but BRP in general. But a generous fate/hero point system can handle such things. For example: BoL(not BRP but still) does it quite neat with a little luck on the dice and spending of heropoints, a PC can roll for damage not only for one target but for how many rabble/minions that the PC slay directly during the round. And to tweak in some kind of a rule for slaying scores of minions could handle it . Lowered HP for minions, higher for heroes, one-hit-rule etc. It think there is already similar alternative mechanics in Chaosiums BRP that bends the system to a more heroic style if one would wish so.

 

[rabindranath72]

Speaking of BRP and BRP clones...the original Stormbringer worked quite well; once a character reaches high skill levels in fighting, the dead start piling :twisted:

 

[Erekose]

As much as I like Mongoose's treatment of Conan, I'd rather they not get the license. I don't want to play Runequest.

I'd prefer Green Ronin give it the same treatment as its Mythic Vistas series.

I agree with Green Ronin as a good company (and I like the Mythic Vistas supplements) for new players.

I think the hardest group to move over for a new company would be players that have the Mongoose series of books and don't dislike D20. Arguably, the new company would face an even harder sell than WotC has with moving the remaining 3.xE D&D players over to 4E.

 

[Ichabod]

Why does Conan need to be picked up by a company?

What products do people care that much about that haven't been printed? And, that they couldn't either come up with the info themselves for or have somebody do as a fan supplement?

There are some nice to haves. I could even see a couple really badly wants. But, that doesn't justify a license. A couple more products is really more something you get someone to do as a labor of love. Given how many supplements there already are, why reinvent the wheel? Just to adapt to a different system? Something that is already possible/has been done.

By the way, speaking of other systems, I find combat in Savage Worlds to be rather tedious, even with house rules to make shaken weaker and high levels of damage much more common. As flawed as I think Conan combat is, I prefer it (as a player, nothing really makes me happy as a GM).

 

[Teodric]

As much as I like Mongoose's treatment of Conan, I'd rather they not get the license. I don't want to play Runequest.

I'd prefer Green Ronin give it the same treatment as its Mythic Vistas series.

I think the hardest group to move over for a new company would be players that have the Mongoose series of books and don't dislike D20.

Good point but would that not be the same issue in any game that there is a new version/edition that's had a long product line? I can´t for certain speak for all that play Conan but my impression has been it is becuase its Conan first hand people like about it, rather than that is a OGL game. Thats not me bashing OGL. But I think it is just the same as why people play CoC: It´s Lovecraft/Cthulhu mythos that is the selling point rather than the BRP system in itself and many hardcore fans don´t even like the system and still adore the game.

This is just a guess but actually I don't think Conen RPG could go on without a make over to create new intresset. And I guess Mongoose felt like that is the reason why they mentioned that their aim was to spread it to other systems(and maybe also to keep up their own will to go on with it???). I mean if some gamers got first, atlantean and second edition and love the system, would it not be harder to try to convince them to buy a third that is essentially the same, than to start out fresh?

 

[Teodric]

Why does Conan need to be picked up by a company?

What products do people care that much about that haven't been printed? And, that they couldn't either come up with the info themselves for or have somebody do as a fan supplement?

Well I think the answer to that is the same as why don´t people just buy one universal system roleplaying game book and do all the rest by them self? Some do for sure and are happy with it but that is far from all gamers. There is a lot of answers and individual reasons to it.

Or why did Pelgrane Press do Trail of Cthulhu when there already is Call of Cthulhu? I guess Pelgrane felt it was fun and some gamers that had some trouble with the old system, and felt they could have more fun with the new and still use Chaosium sources (or just felt it refreshing). I think that is enough reason and I guess it would be the same with Conan as well even if it not would convert all that are fine with the OGL. Just as ToC would not take away the intresset for CoC in general among those who are fine with it.

 

[Phobos]

I must say: Mongoose Conan is the first d20 that I like. And there´s no need to being published by any company, I have near the whole MGP Conan collection (still searching for the first edition "regional" books) and I think it worth till the last euro. I don´t need a "new conan" with a flashy new mechanic or something like that.

 

[Supplement Four]

I must say: Mongoose Conan is the first d20 that I like.

I agree! Me too!

And there´s no need to being published by any company...,

I agree also!

 

[rabindranath72]

I would like a new Conan game. Now when the d20 boom(when everything was turning d20 like on some principle) is over I don’t see why not move Conan away from it. At least in the 3,5 form. No I’m not bashing d20 but D&D 3,5,even with the revisions for Conan RPG, sucks on howardian sword&sorcery (but I do admit that some things are better handled than in BRP for sure). But a A Conan d20 that moved away from 3,5 more over to lesser complex incarnations of the d20 system like Castles&Crusades would also be fine and would not be that much of a leap from D20 Conan.

I have been working in my spare time to a downsized version of d20 Conan, which retained the basic characteristics of the game but removed the more crunchy parts. I doubt I will ever finish it, though, Real Life being what it is and also due to the lack of interest of my current group (who prefer Basic D&D); it might perhaps see the light of the day as a small S&S supplement for old-school games like Labyrinth Lord.

 

[Da Boss]

By the way, speaking of other systems, I find combat in Savage Worlds to be rather tedious, even with house rules to make shaken weaker and high levels of damage much more common. As flawed as I think Conan combat is, I prefer it (as a player, nothing really makes me happy as a GM).

Completely agree re Savage Worlds - really dislike it.....

At this point Conan as a RQ game would be good but I think only likely as a free fan made supplement -which would be great - artwork is no issue - lots of freindly people happy to let you use truely lovely images as good or often better then you see in real publications. It would take time but I bet varied people would be happy to playtest and help with making one.................

 

[Supplement Four]

I have been working in my spare time to a downsized version of d20 Conan, which retained the basic characteristics of the game but removed the more crunchy parts.

What would you remove?

 

[cerebro]

MGP.
The system is very good as it is(I wish they made a version with some magic on it for general fantasy) . The adventures are amazing. Amazing. This is a 14 year veteran talking here, i started to play 3.0 the next day it came our. This is the best version. Armor works. You can fight with out it and still be useful and hard to hit.

The question is this,at least for me, What can a new company do that MG has not done?. The setting is pretty complete. I say you don't need another system unless you really hate d20.

 

[rabindranath72]

I have been working in my spare time to a downsized version of d20 Conan, which retained the basic characteristics of the game but removed the more crunchy parts.

What would you remove?

This is what I have done:
1) Create four racial "prototypes": Barbarian, Nomadic, Civilised, Decadent. Essentially these races replace all of the existing ones; the actual race is only flavour.
2) Remove feats. Some feats have interesting campaign repercussions, e.g. Dabbler and Priest, so these become simply "things" that players can do when they are of the appropriate level.
3) Each class only gets its class abilities. In the case of the fighter, select a "progression" of feats. If a class gets a feat as an ability, the feat becomes an ability itself.
4) Remove skill points. Characters have a fixed number of skills, and these automatically improve with level.
5) Abstract defence, i.e. there is no distinction between parry and dodge; defence improves Armor Class. Remove armor absorbing damage. This simplifies armor and weapon stats. In short: use the Unearthed Arcana system.
6) Remove the magic attack roll mechanic. Just use the normal d20 rules for saves.
7) Remove manoeuvers. They can be adjudicated by the DM as if critical hits, but they are not "powers" which can be acquired.
8) Simplify combat to something like in Castles & Crusades. No maps nor grids should be necessary.
9) Various and sundry.

The resulting book should be half or less of the pages of the current one, but the "flavour" would be essentially the same. I want a very fast-moving game, in which even a heavy combat can be resolved in a few minutes, not in hours.

 

[Supplement Four]

This is what I have done:

Sounds like you're a fan of 1E or 2E AD&D.

I love both of those editions, for different reasons, though I don't think I'd like a stripped down version of Conan. Of course, the Mongoose version blows me away--I think it a near perfect Conan game.

 

[superc0ntra]

--I think it a near perfect Conan game.

I second that although there are several rules I skip (or rather forget) in order to keep the game flowing

 

[Spectator]

I am in agreement with Rabindarath.
I have complained that the complexity of the game (which I do love, admittedly), slows it down bigtime.
I am a reluctant fan of AD&D, I think the best iteration of that actually was the Oriental Adventures wherein they adopted the non-combat proficiencies (echoed in ADnD 2nd Ed). I am not a fan of the martial arts in OA, but that's another topic.

I can't wait to see what Rabindrath will pull off. Best of luck and keep us informed.

 

[rabindranath72]

This is what I have done:

Sounds like you're a fan of 1E or 2E AD&D.

I love both of those editions, for different reasons, though I don't think I'd like a stripped down version of Conan. Of course, the Mongoose version blows me away--I think it a near perfect Conan game.

I like both, yes.
But more in general, I don't like when a game becomes an exercise in accounting, and when to resolve a battle it takes tens of minutes instead of minutes. I don't think that to convoy the "feel" of the Hyborian Age you need a complex game. The last campaign I ran, I used Classic D&D (Red box+Blue box, go figure!) and it was a blast; ran Tower of the Elephant. What the rules don't provide, the player "fills-in" with imagination, and the GM adjudicates.
Ideally, my "revision" of Conan would play a lot like Castles & Crusades; enough crunch, but not too much to slow the game down.
As always, YMMV, IMO etc. etc.

 

[rabindranath72]

--I think it a near perfect Conan game.

I second that although there are several rules I skip (or rather forget) in order to keep the game flowing

That's a good point; practicality. If you forget to apply rules, or just skip them, what are they there for? They only take space on paper and in your mind.
I don't know you, but my mind is already full to the brink, and nowadays, when I play I want to relax, not go mad with rules, or browsing books etc. I already manipulate numbers as a job (I am a statistician) so I try to stay away from them when I play. :lol:

 

[Supplement Four]

I am in agreement with Rabindarath.
I have complained that the complexity of the game (which I do love, admittedly), slows it down bigtime.

Which rules, do you think, Spec, slow the game down?

I find it flows pretty well RAW.

 

[Ichabod]

I am in agreement with Rabindarath.
I have complained that the complexity of the game (which I do love, admittedly), slows it down bigtime.

Which rules, do you think, Spec, slow the game down?

I find it flows pretty well RAW.

Slows down combat? Grapple rules, AoOs, feats that require decisions, situational modifiers (e.g. multiple attacker bonus), fencing skills, looking up maneuvers (or anything else, but maneuvers are hard to remember), figuring out whether something finesses successfully or not (and, for some reason, in our case, whether someone armor pierces or not even though it's a static number), DV adjustments from stance or whatever, MDS rolls even though MDSs (failed) greatly speed up combat, conditions generated by monster specials, how sorcerers actually work whether it's a spell (especially different Defensive Blasts) or things like the Rule of Success (even though this specific rule is one we've never used).

In general, when playing, things like situational modifiers, such as Favorite Terrain benefits, or looking up rules covered by skills, such as drowning, or figuring something out for sorcery/sorcerers.

While I actually like how skills work in Conan, even if I'd drop a few skills, I understand that characters become incredibly complex over time to where figuring all of the modifiers into everything ends up not just bogging down character management but actual play. I'd strip out complexity in areas other than skills, but I can see how the synergy bonuses and situational bonuses affect play.

I have a character with 28 feats and 14 more lines of special abilities. My movement speed changes based on terrain; if I wear armor, I lose the benefits of Light-Footed; whether I'm within 30' of something I shoot an arrow at makes a difference, much more so if the target can't dodge as I'd gain Sneak Attack damage; etc.

Do I think Conan plays particularly slowly? Not really. While there are mechanics that slow things down and, yes, the accounting starts getting stupid with all of the random +'s and -'s, other than the effect the grapple rules have on combat, I'm not bothered by the slowing. Again, I feel like more interesting things happen in combat in Conan d20 than in Savage Worlds (well, SK).