Some Thanks and a Question

[KJohnston]

Hi all, new here.

I would just like to thank the Mongoose Conan team for all the hard work they put into the 2nd edition. It has been played every Friday at our tables since release, and although lacking full colour, it still remains a quality product that captivates our imaginations. Plus a big thanks for the replacement Conan books after the originals fell apart.

Now that the posterior polishing has been dispensed with, I have a question for ye Conan scholars of mighty lore. It regards Brythunia. Although I try and avoid drawing real world paralells with cultures in Conan, Brythunia appears to be the proto sub-Roman Britain. However I have a friend who assures me it is more Eastern European, particularly Polish in culture. I am wondering which it is, purely because I would love to try and adapt a sort of Arthurian tragedy/romance to the grim world of Conan, and any input/advice would be greatly appreciated.

Now off to pre-order Trial of Blood, in hopes it arrives at my doorstep soon.

Thanks for reading,
Kevin.

 

[Majestic7]

Answer to your question depends on whether you want to use pastiches as a source or only accept what REH wrote as a canon. As far as I know, Howard says little about Brythunia other than describing the people living there as blonde and pale, the women being popular targets for capture as slaves. He as well says that Turanian and Zamoran raiders and slavers ride through the area with little difficulty, burning and looting without difficulties. The stuff about Celtic-like cults and religions in the region are from pastiches and in my humble opinion, do not fit at all with the concept of Mitran dominance in Hyborian lands. So, depending on what pastiches one has happened to browse, Brythunia might appear both Celtic and Polish. If you take the East European option, rather than Poland I'd go for medieval Lithuania in regards of the society. Poland, although a feudal monarchy, still had quite effective rulership that would have prevented or at least resisted constant raiding. Lithuania on the other hand was a such loose confederacy of petty princes that it had great trouble staying together. Hungary might be other historical place to look at, as they had rather bloody history with the Ottomans, though the state was more organized than Brythunia appears to be.

Being a Howard purist, I have very scant experience with pastiches of any kind. What comes to sourcebooks of this game, I take from them the pastiche stuff that I find useful and/or plausible, then maul and twist it mercilessly to something that fits better to my view of the Hyborian Age. So I'd say - follow Howard, then choose what seems best, most fun and most plausible from the other material available.

However, I'm pretty sure Vincent or someone else can give a better and more detailed answer...

 

[KJohnston]

Hmmm - a sound approach. It may be a bit late in terms of history, but in the 13th century I believe crusades were led against the Lithuanian Baltic religion. It sounds plausible that Mitra dominates the land of Brythunia, but that small pockets of followers to "Wiccana" (never liked the name) still roam around. The country would not yet be fully "Mitranized", but the religion is nonetheless still dominant.

Now to explore Lithuanian myths and whatnot for inspiration.

Thanks Majestic 7
Kevin.

 

[Style]

That's a damn good answer Majestic. Now I'm anxious to hear what Vincent has to say.

Now to explore Lithuanian myths and whatnot for inspiration.

I love reading/studying mythology. Can't wait till I have the time to go back and do some more of that. Let us know if you find anything good that fits well.

 

[KJohnston]

I love reading/studying mythology. Can't wait till I have the time to go back and do some more of that. Let us know if you find anything good that fits well.

I'm afraid that's been put on hold. Our group is relatively new to Conan, so I'm currently running a module tour of the Hyborian Age for my players. Each week we do a module (fleshed out and perhaps extra Conanized) in order to get us into the spirit of sword and sorcery.

My players have approached me however, and requested a Pict campaign be arranged after our quick recap of the world of Conan. Should be quite fun to watch as they deal with other tribes and ransack the Westermarck... maybe beyond. :twisted:

 

[Hervé]

KJohnston wrote:

My players have approached me however, and requested a Pict campaign be arranged after our quick recap of the world of Conan. Should be quite fun to watch as they deal with other tribes and ransack the Westermarck... maybe beyond. Twisted Evil

Then don't miss Across The Thunder River, which is probably the best Conan supplement so far. Although designed for the first Edition, you'll find it perfectly compatible with the 2nd.

 

[KJohnston]

When we picked up Conan we went on a binge, so we have Faith and Fervour as well as all the "place" books e.g. Thunder River, Aquilonia, etc So no need to worry on that department

 

[KJohnston]

I just had some questions for you all if you don't mind.

I was curious as to how one would deal with the strongly set gender roles in game, as well as some of the torture the Picts dish out.

In reading AtTR, men are the only ones who seem able to actually do anything in a Pictish tribe. I don't want to limit my players, so any ideas as to how I can slightly subvert the gender roles, allowing woman to do more than toil in fields, without completely throwing canon out the window?

Conan has always been brutal, but torture is something the Picts have down to an art. The physical torture isn't the problem, it's the mental degredation Picts put captured women through. I don't want misogyny to be a running theme of the game. My players will want to remain true to character, but I doubt any of us will be comfortable with that aspect, any suggestions?

 

[Majestic7]

In reading AtTR, men are the only ones who seem able to actually do anything in a Pictish tribe. I don't want to limit my players, so any ideas as to how I can slightly subvert the gender roles, allowing woman to do more than toil in fields, without completely throwing canon out the window?

Conan has always been brutal, but torture is something the Picts have down to an art. The physical torture isn't the problem, it's the mental degredation Picts put captured women through. I don't want misogyny to be a running theme of the game. My players will want to remain true to character, but I doubt any of us will be comfortable with that aspect, any suggestions?

Picst are not as misogynistic as it might appear on a first glance. For example, the women own all the property of their husbands if I don't remember wrong. Thus a female character may be influental by ownership of things - or she might be a shaman/priestess, though that is very rare. Otherwise, I really can't think of a way for a female Pict to be adventurous type if she is still member of her society.

 

[Krushnak]

In reading AtTR, men are the only ones who seem able to actually do anything in a Pictish tribe. I don't want to limit my players, so any ideas as to how I can slightly subvert the gender roles, allowing woman to do more than toil in fields, without completely throwing canon out the window?

Conan has always been brutal, but torture is something the Picts have down to an art. The physical torture isn't the problem, it's the mental degredation Picts put captured women through. I don't want misogyny to be a running theme of the game. My players will want to remain true to character, but I doubt any of us will be comfortable with that aspect, any suggestions?

There are dozens of tribes within the pictish wilderness and who knows there could even be 1 or 2 with an amazonian style culture or one of near equality where the best is chosen for the role regardless of their sex. to be honest it's really never really stated in the howard stories that no women can be warriors or hunters in the pictish society. aslong as you dont make it too modern(namby pamby) you can definately get away with having women in some of the male roles. especially if you include some primitive ritual where the women undergo a ceremony to stip them of their femininity and replace it with masculinity to be forever veiwed as a man in the eyes of their tribe and culture.

 

[Majestic7]

There are dozens of tribes within the pictish wilderness and who knows there could even be 1 or 2 with an amazonian style culture or one of near equality where the best is chosen for the role regardless of their sex. to be honest it's really never really stated in the howard stories that no women can be warriors or hunters in the pictish society. aslong as you dont make it too modern(namby pamby) you can definately get away with having women in some of the male roles. especially if you include some primitive ritual where the women undergo a ceremony to stip them of their femininity and replace it with masculinity to be forever veiwed as a man in the eyes of their tribe and culture.

Well, IRL there have been tribal societies where men have been able to become women socially - start dressing like women, marry other men and work as a woman. I have never heard of a society where women could have become men in this same way - marrying other women and all - but I guess it is possible and one way to give female characters more options. This complete change of social gender, even to the point of (by modern standards) homosexual marriages was the only acceptable way to go around very rigid, convervative gender limits in these societies. Another option would be that the women who become men "marry their spears" and promise to stay maidens forever. However, this is a very unplausible prospect that has a strong feeling of cheap fantasy literature in it. Tribalistic societies, especially hunter-gatherers which Picts seem to be, couldn't afford having social mechanic that allowed individuals not to procreate. Birth rates were simply too important for survival of the tribe, especially as lethality rates were rather high. No, this does not contradict the social gender change mechanic - it was still possible for those persons to have children in other ways, while a vow of chastity or the like was a totally unknown idea.

Anyway, I think such behaviour should be confined only to one or two tribes, who are regarded as "strange" by others.

 

[Hervé]

I'm not so sure that Picts are as misogynistic as the average Hyborian. For instance Picts don't rape women (although they might torture or kill them). You can't say the same about most of the more "civilized" Hyborian lands.
Anyways, REH has always been on the "noble savage" side...

 

[Style]

I'm not so sure that Picts are as misogynistic as the average Hyborian. For instance Picts don't rape women (although they might torture or kill them).

"Hey, stop your crying. At least I'm not raping you!" says the Pict savage to the maiden as he's torturing her to death in grisly fashion.