Some critical words about the companion preview

[andakitty]

I've notice Mongoose is careful about that. They diversify as much as possible and keep an eye on what is selling...and what isn't. Conan still has material coming out every month, and it's selling. Lone Wolf has had what, one new supplement the last year? So I bet it doesn't sell so well. Slaine and Judge Dredd have slacked off too.

This is the main reason I think the panic, fire, and fury of the Conan fans over the RQ rumor is much ado about nothing. Mongoose isn't going to suddenly stop/change a series that does good for them.

I am hoping MRQ does well enough, and I like it well enough, to keep supplements coming for a while. I want to convert me some D&D people, PREACH to them and show them the ERROR of their EVIL ways. Amen.

 

[atgxtg]

Well that is just good business sense. Mongoose is printing this stuff to make money. It makes sense to support the products that are selling more than the ones that are not selling.

Swtiching Conan over probably isn';t a very good idea. IMO they would be better off just either stick with what is working, or go with dual sytem supplments. In most cases it isn't tough to put both RQ and D&D stats in a game supplment, and try to sell to both groups of fans.

I hope MRQ does well too-that is if I like it. It will be nice to find new gamers who want to play RQ for a change.

 

[RMS]

THe info that I've read is that Chaosium is planning to revamp/reprint the RQ3/BRP rules with minor changes (removal of RQ name and anything else they can't use due to trademarks) and release it as a baseline fantasty RPG.

My understanding is that it's much more than a RQ3 reprint with only minor changes. As I understand it, it's essentially BRP as a universal system that includes rules for powers in addition to handling fantasy, modern, and future type play. It sounds like it's full of optional rules too for some of the more complex parts of BRP: attribute bonuses, detail of combat, etc. I'm looking forward to it as well as MRQ.

 

[atgxtg]

THe info that I've read is that Chaosium is planning to revamp/reprint the RQ3/BRP rules with minor changes (removal of RQ name and anything else they can't use due to trademarks) and release it as a baseline fantasty RPG.

My understanding is that it's much more than a RQ3 reprint with only minor changes. As I understand it, it's essentially BRP as a universal system that includes rules for powers in addition to handling fantasy, modern, and future type play. It sounds like it's full of optional rules too for some of the more complex parts of BRP: attribute bonuses, detail of combat, etc. I'm looking forward to it as well as MRQ.

As am I. If MRQ does turn out to be very similar to RQ, I can see this as esentially cross-compatible product lines. It probably would not take much to port over a setting book from MRQ to RQ3 or vice versa.

 

[trancejeremy]

Yeah, they did. Jon Tweet is a big RQ fan, and the D20 skill system and DC system are really just revamps of the RQ skill and Resistance Chart, converted from d100/roll low to d20/roll high.

No, actually. The d20 Skill System is just taking the old D&D combat system (where you would roll to hit and compare it to the Armor Class of the opponent) and applying it to skills.

The similarity between RQ and d20 is because BRP is basically someone's attempt at improving D&D. Basically they took the same stats, hit points, and the d100% skill system from D&D (which was used for thieves skills) and simply took out the levels. And a lot of things, like hit locations were also borrowed from D&D (At least, Dave Arneson used them in his version)

 

[Ravage]

I'm still gonna miss that RQ2/3 resistance table if its been chopped. It might have been math heavy for some, but to me it was the ultimate skill vs. skill check...

Still, I guess I can always put it back in if its gone walkabouts

 

[Ravage]

Also... all this talk of OGL's, licenses or whatever... (being a man who skipped d&d after TSR 2nd edition and just plain skipped d20 timewise) I'm not 100% sure its all its what I anticipate.

Sounds great that you can get a fre elicense to publish stuff for a system.. espeicially I guess if you can shove it out as a PDF online nowadays...

...but I notice with some alarm that Mongoose dont have a section for submissions... Does this mean they do everything in-house or contract hire? How on earth will they keep items coming out every month without sumissions?

Now personally I'm fired up MRQ, more specifically 2nd Age Glorantha, and indeed have some time on my hands that I want to put towards producing a supplement for the marketplace, but not producing it myself, I'd rather pushed out by Mongoose on a commission or at least get contract hired

...also... someone earlier mentioned that campaign/scenario supplements don't sell well? Is that true? I ditched Vampire:TM after the 6th book and still no campaign? I still think theres allot of gamers who dont all have time to sit down and knock up their own scneraios and like to tinker with a off-the-shelf solution. You telling me theres no market for that?

What is Mongoose's stance then?

 

[CharlieMonster]

Going back over the choice of an imperial age setting, I have to say that I think it's a bl***y good idea, purely because of the glut of third age material out there. One of the criticisms of RQIII in the early years was the large number of reprints / reworkings. Between Tentacle Press' output & Rick Meint's CG reprints anybody who wants it can pretty much get all the third age stuff they need. I would have reservations about buying a new version of Pavis or Griffin Mountain etc.

Also much as I love classic-era Glorantha and will continue to run in that era from time to time, MRQ's success depends on giving it a fresh new spin. Much as White Wolf did when they released Gehenna and then started again from scratch. I think it can be quite intimidating for a new audience to come into a game/setting that feels to arcane and cliquey. Full of in-jokes and references which makes them go "Huh?"

Having said that is anybody interested in running a book on how many times a write up of Kyger Litor will appear in this edition? We had 3 in RQ2 and, I believe 4 in RQ3. :lol:

 

[Decurio]

Yeah, they did. Jon Tweet is a big RQ fan, and the D20 skill system and DC system are really just revamps of the RQ skill and Resistance Chart, converted from d100/roll low to d20/roll high.

No, actually. The d20 Skill System is just taking the old D&D combat system (where you would roll to hit and compare it to the Armor Class of the opponent) and applying it to skills.

The similarity between RQ and d20 is because BRP is basically someone's attempt at improving D&D. Basically they took the same stats, hit points, and the d100% skill system from D&D (which was used for thieves skills) and simply took out the levels. And a lot of things, like hit locations were also borrowed from D&D (At least, Dave Arneson used them in his version)

No,actually. :wink:

The D20 core mechanic had its genesis with Tweet's experiences in designing Ars Magica: http://www.jonathantweet.com/jotgamerunequest.html.

Notice he also credits RuneQuest with being the game that taught him how to design RPG's.

D20 arose from Tweet's background in RQ and AM, and Cook's experiences with Rolemaster.

RQ (or BRP) was never an "attempt to improve D&D." RQ was designed to a) model combat as it was experienced by Steve Perrin and Co. in the SCA and b) be a vehicle with which to explore Greg Stafford's world of Glorantha-and by extension the relationship between the mundane and the magical, between sacred and profane.

 

[andakitty]

No offense, but you sound like Fox Mulder...

 

[mthomason]

...but I notice with some alarm that Mongoose dont have a section for submissions... Does this mean they do everything in-house or contract hire? How on earth will they keep items coming out every month without sumissions?

Submissions can be made to S&P for mag articles (including short scenarios), and the majority of Mongoose products get their ongoing scenario support this way. For books they usually post an announcement if they're looking for freelancers (which hasn't happened in over a year, now). If you're looking to produce anything for them the best way is probably to start with some S&P work so they can "get to know you".

 

[homerjsinnott]

No offense, but you sound like Fox Mulder...

Who does?

 

[atgxtg]

No offense, but you sound like Fox Mulder...

Who does?

And how can that be picked up by reading a text message?

 

[Decurio]

No offense, but you sound like Fox Mulder...

Who does?

LOL! I think andakitty meant I sounded like Fox Mulder talking about "magic and the mundane, etc...."

No offense taken: s**t, I wish I was banging Scully and/or Tea Leoni!

 

[Durand Durand]

Having said that is anybody interested in running a book on how many times a write up of Kyger Litor will appear in this edition? We had 3 in RQ2 and, I believe 4 in RQ3. :lol:

There better be one in this edition or I won't be buying it. Otherwise, how can we be sure they are Uz right!

DD

 

[andakitty]

Yep, Decurio's line '...by extension the relationship between the mundane and the magical, between sacred and profane' gave me an image of Mulder and Scully discussing the X-Files and the probability of paranormal phenomena actually existing, while they waited for the mutant to appear or just discussed an upcoming case. And Duchovny has been lucky with the ladies, hasn't he? He got to co-star with Minnie Driver too.

Back on topic, it is hard for me to believe RQ and D20 are related on any level. I thought it (D20) was an effort to simplify D20 and make it easier to play, with a consistent mechanic and all. Oh, I can accept it, I suppose. It just looks like an entirely different animal on the surface despite the similarities such as skill system, stats, and 5% increments. It certainly 'feels' different in play.

 

[atgxtg]

Back on topic, it is hard for me to believe RQ and D20 are related on any level. I thought it (D20) was an effort to simplify D20 and make it easier to play, with a consistent mechanic and all. Oh, I can accept it, I suppose. It just looks like an entirely different animal on the surface despite the similarities such as skill system, stats, and 5% increments. It certainly 'feels' different in play.

THe different feel is due to the number of old D&D concepts and mechanics that made the transition, such as character clesses, levels, and increasing hit points. If you change that stuff the game starts to "feel" different. I know OGL Anceints, with armor stopping damage, parrying, major wounds, two new skill based magic systems, and such feels a bit like RQ.

If you were to take d20, incoprorate the armor, major wounding, and magic rules from Ancients, replace BAB with skill based weapon use, replace classes with skill based advancement, and you could fairly easily transform it into a game system that feels a LOT like RQ.

 

[Rurik]

If you were to take d20, incoprorate the armor, major wounding, and magic rules from Ancients, replace BAB with skill based weapon use, replace classes with skill based advancement, and you could fairly easily transform it into a game system that feels a LOT like RQ.

Or, more simply stated: If you changed everything....

 

[Enpeze]

One of the more interesting questions, so to say one of the "deal breakers" for me is how the multiple actions are playing out in practice.

In BRP you have just 1 attack action and 1 parry action. In MRQ you have up to 4 attack actions (if you have the necessary DEX) and up to 4 parry actions.

Hm... in BRP the things are simple, because your primary combat ability depends on 2 factors - skill and equipment. Now in MRQ it depends on 3 factors: skill, equipment and number of attacks = DEX per turn. IMO this complication is only an improvement if it is tested out VERY well. If not it could focus the combat to DEX as primary combat attribute. (above CON and above STR) I play WFRP2 too and there one of the problems arise with the number of attacks a player has. Everybody is first going for his second attack if he advances his fighter character. Other choices are not important. I dont want that MRQ does the same mistake. I dont want that every good fighter has to have DEX 20 to get his 4 actions.

It also means that a fighter with DEX 20 (4 attacks assuming this is the number you need) and skill 60% can probably regularly beat a fighter with DEX 11 (2 attacks) and skill 85%.

 

[andakitty]

I have this concern as well. At least it is so close to BRP otherwise you should be able to take the attack/parry/dodge rules from say Stormbringer 5, insert them, and use the rest of MRQ as is. That is my plan if I find that only the action/reaction of MRQ does not work very well in practice. Because what I am hearing of the parry and dodge matrices does not fill me with confidence about the combat system in the new MRQ. I still have my fingers crossed and am trying to be optimistic. As I said before I really didn't want a game I have to houserule.

Does it look to y'all like the setting books coming (Glorantha Second Age and Lankhmar) will be usable with some version of BRP if MRQ does not work out?