Ship's Orientation: Horizontal VS Vertical

[Golan2072]

Different civilizations in the same universe could use different orientations. For example, one civilization, discovering gravitics early, would have ships evolved from aircraft designs, and thus horizontal orientation; another civilization, which had a long history of STL spacefaring prior to the discovery of gravitics, would have vertical orientation ingrained in its basic design concepts, so ships would be vertical even with gravitics.

 

[Shiloh]

Different civilizations in the same universe could use different orientations. For example, one civilization, discovering gravitics early, would have ships evolved from aircraft designs, and thus horizontal orientation; another civilization, which had a long history of STL spacefaring prior to the discovery of gravitics, would have vertical orientation ingrained in its basic design concepts, so ships would be vertical even with gravitics.

And easier to deal with once gravitics became available: No need for flimsy gantries and such when A-G lifters can waft you safely to the heights you need...

 

[GypsyComet]

I've had two big problems in designing vertical orientation ships. First, boarding while landed. If you assume the drive room is the bottom of the ship, and maybe shielded, any airlock/ gangway would probably sit higher. All the arrangements for getting people into the ship, ladders, stairs, lifts, etc. seem ad hoc, flimsy and hazardous. Climbing 6-9 meters in a vacc suit seems perilous, but then, I'm an old fart.

There are a couple ways to look at this already in place in the setting.

First look at the Lightning class Cruisers. They don't land, so all their ground interface is done via short-range craft that are back to the "easier to visualize" horizontal thrust model, ie. "airplanes". With only short-term concerns, the interface craft *can* be built around less comfort, and the switch to perpendicular thrust occurs only when long-term accommodations are needed (on the big ship).

Second, look at the Happy Fun Ball, aka the Broadsword Mercenary Cruiser. A dedicated tail sitter, this is no slender 50's rocket, but rather a morbidly obese card table, complete with four sturdy legs that include walk-in elevators. With gravitic drives that have month-long endurance, there is less need for sleek aerodynamics. Instead you can have what is basically an office building that happens to fly. Lots of on-the-ground exposure to build easy access into. A whole family of examples from outside Traveller would be the big sphere and egg-shaped dropships from Battletech, some of which are *very* big by Traveller standards since they need to provide berthing and walk-off access for whole squads of giant robots.

 

[Xoph]

The High Guard preview has rules to make modular spacecraft:.

Modular Hull: Up to 75% of a ship’s internal tonnage may be designated as modular, allowing it to be swapped out easily. This tonnage may not include the bridge, power plant, drives or any structural or armour options. Different modules can be installed for different tasks. Making a modular hull increases the cost of the overall hull by the percentage designated as modular.

Example: A hundred–ton hull normally costs MCr 2.0. If 30% of the ship’s hull is going to be made modular, then the cost of the hull is increased to MCr 2.6, 130% of the original cost. This means that 30 tons of the ship’s components could easily be swapped out from mission to mission. When hauling passengers, the ship could install a module with six staterooms and six tons of cargo space (totalling 30 tons). When going into combat, the ship could install a module with a triple turret and a fighter hangar totalling 30 tons.

If there isn't a modular ship in the book I'll be making one... It would be so neat. Hopefully there will be a section about standardized containers or I'll have to use my house rules.

 

[zanwot]

For more info than you could ever possibly use on 'tail sitter' spacecraft, you can't beat Atomic Rockets:
http://www.projectrho.com/rocket/

*bookmark*
Very neat, thanks for that link.

 

[Leo Knight]

I seem to recall more vertical orientation in the ships seen in 20 Million Miles To Earth, It! The Terror from Beyond Space and George Pal's duo, Destination Moon & Conquest of Space.

Classics! I have "It!.." and "Conquest.." on tape, one reason I must always own a VCR. I particularly like the interior layout of the ship in "It!.." I love the nifty gangway/ hatch structure up the center, which plays such a large role in the film.

Very neat, thanks for that link.

You're welcome!

I recently re-read a few Andre Norton books, which brought back memories of A.M. Lightner's books, all of which used the tail-sitter mode. I wish I could find a hardback copy of Lightner's "Space Ark". The illustrator came up with a very unique take on the standard rocketship. It had a central, rocket shaped core, but with a hexagonal cross section. Around this, starting about just above the center of gravity, and extending down to the ground, were 3 angular cargo bays, arrayed radially around the ship. It kind of looked lide a streamlined eggbeater blade, or paddlewheel, stood on end. Or, think of the bays as really fat fins. The airlock and ramp (Norton and Lightner always had ramps!) were in the bays.

If I can ever get a scanner, or better computer access, I'd like to share some of my designs.

 

[Leo Knight]

Found a cover illustration here:

http://www.fantasticfiction.co.uk/l/a-m-lightner/space-ark.htm

A bit more sleek than I remember, but as I said, old fart.

Enjoy!

 

[Infojunky]

That is neat......

Though what I had in mind is a lot tubbier.

 

[rust]

An interesting thread ...

I grew up with the pictures of the spaceships of the Perry Rhodan series,
a German series of science fiction booklets that has been running weekly
for more than forty years now.

Most starships of this series look somewhat like Traveller's Broadsword
class, they are spherical tail landers, and this made it rather difficult for
me to get used to Traveller's wedge-shaped belly lander designs - to me,
they always looked "wrong".

Nowadays the starships I design for my settings are a kind of compromi-
se: Belly-landing "boxes" with rounded edges, somewhat like the Hiver
starships of GURPS Traveller ...

 

[Patron Zero]

"I grew up with the pictures of the spaceships of the Perry Rhodan series,
a German series of science fiction booklets that has been running weekly
for more than forty years now. " - rust

Boy does the mention of Perry Rhodan bring back memories, I first was introduced by a friend back in junior high school in the early 1970s, he was raving about this new sc-fi series from Germany. Soon I was entrusted with his Ace Books paperback of Enterprise Stardust and must admit a mild addiction had been incurred.

I've often wondered why the series has never been franchised to cable television or an English language based feature film has yet seen the silver screen.

 

[Leo Knight]

I found this discussion on the Starship Modeller forums:

http://www.starshipmodeler.net/talk/viewtopic.php?t=66565&sid=898bc8f90fcd0b1703fa25e6ab28dd8c

A vertical oreintation, steampunk spaceship!

The cargo door with telescopic crane:

There are several other in progress and finished shots through the link. Enjoy!

 

[Leo Knight]

Speaking of classic SciFi, here's the first part of "20 Million Miles to Earth", with a nifty, not-really-a-tail-sitter spaceship.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7CeF0_2hfug

Enjoy!

 

[kafka]

SDBs are often rendered as tail sitters just because it looks more dramatic when they are launched. But, again, I think it would be economy that would dictate things. With Grav Plates, it does not matter which end is "up"...I could see an orbital starport having ships stacked up cards to save on space or dirtside ships conveyed to berths by huge tracked vehicles like they used for Apollo Saturn 4s.

 

[GypsyComet]

SDBs are often rendered as tail sitters just because it looks more dramatic when they are launched. But, again, I think it would be economy that would dictate things. With Grav Plates, it does not matter which end is "up"...I could see an orbital starport having ships stacked up cards to save on space or dirtside ships conveyed to berths by huge tracked vehicles like they used for Apollo Saturn 4s.

The Dragon SDB has a picture that shows it sitting on a vertical launchpad. The Dragon SDB itself has always had a horizontal flight aspect, though. It would be interesting to re-render the Dragon as a true tail-sitter or, with more difficulty, as a design comfortable in both orientations. Bulkheads every ten feet, anyone?