Refits; Duties & Personalities
- Thread starter skavendan
- Start date
CZuschlag
Mongoose
No, I'm afraid you missed my point.
There's only 2 refits in the entire Dilgar list that I'd ever WANT. Ever!
Jump Engine? I'd probably be worth 2 XP as a standard refit. I'll do better with reroll dice on crits.
City Levellers? It does the same damage output, but now is more susceptible to interceptors than before. You're paying for a downgrade?! Get Real!
Quick Loading Missiles? Downgrade! Again, you make yourself more susceptible to interceptors, and you also remove your ability to effectively leverage CAF. Never, ever touch it.
Mass Drivers? 2AD of Mass Drivers? Does this set a record for "Most Totally Pointless Weapon System?" I vote yes, I think it's even more useless than a Kotha!
Long Range Targetting Systems? This is one of the two I'd ever want. I'd use it primarily on Heavy Bolter systems to allow them to support the Missile strike, which has probably depleted the interceptors. Heavy ships only where there are enough Bolter dice to matter (Mishakur, Wahant, Tikrit, Mankhat).
Additional Weapons Fitted? You need at least 6 AD, and you can only use this once per weapons system. It's nice for the Omelos and Targrath, principally, but that's about it; it's not like you're adding beam dice. For the Battle-level ships and above, it's a drop in the Bolter bucket, and not worth a reroll die.
Advanced Sensor Arrays? Nah. Your Jashakar is so cheap that if you need additional anti-stealth checks, you've missed the point. Also, the Thorun Torpedobomber with the Aux Craft Pentacon rules is extremely hard to kill without reprisal and is excellent for Stealth-breaking. Garasochs are so cheap that you don't really need it.
Reinforced Hull? Eh. It'd a trade-off, but I'm looking for a benefit. I didn't get it, here.
Supercharged Thrusters? Alright, something that could really help out my Wahant and Roh.... wait. I can't use this on the Assault Ships? Why not? Well, there goes the one good refit. You killed Kenny! You Bastards!
Extra Hangar? Nice. You get 1/4 of a Patrol point. Is that worth even one reroll die? F**k no.
Flight Computer? Not worth it on Dilgar, your thresholds are very low already.
So ... there are only 2 refits that might ever be worth it, and they are on different ships.
My point isn't that the refit lists are unbalanced. It's that they are monumentally unbalanced. They are unbalanced to the extent of some of them being DOWNGRADES that I should be receiving reroll dice for taking. Refit integration makes zero sense until the lists are seriously reviewed for, well, usefulness.
There's only 2 refits in the entire Dilgar list that I'd ever WANT. Ever!
Jump Engine? I'd probably be worth 2 XP as a standard refit. I'll do better with reroll dice on crits.
City Levellers? It does the same damage output, but now is more susceptible to interceptors than before. You're paying for a downgrade?! Get Real!
Quick Loading Missiles? Downgrade! Again, you make yourself more susceptible to interceptors, and you also remove your ability to effectively leverage CAF. Never, ever touch it.
Mass Drivers? 2AD of Mass Drivers? Does this set a record for "Most Totally Pointless Weapon System?" I vote yes, I think it's even more useless than a Kotha!
Long Range Targetting Systems? This is one of the two I'd ever want. I'd use it primarily on Heavy Bolter systems to allow them to support the Missile strike, which has probably depleted the interceptors. Heavy ships only where there are enough Bolter dice to matter (Mishakur, Wahant, Tikrit, Mankhat).
Additional Weapons Fitted? You need at least 6 AD, and you can only use this once per weapons system. It's nice for the Omelos and Targrath, principally, but that's about it; it's not like you're adding beam dice. For the Battle-level ships and above, it's a drop in the Bolter bucket, and not worth a reroll die.
Advanced Sensor Arrays? Nah. Your Jashakar is so cheap that if you need additional anti-stealth checks, you've missed the point. Also, the Thorun Torpedobomber with the Aux Craft Pentacon rules is extremely hard to kill without reprisal and is excellent for Stealth-breaking. Garasochs are so cheap that you don't really need it.
Reinforced Hull? Eh. It'd a trade-off, but I'm looking for a benefit. I didn't get it, here.
Supercharged Thrusters? Alright, something that could really help out my Wahant and Roh.... wait. I can't use this on the Assault Ships? Why not? Well, there goes the one good refit. You killed Kenny! You Bastards!
Extra Hangar? Nice. You get 1/4 of a Patrol point. Is that worth even one reroll die? F**k no.
Flight Computer? Not worth it on Dilgar, your thresholds are very low already.
So ... there are only 2 refits that might ever be worth it, and they are on different ships.
My point isn't that the refit lists are unbalanced. It's that they are monumentally unbalanced. They are unbalanced to the extent of some of them being DOWNGRADES that I should be receiving reroll dice for taking. Refit integration makes zero sense until the lists are seriously reviewed for, well, usefulness.
No1 makes you roll on that table as for the refits them selfs I disagree.
These are my thoughts on the refits.
2 Jump Engines: possibly the worst upgrade of the lot but it does have some use.
4 Quick Loading Missiles: This stops those CBD alternative turns which sorry but that annoys me I don't like slow loaders or 1 shot weapons.
5 Mass Drivers if you re-read the description you can use it for several things. It's handy if you play missions rather than stright up fights. Good on planets. And if a ship is adrift you can slaughter it with a mass driver I would like this refit option in my list.
10 Supercharged Thrusters: Some will consider this a good one others not. Am going to say not. perhapes if you already rolled a hull bonus it would be reasonable.
12 Flight Computer: This I probably agree with 100% it allows you continue with little crew which is pretty pointless since the majority of damage is 50/50 crew/damage in general you have more crew than damage with the dilgar so by the time your out of crew the ships most likely blown up already. Thus pointless upgrade.
The other options you have are much similar to anyone else they have to put up with them so I don't see why you shouldn't.
These are my thoughts on the refits.
2 Jump Engines: possibly the worst upgrade of the lot but it does have some use.
4 Quick Loading Missiles: This stops those CBD alternative turns which sorry but that annoys me I don't like slow loaders or 1 shot weapons.
5 Mass Drivers if you re-read the description you can use it for several things. It's handy if you play missions rather than stright up fights. Good on planets. And if a ship is adrift you can slaughter it with a mass driver I would like this refit option in my list.
10 Supercharged Thrusters: Some will consider this a good one others not. Am going to say not. perhapes if you already rolled a hull bonus it would be reasonable.
12 Flight Computer: This I probably agree with 100% it allows you continue with little crew which is pretty pointless since the majority of damage is 50/50 crew/damage in general you have more crew than damage with the dilgar so by the time your out of crew the ships most likely blown up already. Thus pointless upgrade.
The other options you have are much similar to anyone else they have to put up with them so I don't see why you shouldn't.
CZuschlag
Mongoose
The Mass Driver gives to 2 AD, total improvement. This can't blow away a parked Vorchan, much less anything. I've played Dilgar for 2 years (basically, since introduction), and I've fired a total of 5 Mass Driver rounds in my LIFE.
Best use? Hoping that it's the weapon knocked out on a 4-5 crit.
Pointless!
Disagree strongly on Quick Loading. CBD is the most powerful Special Order in the game today. Anything that inhibits me from leveraging it is a downgrade.
As to your argument on the others? No one else gets the pointless City Levellers. Turbo weapons are at least better in that it's Half AD + 1. You just get half! The Centauri get a Dodge score, for goodness sake!! The is access to Guardian Arrays. The Abbai get Interceptors (valuable on the new Milani!!), and the Mini Gravitic Mine! The Pak'ma'ra hull improvment is 20%! You get ... nothing, and like it. On a 5 -- a 5!! -- the Drakh get to add Precise, for goodness sake! Adding that to the Broadside Pulse of an Amu is spectacular -- trust me.
Best use? Hoping that it's the weapon knocked out on a 4-5 crit.
Pointless!
Disagree strongly on Quick Loading. CBD is the most powerful Special Order in the game today. Anything that inhibits me from leveraging it is a downgrade.
As to your argument on the others? No one else gets the pointless City Levellers. Turbo weapons are at least better in that it's Half AD + 1. You just get half! The Centauri get a Dodge score, for goodness sake!! The is access to Guardian Arrays. The Abbai get Interceptors (valuable on the new Milani!!), and the Mini Gravitic Mine! The Pak'ma'ra hull improvment is 20%! You get ... nothing, and like it. On a 5 -- a 5!! -- the Drakh get to add Precise, for goodness sake! Adding that to the Broadside Pulse of an Amu is spectacular -- trust me.
