Proposal: The Blue Star (Skirmish)

[katadder]

how about this:

Grey Star (Blue Star variant) Skirmish
Based off the Blue Star this is an attempt by the ISA to increase the firepower on the smaller vessel as a surprise for raiders. Swapping out the Molecular Pulsars for an Improved Neutron Laser made the Grey Star a success at dealing with the larger ships a normal Blue Star cannot engage.

Speed: 16
Turns: 2/90o
Hull: 4
Damage: 5/1
Crew: 6/1
Troops: -
Craft: None
Special Rules: Adaptive Armour, Advanced Jump Engine, Agile, Atmospheric, Dodge 3+, Flight Computer, Self-Repairing 1
In Service: 2277+

Weapon Range Arc AD Special
Improved Neutron Laser 12 F 1 Beam, Triple Damage, Precise

* The Grey Star may create up to two jump points in a battle, though these must be an entry into hyperspace and an exit out – it may not create two entries or two exits in the same battle.

 

[skavendan]

No race should be allowed 1 Beam, Triple Damage, Precise at skirmish level.

That's just too much. Make it DD if you want to stick with a beam and add some more AD.

 

[katadder]

well its only got precise over the narn ka'toc which is backed up by a 2AD DD beam as well so I dont see a problem with this.

 

[skavendan]

Ah I stand corrected. But still it has no Special Rules: None

mmmmmmm knock the range down to 10" and I guess it's acceptable.

Could still do alot of damage with that beam.

 

[katadder]

true, but can also fluff it 50% of the time. and it has no back up weapons so cant CBD and fire either.
also if WSs were to go boresight on the beam so would this (as its one of my variants usually it is boresight). plus it is only as tough as a bluestar one level higher. people who have seen it before think it actually needs some kind of boost but I am happy with it as is.

 

[skavendan]

If B arc goes on the whitestars I will apologies for calling them bent on the forum lol thats how likely I think that is to happen lol

 

[katadder]

i doubt it will somehow, some people seem fixed on this damn stupid energy allocation WS.

 

[Hindsight]

If B arc goes on the whitestars I will apologies for calling them bent on the forum lol thats how likely I think that is to happen lol

Hrm. All of my White Stars have arrived from the manufacturer quite straight. Did yours come with a slight slant? =)

 

[Triggy]

i doubt it will somehow, some people seem fixed on this damn stupid energy allocation WS.

At least it fits the canon.

I've said time and time again that I don't mind how the White Star is fixed (mind you, you know this) but with enough people hating a boresighted White Star, it won't happen in 2nd edition (I'd say it probably would in 3rd ed.) The question then becomes, if you don't like the energy allocation, how would you fix the White Star?

I actually like the current proposed energy allocation rule it is both balancing and it encourages tactical choices.

 

[katadder]

lol you know how i would fix it - boresight. and there seems to be alot more people pro-boresight than against it. I can only name 2 who have posted against it on forums - greg and burger. and its also cannon
with new TTT rule they can get their forward arc ack 50% of the time anyway, not that they need it with 2 90s and the new HET also giving them manouvre options.

 

[skavendan]

lol you know how i would fix it - boresight. and there seems to be alot more people pro-boresight than against it. I can only name 2 who have posted against it on forums - greg and burger. and its also cannon
with new TTT rule they can get their forward arc ack 50% of the time anyway, not that they need it with 2 90s and the new HET also giving them manouvre options.

Start a vote took only a 48% margin to get the narn to lose there interceptors am sure you could get that much to say it should be B arc cuz it is in the show.

 

[Da Boss]

I am happy with it as is (non boresight) as it seems to fit the power as shown in the show.............however the present solution is OK I suppose.

Personally I don't think it should be boresight but hey lots of people do........

 

[Methos5000]

I think more people would accept a boresight Whitestar if the whole Boresight/initiative issue wasn't so messed up.

Whitestar were boresight in the show sure, but they also had no difficulty aiming for the right target.

If TTT was like what many want (save a turn and use it to boresight at the end of movement) I would have no problem with it either given that anything in the front 180 degrees could be targeted this would reflect on the Boresight beam and the extreme maneuverability of Whitestars.

HET can help for a rapid turnaround but it doesn't help get a boresight lock unless the target ship has already moved.....which goes back to the init sinking problem again.

Maybe change HET to be more like the more popular version of TTT (as mentioned above) but have it cost the Whitestar a 90 degree turn next turn as they over stressed the maneuvering thrusters. So if they can get the boresight using normal maneuvers great if not they can try HET but pass or fail they lose the 90 degree turn next turn, if they fail they over stressed the maneuvering thrusters before the maneuver took place.

Mind you the change above would require a boresight Whitestar with no power drain problems.

Just an idea I would prefer it remain forward arc but I'm not a big fan of the current power drain rule.

If the power drain issue stays will there be a campaign refit to remove it? The fluff does state that it is the earlier Whitestars that suffer from it and that eventually it is fixed, but since no ISD is given for this (which would be pointless anyway as people would just play after that date) how does the problem get corrected to match the fluff?

I know I know...I'm using fluff as an argument...I must be under the weather today.

 

[Hindsight]

TTT has a CQ check of 9, so a 4+ for Rangers. Fifty fifty chance that the White Star can't find its target? No way. The White Star always found its target, and the front arc represents small maneuvers, just before the gun fires. If TTT was automatic or something, that'd be fine, but with a 50% chance of failure, the volume of White Stars that would get to do nothing in a shooting round, is just staggering, and changes the entire dynamic of the White Star fleet.

Isn't this a thread about the Blue Star?

Just sayin...

 

[l33tpenguin]

TTT has a CQ check of 9, so a 4+ for Rangers. Fifty fifty chance that the White Star can't find its target? No way. The White Star always found its target, and the front arc represents small maneuvers, just before the gun fires. If TTT was automatic or something, that'd be fine, but with a 50% chance of failure, the volume of White Stars that would get to do nothing in a shooting round, is just staggering, and changes the entire dynamic of the White Star fleet.

Isn't this a thread about the Blue Star?

Just sayin...

The White Star also has pulsars avaliable. Sure, its at a shorter range, but they are a better option than other ships. The G'Quan has less chance of making the CQ, shorter secondaries, worse speed and agility and is twice the cost of a White Star. And, as far as we see on screen, they always find their target as well

 

[Methos5000]

TTT has a CQ check of 9, so a 4+ for Rangers. Fifty fifty chance that the White Star can't find its target? No way. The White Star always found its target, and the front arc represents small maneuvers, just before the gun fires. If TTT was automatic or something, that'd be fine, but with a 50% chance of failure, the volume of White Stars that would get to do nothing in a shooting round, is just staggering, and changes the entire dynamic of the White Star fleet.

Isn't this a thread about the Blue Star?

Just sayin...

Not necessarily, You still will have Bluestars for sinks and the better maneuverability of Whitestar will allow them to boresight something.

TTT would be used for when you can't get the boresight during normal movement.

I actually would prefer the Whitestar stay front arc, but as I said above I do not like the current power drain nerf. I would rather have boresight with a SA then losing the ability to fire all my weapons. 90% of the time after im done moving I could easily be boresighting my intended target anyway.

As far as going off topic...that seems to be the standard for ISA threads.....see the Enforcer thread.

As far as fleet disclosure goes I'm an ISA player first and Brakiri make up my second fleet.

 

[Hindsight]

The White Star also has pulsars avaliable. Sure, its at a shorter range, but they are a better option than other ships. The G'Quan has less chance of making the CQ, shorter secondaries, worse speed and agility and is twice the cost of a White Star. And, as far as we see on screen, they always find their target as well

I need to start that "Five Things I'd Change about the G'Quan thread. It'd totally get six hundred page views in an hour!

Right now, I am guaranteed 2 Beam AD at 18", or 2 Beam AD if I CBD (from 18"). With the new change, I can get 2 Beam AD at 18" or CBD and get 1 Beam AD and an additional 5+ save per point of damage, on top of a 4+ save from Dodge, and an overall halved damage that gets through (rounded down). As I said in the actual White Star thread, you can have some Pulsar AD, just don't nerf the beam.

If CBD goes to half AD it'd accomplish this, and more.

 

[Da Boss]

CBD and get an additional 5+ save per point of damage, on top of a 4+ save from Dodge, and an overall halved damage that gets through (rounded down).

now this - with quite often a fighter acting as an interceptor(often a allied one) is exactly why some people consider the White Star broken.

 

[l33tpenguin]

If CBD goes to half AD it'd accomplish this, and more.

And would make this penguin happy enough to purr

 

[Hindsight]

I think that is a great compromise. Wheres Triggy when we need him?

CBD must half AD, then the White Star can be left alone, as doing it always cuts our AD, which it should. White Stars are then encouraged to run up and dogfight like they should, and not sit at 18 taking pot shots like a Narn.

Maybe that is where my frustration comes from, even when not tactically sound, I run my White Stars up and fight with them like they should be used, how they are seen in the show, and I lose a lot. A LOT.

Maybe if I tried to abuse the ship, I'd see it differently. I feel enlightened *hovers above the ground*