Greg Smith
Mongoose
Shadow ships had acurate beams. Accurate = first hit is automatic, reroll on 2s. They only had 1AD, fortunately!
New Playtest Pack V1.2
- Thread starter MongooseMatt
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SylvrDragon
Mongoose
Greg Smith said:
This is news to me. Was the prior Edition to 2nd not first Edition? As the Rule Books prior to 2nd's release, the Revised Edition, have not such thing as Accurate.
first release, Ancients, ie Vorlon and Shadows 9as the other ancients did not exsist, nor did armageddon level) had weapons described as accurate. automatically hit on the first go, then re-rolled. I actually thought it was on 3's rather than gregs 2, but it's not a big issue.
obviously back then, all ships had lower AD output, and probably lower damage too. Back in that release E-Mines critted as well, i remember swiping Sharlins out of the sky with a G'Quan (yup, the G'Quan WAS an excelent choice back in those days!) and lets not forget the instakill 6,5 and 6,6 the first shot on my bintak from a shadow was a 6,5... all your crew are dead, gutted!
obviously back then, all ships had lower AD output, and probably lower damage too. Back in that release E-Mines critted as well, i remember swiping Sharlins out of the sky with a G'Quan (yup, the G'Quan WAS an excelent choice back in those days!) and lets not forget the instakill 6,5 and 6,6 the first shot on my bintak from a shadow was a 6,5... all your crew are dead, gutted!
SylvrDragon
Mongoose
So 2nd edition is technically the "3rd" edition printed by Mongoose then? I knew AGP put one out before, but that's not even the same game in the least, so I don't think of it as a prior edition.
Greg Smith
Mongoose
There was first edition, which was revised with the release of SFoS and the revised boxed set. It included: 6,5 crits reduced crew to 0; 6,6 crits caused the ship to explode instantly; Shadows could be taken out with a crit - which and Aurora did in one of our games; the White Star had dodge 5+; the Nova had hull 6 and 15" range; and the Maximus was a monster.
Lord David the Denied
Mongoose
Some odd things back then, but then, there are some odd things now...
Mhm,
I had the idea to make Space Station Modules for Earth according to the era of play:
Early Era:
Railguns
Missiles
Plasma Cannons
3rd Age Era Era:
Pulse Cannons
Heavy Laser Cannons
Missiles
Crusade Era:
Heavy Particle Cannons (Slow Loading)
Heavy Laser Cannons
Pulse Cannons
Advanced Missile Racks
I had the idea to make Space Station Modules for Earth according to the era of play:
Early Era:
Railguns
Missiles
Plasma Cannons
3rd Age Era Era:
Pulse Cannons
Heavy Laser Cannons
Missiles
Crusade Era:
Heavy Particle Cannons (Slow Loading)
Heavy Laser Cannons
Pulse Cannons
Advanced Missile Racks
Lord David the Denied
Mongoose
Why would the particle cannons be slow loading? None of the ship-based ones are, and a station would have power and better cooling systems for a weapon...
Da Boss said:
The last few games I have played against AdrianH (involving Narn, Centauri, Minbari and Shadows) we've used TBS. He's even noted the roll results down somewhere. Just nowhere useful I guess :wink: . From what I remember (and there was one game when I was rolling hot) the results were usually a few extra hits than AD would suggest, with no big run-aways. And the odd poor roll was never a total washout a few hits were scored.
The G'Quan has been used a lot as well. CBD was frequently never really considered a useful option at the time (although it probably should have been given the damage output from the secondaries). I'd like to see some more ability put into one of the G'Quans (or the rest of the Ships of the Line types) secondary systems (Pulse or Ions), to leave it with useful secondaries and perhaps opportunistic tertiaries for swatting at fighters and small PL ships.
sidewinder
Mongoose
Anyways, I was just wondering, if people want beams to be reliable, but without the run away rolls, what if we used the old accurate trait? First volley always hits, and you reroll on 6's (5's if you want to be mean). That way, you know what a beam can do. Ships with big lasers will hurt, but you probably wont do much past the first volley unless your lucky and even then probably not more then a 1 or 2 extra hits.
Silvereye said:
I think this is my biggest hate on for the GQuan, its a solitary beam weapon system because after its shot its 1shot the rest of it doesnt matter, the range is to short on a slow lumbering ship to bring the secondaries against low hull raid skirmish or patrol.
you only ever get to shoot them at other slow lumbering ships which you just slowly approached firing your beam, unfortunately thos other slow lumbering ships also happen to be hull 6
so 10 AD TL and 6 AD against hull 6
10(1/6+5/6*1/6) + 6(1/6) = which is approximately 4 single damage hits horray
We had one battle, I fielded 4 Gquans and 1 bintak, there was massive secondary firing which did pretty much nothing
Yup...
They are supposedly there to protect you from small ships, but all the small ships out range and out maneuver you... so what are they for again?
Be different if range mattered to guns abilities in some way, and you needed to keep things from getting point blank. But with the removal of the really short range guns (for AF) there isn't even a point blank range to worry about, eight is it.
Ripple
They are supposedly there to protect you from small ships, but all the small ships out range and out maneuver you... so what are they for again?
Be different if range mattered to guns abilities in some way, and you needed to keep things from getting point blank. But with the removal of the really short range guns (for AF) there isn't even a point blank range to worry about, eight is it.
Ripple
Silvereye said:
even then the GQuans guns dont really have anything to write home about
the Tigara has spd 12-2/45 which means your attacking from pretty much anywhere but boresighted so you dont have to worry about the beam and your minbari so the oneshot emine was fired awhile ago so 10 TL and 6
10(1/3+2/3*1/3) + 6(1/3) 7.55 hits
if they happen to break stealth which even at that range only brings it down to 50%(but is a different story altogether)
if I was the Tigara I would do it
however these things were ment to take on Centauri and fend off centauri hulls which lets be honest they fail at miserably, even if the centauri somehow failed to be outside the gquans secondary range, your still shooting at hull5 for the most part
which means 7.55 hits on average with 1.25 crits, against a single vorchan(most likely) who fires by itself 4 DD,SAP and 8 DD,TL back for aprox 4.5 DD hits, 0.75 DD crits
again if I was the vorchan I would do it
either stop pretending a gquan has all round cover fire and take it away or else give them something to make them have alround cover fire
I could care less if I was stuck on a lumbering speed 6 ship with a crappy beam (compared to mister Omega) if I could do something with the rest of it
however I believe someone said that there was something upcoming for the GQuan and will keep my peace until it gets released
now I will go back to my other favourite subject... the new small ship rule, I really hate it as it stands
oh and just for LDtD
Cheers,
John Smith*
*some names have been changed to protect the innocent
I'm not convinced about the argument for longer range secondaries. For one thing, the Narn aren't the only ones with 8" range secondaries - if the G'Quan gets its secondary range increased, how long will it be before the Abbai, for example, demand something similar? And then everyone with 10" range guns will complain because anyone with 12" guns can outrange them. And so on, until we all gang up on the Minbari and their 18" mini-beams. 
There might be an argument for making the secondaries double-damage, so that when the G'Quan gets into a close-in brawling match with a Primus, it isn't as badly outgunned. And the G'Lan, could definitely do with double-damage secondaries - it's basically a G'Quan modified for close range combat (minus the energy mine, plus a forward arc beam, shorter range main laser).
Meanwhile what the G'Quan really needs is its main beam upgraded to the same 6D as, say, the Omega - the other ship against which the G'Quan is often compared.
There might be an argument for making the secondaries double-damage, so that when the G'Quan gets into a close-in brawling match with a Primus, it isn't as badly outgunned. And the G'Lan, could definitely do with double-damage secondaries - it's basically a G'Quan modified for close range combat (minus the energy mine, plus a forward arc beam, shorter range main laser).
Meanwhile what the G'Quan really needs is its main beam upgraded to the same 6D as, say, the Omega - the other ship against which the G'Quan is often compared.
