LOL, most but not all. And other countries have been quite active in providing training to the Indonesian Armed Forces over the past few years. I wasn't trying to say thet the UK hasn't been supplying Indonesia, just that the list of countries that have is long and well-known. The trouble with pointing fingers in cases like this is that you pretty soon end up pointing at just about everyone, including your best buddies. And the UK has along history of fighting wars against enemies supplied by its allies (and indeed by itself!)
Miniatures and Temporary Army Lists
- Thread starter Hiromoon
- Start date
LOL, most but not all. And other countries have been quite active in providing training to the Indonesian Armed Forces over the past few years. I wasn't trying to say thet the UK hasn't been supplying Indonesia, just that the list of countries that have is long and well-known. The trouble with pointing fingers in cases like this is that you pretty soon end up pointing at just about everyone, including your best buddies. And the UK has along history of fighting wars against enemies supplied by its allies (and indeed by itself!)
127th Angry Angels
Mongoose
DM said:
Just been reading a book about the Falklands conflict, where Sea Harriers have been doing attack drill against type 42 destroyers armed with Sea dart in their own task force ready for meeting the Argentine 42's purchased from Britain. Also lots of other equipment used against the UK came from France and the US.
I guess it's hard to sell arms morally, i mean no one has a view as to exactly how the weapons could be deployed in the future.
Ah okay, I thought you were just buck passing and using the old "that other guy does bad stuff so we can do bad stuff too" defence. :wink:
You do realise that my post was offering a hypothetical reason why Britain may fall out of favour with Australia - because it sells arms to a potential future enemy and long standing human rights abuser. It was intended to provide a plausible reason why Aussie troops would fight with the US in BF:EVO. If it touched a nerve take it up with your government or don't play modern wargames I don't care which.
Steel, Food, Manufactured goods (Luxury Items, like Blue Jeans), Jokes about the French.
And yes you can have morals about who you sell to. That's why people like the man featured in 'Lord of War' exist. A government will use an arms dealer to support a cause they like, but can't politically support...
And yes you can have morals about who you sell to. That's why people like the man featured in 'Lord of War' exist. A government will use an arms dealer to support a cause they like, but can't politically support...
anyway as for Australia siding with the US rather than Britain, i reckon its a done deal, even right at this second! We shifted who we depended on during WW2 when the Brits where willing to hang us out to dry against the Japanese (even stopping the 2nd AIF coming home from the middle east to fight in the defence of Aus!)
Its even a major part of the Modern Australian History topic taught in our schools (yrs nine and ten history in NSW) the theme being that we are now allied to the US, not the Commonwealth and Britain in order to help keep us secure from invasion.
Its even a major part of the Modern Australian History topic taught in our schools (yrs nine and ten history in NSW) the theme being that we are now allied to the US, not the Commonwealth and Britain in order to help keep us secure from invasion.
Hiromoon said:
well most steel comes from indian companies now due to low labour costs, food is mostly from europe and 3rd world countries, jeans again from india and such, as for jokes about french we brits have been doing them befor america was discovered. :twisted:
i dont own in my house as far as i know a single item made in USA, i have items made in russia (evan the watch im wearing) and loads from china, cloaths are milasia, or indian, as are shoes bar my italian prada's. as for books, as far as i can see germany or uk.
I'd have to agree wholeheartedly. We have "mateship" as part of our national mentality - our Prime Minister even wants to insert the word into our Constitution - and we feel collectively obligated to back up our mates when they're in a fight. We all know Australia didn't go to Afghanistan or Iraq for WMD's or oil or whatever. We went because the US saved our asses sixty odd years ago. We'll go to Iran or North Korea or friggin Venezuela as well. In BF:EVO, with the US involved in a skirmish with the EFTF, we may even be willing to fight Britain. France definitely.
Rick
Mongoose
Ok, 1 thread has already been shut down for having nationalistic overtones, don't like the idea of this 1 going as well.
The biggest difference between now and 2012 is going to be in how capable the ADF is seen to be by the rest of the world. Mainly I think this comes down to equipment type, not training, experience or commitment. In the past, the ADF wouldn't have been used in a front-line battle such as Desert Storm, but with them equipping with M1's, this could change by 2012.
And before anyone thinks I'm knocking the ADF, I'm not, it's just that the way they see their role in future conflicts is now changing, to the point where they could compete "toe-to-toe" against almost any army.
The biggest difference between now and 2012 is going to be in how capable the ADF is seen to be by the rest of the world. Mainly I think this comes down to equipment type, not training, experience or commitment. In the past, the ADF wouldn't have been used in a front-line battle such as Desert Storm, but with them equipping with M1's, this could change by 2012.
And before anyone thinks I'm knocking the ADF, I'm not, it's just that the way they see their role in future conflicts is now changing, to the point where they could compete "toe-to-toe" against almost any army.
My ADF colleagues are convinced that the M1 purchase will be a key enabler to a more proactive Australian military stance over the next few years.
They also tooka look at the earlier parts of this thread and chuckled at the comments regarding the UK fighting Australia. "On the pitch, maybe, but never on the battlefield" was the only printable comment
They also tooka look at the earlier parts of this thread and chuckled at the comments regarding the UK fighting Australia. "On the pitch, maybe, but never on the battlefield" was the only printable comment
Secesh said:
well the internet wasnt invented in america now was it.
and its not an export, as most is sort of an import, as it imports foriegn trafic for its media output.
but i do know of something america exsports, entertainment, ie hollywood for example, evan if the dvds it comes on are made in china.
globaly if america sank tomorow, it would have little effect on trade bar exsports from say china. as it is being shown now that indian film industry is evan grabing a huge part of the media market share.
my laptop evan battery is made in china and my sofware is also produced rom china. and soon the evan my software will be writen by a foriegn state, i dont use microsift stuff on my pc unless i realy have to, yes web pages crash at times so i have to try them on m-soft.
but from the uk the only thing i can see us importing from the us, from a non political non military view, but as a shopper, is corn,,, nope thats from europe, sorry
my most american thing in the house copy of warmachine redux, is printed in..... CHINA....... actualy i had a look around this afternoon for american bits, and im in shock how much is from CHINA !!!!!! if china disapeared tomorow, that would drasticly change the face of trade in the world i think.
but then i live on a little island
Not really. China's the poster child because they don't have Unions... if they Unionized, the factories would end up moving someplace else that had cheap labor.... unless they Unionize the way France did....
No one would work and if you tried to make them work, they riot.
America, on the other hand, actually owns a majority of most companies in China concerned with manufacture. If they privatize...well...cha-ching.
And the Internet was invented in America, Mr. Evil.
No one would work and if you tried to make them work, they riot.
America, on the other hand, actually owns a majority of most companies in China concerned with manufacture. If they privatize...well...cha-ching.
And the Internet was invented in America, Mr. Evil.
MaxSteiner
Mongoose
Not to mention the processor in his computers almost certainly American.... (Incidently has anyone notticed that ALL toenail clippers seem to be made in Korea? Never in my life have I seen a set that wasn't...)
As for the arms dealing thing, isn't it mainly stuff like spikey batons, leg braces, electrification belts etc that are labled uneffical? I know both Britain and America quite happily sell these to anyone without a moments hessitation, when the only purpose they have is human rights violations.
The sale of conventional weapons can be done effically, but theres a hell of a lot of stuff that is sold that really can't...
As for the arms dealing thing, isn't it mainly stuff like spikey batons, leg braces, electrification belts etc that are labled uneffical? I know both Britain and America quite happily sell these to anyone without a moments hessitation, when the only purpose they have is human rights violations.
The sale of conventional weapons can be done effically, but theres a hell of a lot of stuff that is sold that really can't...
Hiromoon said:
mmmmm
The World Wide Web was developed in 1989 by English computer scientist Timothy Berners-Lee
the internet was invented by a european (german if think) who was bought american nationality in exchange for his works around the early to mid 70's around my birthday i think 1973ish and in that manor it was american. but only after he invented it 10 years prevouse. cant renember his name now though
im sure your find something somewhere on it if you searched, there was a cover up in the 80's reported in the european news paper at the time.