Limit on the magnitude of spells for new characters?
- Thread starter mjhaas
- Start date
Yeah the $$$. 
You still have to pay to learn those spells, and as the chart of page 64 shows, magic isn't cheap. Even a noble who rolls 4,000 silver (40 on 4d10!). is only going to be able to buy a magintude 6 spell at 3,200 silver. And that is putting mioft of this money into one spell. Better off to by a couple of spells at magnitude 4 and use the rest of the moeny for armor, weapons and other equipment.
You still have to pay to learn those spells, and as the chart of page 64 shows, magic isn't cheap. Even a noble who rolls 4,000 silver (40 on 4d10!). is only going to be able to buy a magintude 6 spell at 3,200 silver. And that is putting mioft of this money into one spell. Better off to by a couple of spells at magnitude 4 and use the rest of the moeny for armor, weapons and other equipment.
I remember reading somewhere, maybe in the cults section, that you could only aquire a certain level of magnitude depending on your rank in your cult. I think level two was the limit for non-cult associated spells and level four for cult associated ones.
Might be off on that as my book is out of reach at the moment but I'm pretty sure there was a limiting factor in there somewhere as to what you could start or train up to.
Might be off on that as my book is out of reach at the moment but I'm pretty sure there was a limiting factor in there somewhere as to what you could start or train up to.
As Arkat said Cults will only teach up to 2 point magnitude spells to lay members and 4 to Initiates. Being taught by a non cult member is probably going to cost even more than in the rulebook.
I am limiting my starting characters (ie basic skill package from the rulebook) to no more than magnitude 2 spells. I am letting them have a spell for each runecasting skill without buying them as its glorantha based and i want to help them get that flavour.
More experienced characters could start with more advanced spells.
Remember also that progressive spells , each point is a separate spell, unlike previous editions.
I am limiting my starting characters (ie basic skill package from the rulebook) to no more than magnitude 2 spells. I am letting them have a spell for each runecasting skill without buying them as its glorantha based and i want to help them get that flavour.
More experienced characters could start with more advanced spells.
Remember also that progressive spells , each point is a separate spell, unlike previous editions.
The rules don't say you have to learn spells from a cult - just that you have to find a teacher.
The section on cults doen't mention teaching spells to Lay members, but does say that initiates can learn up to 2 point spells (and 4 point cult specials) at half price. This again implies that you can learn spells from sources other than cults, but at full price.
Most characters will start out with a few hundred Silvers, enough to buy a couple of spells at least from an independent magician, and twice as many from cult. I don't see any reason to artificialy introduce any further restrictions.
Barbarians and peasants seem badly done by to me. They get very little cash, which makes sense, but this unreasonably restricts their access to magic. A Barbarian may not come from a cash economy, but he could be a respected member of society. Access to magic will depend on relationships with magicians and cultural factors, not necesserily just material wealth. I don't see why Wizards should automaticaly get mroe spells that Witches, just because they can come from the Noble background and have more cash. Are all Wizards powerful, and all Witches magicaly weak?
Simon Hibbs
The section on cults doen't mention teaching spells to Lay members, but does say that initiates can learn up to 2 point spells (and 4 point cult specials) at half price. This again implies that you can learn spells from sources other than cults, but at full price.
Most characters will start out with a few hundred Silvers, enough to buy a couple of spells at least from an independent magician, and twice as many from cult. I don't see any reason to artificialy introduce any further restrictions.
Barbarians and peasants seem badly done by to me. They get very little cash, which makes sense, but this unreasonably restricts their access to magic. A Barbarian may not come from a cash economy, but he could be a respected member of society. Access to magic will depend on relationships with magicians and cultural factors, not necesserily just material wealth. I don't see why Wizards should automaticaly get mroe spells that Witches, just because they can come from the Noble background and have more cash. Are all Wizards powerful, and all Witches magicaly weak?
Simon Hibbs
Typically it is cults that teach the spells. That's part of the allure of joining one after all. You might run into the odd wandering Shaman who is willing to teach you something but by and large in Glorantha you learn spells from cult priests. In earlier RQ, Daka Fal had the Summon Spirit Teacher Rune Spell that could teach you a spell as well.
Arkat said:
Yeah, but the core MRQ rules are not set for Glorantha. One reason why there people were complaining about "Skybolt" being a Choas rune spell.
How this all works in GLornatha is still unknown. Especially the whole runes thing. Does worshipng a god who is consider the "owner" of a rune mean that he can grant you aces to that rune's abilties without you neededing to find a rune?
Since the gods are the source of runes (blod of the goods), they can give a portion of thier power to worshipers and save all that runequesting stuff.
Maybe the priests can use ceremony to get/create runes from the gods?
GbajiTheDeceiver
Mongoose
It's actually implicit from the "Prints" example that starting characters don't have to buy their spells.
in our first test run of the rules after they came out in print, I let my guys who took professions with runecasting take 1d2+1 magnitudes worth of spells for free, just for the heck of it, and it worked ok.
With my spellweaving rules, I'm having spellweavers get 1d3+1 magnitudes of spells for the first school they learn, and then if they learn an additional school, they get 1 spell, typically of magnitude 1. That is more akin to Sorcery than runecasting though.
I plan to have a couple of the cultures in Leshan actually have professions that revolve around being attuned to a rune, and Those I'll probably let have one spell, chosen arbitrarily by me, and for any who pick up a rune during adventuring, they will have to pay for any spells.
I think I started to ramble, if that didn't make sense, throw a rock at me and I'll try to clarify my mutterings :lol:
Anthony
With my spellweaving rules, I'm having spellweavers get 1d3+1 magnitudes of spells for the first school they learn, and then if they learn an additional school, they get 1 spell, typically of magnitude 1. That is more akin to Sorcery than runecasting though.
I plan to have a couple of the cultures in Leshan actually have professions that revolve around being attuned to a rune, and Those I'll probably let have one spell, chosen arbitrarily by me, and for any who pick up a rune during adventuring, they will have to pay for any spells.
I think I started to ramble, if that didn't make sense, throw a rock at me and I'll try to clarify my mutterings :lol:
Anthony
Sadly the selection of spells in the core book make it hard to limit the magnitude of the starting spells.
If a starting Wizard takes the Cold rune as one of up to three starting runs available to that profession, they would only have the option of taking the Frostbite spell which is a Mag 3 spell.
If a starting Wizard takes the Cold rune as one of up to three starting runs available to that profession, they would only have the option of taking the Frostbite spell which is a Mag 3 spell.
GbajiTheDeceiver said:
What it actualy says is that he gets one spell for free. Presumably this would be one spell per integrated rune. I can't find any mention of any of this in the rules text though.
Personaly I would definitely allow players to buy additional spells before the game starts, either from their cult at half price or at full price from elsewhere. I think it would be unreasonable to assume that in the (probably) several years between becoming runetouched and becoming an adventurer, the character never came across anyone able to teach some additional spells.
Simon Hibbs
The rulesbook does say that a starting character gets one spell per runecasting skill aka rune he gets. in my version of the book it is said in page 13 just before the "Free Skill Points" topic. But still it is kinda stupid that some runes have just one spell related to it and some, like "Metal" or "Disorder" have many excellent spells from which to choose. I sincerely hope that there will be a lot of new spells in the Companion-book or i otherwise i am very disappointed. After all Mongoose have stated that the core book "is all you need for playing" and still i have to buy Companion to get the rest of the different magic styles etc. Now, just the core book in my hand, i feel a little bit betrayed, i must say.
Yeah, maybe it is as Arkat said. more spells in coming books. I am still disappointed that there are so few of those spells in the core book;( right from the start (assuming you dont want to buy Glorantha stuff) you will have to create lots of new spells and just for the balance of every rune. it would have been much better to put 2-3 spells/rune to this core book so that it would really be intended "ready for playing and everything you need". Hate to buy lots of books just for the spells.
I can imagine that Companion, which presents new magic styles, is also lacking spells for those. Good thing is (i hope) that they are not tied to some runes, magic schools, etc. so that there will be 1 spell from some and 3-4 spelss from other for example those schools. ofcourse i am capable of creating those needed and missing spells, but in principle i hate to do it because it is Mongoose´s job.
Anyway i like the game and i am willing to see the effort to balance the different spellgroups tied to spesific rune, so that there is atleast mag 1-3 spells where to choose from at the beginning.
I can imagine that Companion, which presents new magic styles, is also lacking spells for those. Good thing is (i hope) that they are not tied to some runes, magic schools, etc. so that there will be 1 spell from some and 3-4 spelss from other for example those schools. ofcourse i am capable of creating those needed and missing spells, but in principle i hate to do it because it is Mongoose´s job.
Anyway i like the game and i am willing to see the effort to balance the different spellgroups tied to spesific rune, so that there is atleast mag 1-3 spells where to choose from at the beginning.
Utgardloki
Mongoose
Is there a limit to how many spells you can learn? Other than the time to learn, which is 8 days for a Magnitude 8 spell?
The reason I ask, is that for my Runequest Modern game, runecasters will not be able to find teachers. And it does not make sense to charge silver pieces to learn a spell, because who are the runecasters paying?
It is possible that runecasters could find clues to spells in ancient ruins and temples, but without the ability to create their own spells, they're screwed.
I controlled the access to runes in Runequest Modern by requiring gold to be used in their construction. That way, it costs about 100 dollars per magnitude of spell, without requiring that the money actually be paid to anybody. I haven't thought of a similar way to "charge" for invention of a spell.
Maybe it would be reasonable to have a maximum number of spells known per rune equal to the characters Intelligence. This is very generous, allowing wizards of exceeding high accomplishment. Another possibility would be to limit the total number of spells to the character's INT, but allow a Legendary Ability that removes this limitation.
The reason I ask, is that for my Runequest Modern game, runecasters will not be able to find teachers. And it does not make sense to charge silver pieces to learn a spell, because who are the runecasters paying?
It is possible that runecasters could find clues to spells in ancient ruins and temples, but without the ability to create their own spells, they're screwed.
I controlled the access to runes in Runequest Modern by requiring gold to be used in their construction. That way, it costs about 100 dollars per magnitude of spell, without requiring that the money actually be paid to anybody. I haven't thought of a similar way to "charge" for invention of a spell.
Maybe it would be reasonable to have a maximum number of spells known per rune equal to the characters Intelligence. This is very generous, allowing wizards of exceeding high accomplishment. Another possibility would be to limit the total number of spells to the character's INT, but allow a Legendary Ability that removes this limitation.
Utgardloki said:
No, it doesn't look like it. As it stands if you know Heal 8, you can't use it to cast a 3 point heal spell. You have to learn Heal 3 seperately. This means some spell casters are likely to want to learn several copies of the same spell at different magnitudes, so a cap on how many spells you know could be a bit of a pain.
Simon Hibbs
And to the cost of spells, buyer dont pay just to the teacher, the sum includes material for that spell learning process too. Previous editions, if you knew Heal-4 that meant you knew Heal-1,2,3 too. and those where the same spell. MRQ suggests that Heal-3 and for example Heal-5 are different spells. Used with same runecasting (fertility) skill but really are two different spells. That is because previous versions of RQ you had to learn Heal-1,2 and 3 in order to learn Heal-4. Now you can learn Heal-4 straight away if you like (and your GM approves).
