Language Barriers

[Neeklus]

One very dominant issue I've always enjoyed about Conan is the that there is no "common", no singular language or dialect that automatically and easily allows the player's characters to communicate. While this can become tiresome I feel it does increase the reality of the game.

How do others handle the language issue. Do you keep it pure as the rules intended, or assume everyone can understand everyone else?

 

[slaughterj]

I find that you get so many languages in Conan that communication is not an issue. *Once in while* you might be able to do something cool by having an NPC say something in a language that no one or only one character knows.

 

[Sutek]

Yeah, you get tons more to start with and new languages are very easy to learn. It's not hard to aquire new languages in Conan, which works just as well as a single common tongue.

 

[geordiekimbo]

I've encountered no problems as a player in the Conan game. My character knows about a dozen languages. So most of the time he is able to understand them.

Aquilonian, Hyborean, Stygian and Cimmerian seem to be the main languages my character has encountered so far.

 

[vince the french]

there's no real problem about that. all the hyborians langages have the same basis like italian and spanish, may be all the blacks languages too, etc...
why don't use an INT check to understand same basis languages
for example 10DC to say hello and 20DC for a philosophical discusion.

 

[Turim]

Language barriers shouldn't be much of a problem. Since they start with Int modifier +4 languages, and gain one per odd level, most players should speak several languages. They can also spend two months learning a new language, or even spend a Fate Point to get one. And remember that many languages are related to others. Page 247 of the Atlantean Edition explains this in greater detail.

 

[Hudson]

After the first adventure I ran, the group realized that most of them could not speak to one another. We all had a good laugh as we imagined them communicating with points and grunts and speaking LOUDLY in thier own language to try and get te other players to understand.

It was rectified when they reached lvl 2 and got some new languages.

 

[Auggie]

Indeed, language barriers should not be much of a problem, since characters rack up languages throughout their leveling. Of course, a language barrier can be a good plot device, especially if it's an unknown written language. That in itself could be an adventure as the group seeks out someone who CAN understand the language.

 

[Yogah of Yag]

for example 10DC to say hello and 20DC for a philosophical discusion.

Very nice idea. People obviously don't have to know and ENTIRE language to begin to make use of it. That is the whole basis behind loaning and loan-words.

I posted my thoughts on the language issue on another post. I began by detailing Cimmerian and Stygian. Search for the phrase "Tongues of Hyboria."

I also proposed a new skill: Sign Language (INT) which could help PCs who don't know all of a language. This could offer a synergy bonus with Diplomacy checks.

 

[VincentDarlage]

One very dominant issue...

I never thought about it being a 'dominant' issue. I've never really given it much thought at all. The issue rarely presents itself in Howard's writing.

How do others handle the language issue. Do you keep it pure as the rules intended, or assume everyone can understand everyone else?

Depends on my story needs. If it gets in the way of the adventure or screws with the pacing, then I ignore it and presume someone can understand someone else and translate for the others. If it is part of the adventure and part of the tension, then I am more strict on the issue.

I am more about telling a story than I am about rules, though (which is why I don't get into an uproar about Defensive Blast - the storytelling goal is evident - it is defensive - therefore it cannot be used offensively, regardless of the actual way the rules work; if I can determine the story-telling goal of an ability, I cease to care about the literal ramifications of a given rule if the story goal is ignored).

 

[René]

I designed the course of campaign roughly from 1st to 12th level so, that the PCs made their way slowly from Hyperborea (where they had all Hyperborean characters) to Brythunia, the border region to Corinthia, then Zamora and now to Turan (level 8 ), where they will stay until they reach ca. level 10.
This way they had enough time to learn the needed languages between the adventures. At a few occasions they needed to flee from a country, so I stressed the problem of languages in these scenarios.

 

[Neeklus]

Well while it may never have occured in the writings of REH, I do feel it is an element that has been enlarged by the game. I personally think it's a great thing: having Common or a singular language effectively downplays having other languages in some games, I feel.

 

[Zul Daire]

In my xp it is a can be a small obatacle at very early levels. Hell most of the time we forgot anyway.

 

[René]

One very dominant issue I've always enjoyed about Conan is the that there is no "common", no singular language or dialect that automatically and easily allows the player's characters to communicate. While this can become tiresome I feel it does increase the reality of the game.

How do others handle the language issue. Do you keep it pure as the rules intended, or assume everyone can understand everyone else?

I ran today into an intersting REH-sentence from the short story "Country of the Knive" (El Borak):

Like many men who live by their wits, he had the knack of acquiring new languages.

This is said of Brent Stuart, an American who traveleld through India and Afghanistan for maybe four weeks and can already follow the conversation of his captors, which are warriors of an obscure Afghan tribe. I don't know if it is realistically, but that's the way REH saw the problem.

I hope this helps a little bit!

 

[groshnik]

We had several situations at the lower levels, with specific translators. We tend to roleplay the accents while gaming, making it easier to tell what someone is speaking. It got rather funny when the translations started changing slightly. In game, one thing, out of game, another story
We almost reached the point where index cards with the language you were currently speaking was going to be required...
But 3rd level helped out a great deal with that.
Overall, very fun for a bit. If you didn't get languages so fast, it would quickly become a pain

 

[slaughterj]

After the first adventure I ran, the group realized that most of them could not speak to one another. We all had a good laugh as we imagined them communicating with points and grunts and speaking LOUDLY in thier own language to try and get te other players to understand.

It was rectified when they reached lvl 2 and got some new languages.

Languages are gained on odd levels BTW.

 

[Vincent791]

That's what I like about Conan, no common language. In D&D "common" is used to ignore the languages, then why bother working some cultures if you're not gonna use the differences?

Besides, there is no problem cause usually you found a common language with people of other places. Let's say, the hyrkanian for people of Kithai and Himelian tribesman.

 

[Yogah of Yag]

There is also the concept of language strata:

Substratum, a group of language-speakers who lie at a lower level in a society, oppressed or governed or ruled by a linguistic superstratum.

Adstratum, a rare situation wherein two groups of language-speakers are at the same level in society, prestige, etc.

Superstratum, a group of language-speakers who lie above a lower level in a society, as rulers over the ruled, conquering invaders over an oppressed indigenous population. (There is at least one example of this in the Conan Corpus...in a fragmentary story by Howard, perhaps? Help!). The superstratum language may be viewed as a prestige language, a lingua franca perhaps, of the ruling class, clergy, etc. as Latin unifying various European nations, used by scholars, religious litterati, nobles, intelligensia. Also Sanskrit as a medium of religion, philosophy, literature in India, a land with hundreds of discrete languages and dialects.

 

[Bregales]

There is also the concept of language strata:

Substratum, a group of language-speakers who lie at a lower level in a society, oppressed or governed or ruled by a linguistic superstratum.

Adstratum, a rare situation wherein two groups of language-speakers are at the same level in society, prestige, etc.

Superstratum, a group of language-speakers who lie above a lower level in a society, as rulers over the ruled, conquering invaders over an oppressed indigenous population. (There is at least one example of this in the Conan Corpus...in a fragmentary story by Howard, perhaps? Help!). The superstratum language may be viewed as a prestige language, a lingua franca perhaps, of the ruling class, clergy, etc. as Latin unifying various European nations, used by scholars, religious litterati, nobles, intelligensia. Also Sanskrit as a medium of religion, philosophy, literature in India, a land with hundreds of discrete languages and dialects.

I use this idea informally in my games. I am 99% of the time very deliberate in how I speak for a character, NPC, whatever. My players are so-so, yet it never surprises me how they ignore the words I'm saying or what I'm saying and take things for granted, only for me to remind them come repercussion time "Character X said [such n such], those were [his] words! What do you think he meant?"

My Saturday party of players kept forgetting that they couldn't speak a common language until they'd hit 5th level :!: Characters changing all the time had something to do with the problem, but they'd discovered a way for those who speak Shemitish to finally speak with those who speak Turanian until 5th level. I think they all speak a common tongue now, though one guy may still need another player to translate on occasion.

We don't go to the extent of using accents (I do, but don't force the players to), but we do roleplay where someone cannot understand what someone else is saying. While at heart I agree with what Vincent Darlage has posted about languages in games, I love having the group come upon someone they don't understand and roleplaying how to figure out how to communicate. (One of the things I liked about "Lair of the Ice Worm"). If the players get disgusted ("Oh come on give us a break and let us get to killing something") then I'll cut it short unless it's fundamental to the story.

Languages are one of the elements in this game that I love how Mongoose has worked on the mechanics. (The TSR game based it off the INT pool if I recall, each language had to be spent differently? Or is that just my imagination since I'm at work....) Anyway, it's fast & loose enough to account for how Conan could converse with so many different peoples, though unless you implement something like language levels you lose the idea unless your players just accept that he spoke with a barbarous accent. :shock:

 

[Nakraal]

Role played the accents? How did you roleplayed Greek-like languages(Corinthian-Argossean)???