Iconic ships - balance check

[locarno24]

Going to try and get some of our local types into the game, but, rather than starting with the "Star Fleet Is But Isn't But Is But Isn't" debate, I was planning to shortcut the problem by just sticking with the iconic classes of ship - Constitution-class Heavy Cruiser, D7 Battlecruiser, and (I assume) War Eagle.

Now this comes with possible problems in other games - in B5 ACTA, using only the archetypical ships for some races kind of crippled them (boresight-only capital ship fleets being the prime example). I don't think this should be a problem for Star Fleet, but just wanted to check that I'm not walking into any massively unfair fights for one of the races by using purely these classes due to some scissors-paper-stone match-up of armaments...

 

[Trenchbucket]

Going to try and get some of our local types into the game, but, rather than starting with the "Star Fleet Is But Isn't But Is But Isn't" debate, I was planning to shortcut the problem by just sticking with the iconic classes of ship - Constitution-class Heavy Cruiser, D7 Battlecruiser, and (I assume) War Eagle.

Now this comes with possible problems in other games - in B5 ACTA, using only the archetypical ships for some races kind of crippled them (boresight-only capital ship fleets being the prime example). I don't think this should be a problem for Star Fleet, but just wanted to check that I'm not walking into any massively unfair fights for one of the races by using purely these classes due to some scissors-paper-stone match-up of armaments...

If you use fleets with just one or two classes then you may be at a disadvantage, as each excel in different ways. Each ship has it weaknesses and your opponent will exploit them. I would recomend taking at least one command vessel and a few others so you can use varying tactics. Though you will have the image you wanted, i dont see many wins on the horizon

"Uniforms are a snipers best weapon, all the commanding officers have big badges saying hit me on them"

 

[The Big D]

Going to try and get some of our local types into the game, but, rather than starting with the "Star Fleet Is But Isn't But Is But Isn't" debate, I was planning to shortcut the problem by just sticking with the iconic classes of ship - Constitution-class Heavy Cruiser, D7 Battlecruiser, and (I assume) War Eagle.

Now this comes with possible problems in other games - in B5 ACTA, using only the archetypical ships for some races kind of crippled them (boresight-only capital ship fleets being the prime example). I don't think this should be a problem for Star Fleet, but just wanted to check that I'm not walking into any massively unfair fights for one of the races by using purely these classes due to some scissors-paper-stone match-up of armaments...

Using Iconic ships seems a really cool idea for showing new people the game and one which I'm certainly using!

I've set up demo fleets of CC + 2 CA vs C7 + D7 + D6 for points balance.

I've only played a few games of ACTA so far but have a fair bit of experience with showing people games so I'll share a few thoughts.

Single class fleets will be a problem in the long run but you will only be doing it for 1 or 2 games to get them intrested without confusion so no biggie. Once they like it they can discover the rest of the fleet under your guidance going from the 'this is really cool isn't it? Look what else you can do...' method.

Iconic can mean different things to different people and several of the classes look close enough for no one to care - CA, CC, CF all very similar as are the all the Klingon cruisers so I wouldnt worry about that too much. I found that having record cards is more important for new players so if you arn't going to make your own, then you might want to wait for the Mongoose ones. That will save a lot of confusion!

My only concern is to teach someone to play with their first game as Romulans, especially with the WE class. I haven't got any or used any yet so I could be barking up the wrong tree here but I can see a novice swooping them in, decloaking cackling as they fire off plasma in the faces of some klingons or feds and their entire fleet disappears in little points of light as their tiny hulls all go pop. They seem to be a fleet which requires familiarity with the game engine and a preparation on tactics to use well especially with non mixed fleet. Probably?

Save em' up for 3rd or 4th game and use some terrain maybe a good idea?

My 2 pennys.

Good luck and remember the sound effects!

Geoff

 

[billclo]

I'll be running a demo Saturday, and what I did was give each Fed player a trusty CA and 2 frigates of some sort (one gets FF, the other guy gets FFB due to minis limitations). If there is a third Fed player he gets a BCH and OCL.

Klingons: D7 + 2 F5, D7 + 2 F5, and if there is a third player he gets a C7 + 2 E4.

 

[Da Boss]

At present in my view

The Constitution Copmmand variant is a good effective ship
The D7 is a bit weak for its points - but is usable - especially given the unwarrented points additions to other Klingon Cruisers (especially compared to the free Romulan upgrades/Gorn downgrades).
Not sure about the war eagle

As said the D6, D7 and C7 (apart from engines below which are usually hidden) are virtually identical on the table and could be used as each other with little effect..............

 

[JohnDW]

War eagle is pretty weak, use the king eagle if you want to use an 'iconic' romulan cruiser, or use some battle hawks. I just think the 'underpowered' rule is a bit finicky for a demo game situation, but if its not their first game then it could be ok as a learning device.

 

[Trenchbucket]

I would just stick to the Feds and Klingons, as its a demo game, the key is to keep it simple.

"read the rules, it say the aim of the game is to kill your opponent" - Jack the Knife

 

[Iain McGhee]

I'd consider going with the KR types at first, still "as seen on TV" Romulans but less finicky to use than the Eagles.

 

[Icarus]

I ran an experimental introductory game the other day. To keep it simple and recognisable to the players unfamiliar with SFB I tried to stick to the iconic ships and I used the rules straight from the book, no errata. I chose 3 D7's and a D7C for the K's and 3 Connies with 2 FFs for the Feds. Obviously the FF's were hardly iconic but I was worried that the Feds would otherwise be completely outmanoeuvred by the K's. As it happened, despite their big initiative advantage the Ks only won initiative once and generally speaking their die rolling was pretty poor. Having the extra ship helped the Feds considerably and by the time we called it a day one D7 had been destroyed and another crippled, one of the Connies had a couple of minor crits and a little internal damage but that was pretty much it. The D7’s were defiantly fragile once you got through the shields and one was the unfortunate recipient of 2 overloaded photons from one of the FF’s which seriously ruined his day!

 

[archon96]

played a fed v klingon match against my son last weekend, the little a$$ keeped rolling 6 at 15 inch with his friggen torps. Overload or not if it gets past youre shields it friggen hurts.

 

[phoenixhawk]

It's kinda hard to use just "iconic" ships when there were only what, 3 designs, of ships in TOS, plus a shuttle. 4...almost forgot the Tholian ship. :roll:

 

[JohnDW]

There was that one alien that likes Tranya, with the disco ball ship with a light on every surface