Do I Really Want to be Big?

[King Amenjar]

I just noticed something - you roll 3d6, discard the lowest and add 6 for Size, as if it's something you want to be as high as possible, like Intelligence or Dexterity. But is it? High Size gives you more HP and damage, hurts dodging and stealth. Suppose I've already rolled low STR but high DEX and decided it might be good to have a small, sneaky character? Am I still obliged to try and be as a big as possible?

 

[Rurik]

I would let you drop any die you wanted if you preferred to be small.

 

[d(sqrt(-1))]

Depends on your GM and how you do your character generation. If you wanted to be small, can't see why not (normal human min = 8 ). OTOH, I find that I don't normally start out with a concept, I roll the dice to see what I get and then think "if this guy was like this what would he do to improve his chances?" and base the character on the attributes, to some extent. Of course, it's sometimes fun to swap things around, so that you have a big guy who tries to be sneaky etc.

Mark

 

[Sigtrygg]

Since you can swap the 3(4)d6 stats around, can't you do the same with Int and Siz (both are 2(3)d6+6) ?

 

[burdock]

sigtrygg wrote

Since you can swap the 3d6 stats around, can't you do the same with Int and Siz?

Na, you cant officially swap SIZ or INT with the other characteristics

 

[burdock]

ah sorry....I didnt read your post properly........I would let a player do that. But there is still the problem of having a greater chance of ending up with a big character. But I suppose that because ALL humans are subject to the same Character-Generation rule a (relatively) smaller human would have a (relatively) superior stealth ability.

 

[Sigtrygg]

Sorry, I should have said "why not just allow"

should I edit, or will that spoil the flow of the thread?

 

[atgxtg]

I'd ley a player not taker and drop the extra d6 for SIZ if they wanted. THe extra die is supposed to be for thier benefit.

A couple other options:

1) Change all attributes to 3d6+6 drop lowest. It upps the other statss about 3 point each, but making average STR 13 instead of 10 doesn't really mess up anything.

2) Instead of 4d6 drop lowest, how about we breakup the 7 "extra" bonus dice, and use them as a pool that the player can assign where he wants? THat way if a player really wants a strong, or nimble, or powerful character he can put more dice in that category, and take the old 3d6 or 2d6+6 in something else.
For instance, if you wanted to do a small, sneaky type character you could shift the "extra" dcie from SIZ to DEX, roll 2d6+6 for SIZ, and 5d6 (keep best three) for DEX.

 

[JohnLokiBeard]

Actually, I wonder why Mongoose didn't tidy up the characteristics and have it based around an Average Human all stats 10 or 15?

 

[atgxtg]

Actually, I wonder why Mongoose didn't tidy up the characteristics and have it based around an Average Human all stats 10 or 15?

In a homebrew RQ variant I worked up a few years back, I went with 2d6+3 for all stats. It put everything on the same scale. It also eliminated the "strong as a hawk" characters.

For MRQ,Just change the db to /4 instead fo /5 and possibly do the same witht the HP brackets.

 

[Lord Twig]

Actually, I wonder why Mongoose didn't tidy up the characteristics and have it based around an Average Human all stats 10 or 15?

I like that they did not. In RQ the races are defined by the type/number/bonuses that they roll for their Stats. If Elves and Trolls don't roll 3d6 for everything, why should Humans?

 

[Nephilim]

The SIZ having an automatic six figured in, I think, is to leave room for smaller races at the low end of the spectrum, not to boost player stats, as an automatic 6 would for, say, Intelligence.

For instance, if a human can get down to size 3, what would your typical hobbit / halfling / other shrimpy fantasy race be? I think the goal is to have the humanoid-ish races fall into the humanoid-ish range of values for SIZ, and for humans to be on the taller end of that spectrum.

I think this is also to place a correct metric on SIZ for other objects, so that you can generically measure the size of things in SIZ points and have them be comparable to the SIZ of a human. For instance, in the second edition RQ, when we still had opposed characteristic rolls, this rule put human SIZ values on the same scale as STR on the resistance table, so that you could do a simple STR vs. SIZ resistance roll to try to lift something of a given weight relative to the average human.

 

[soltakss]

We've used the "roll an extra die and ignore one" ever since RQ2, so over 20 years. If we want a low characteristic then we ignore a high roll, if we want a high one then we ignore a low roll.

If a characteristic is character-destroying (STR 4 for a fighter, for example) then I allow one reroll of that characteristic but they have to take the rerolled result. In our current campaign, someone rolled DEX 9 (on 4D6, ignore 1) and asked to reroll it and got DEX 8, which was funny.

Basically, don't be a slave to the dice rolls. If something isn't working then reroll it or start again. There's no point being a thief or acrobat with DEX 4 or a soldier with STR 3. If you want to be small then be small.

 

[JohnLokiBeard]

Actually, I wonder why Mongoose didn't tidy up the characteristics and have it based around an Average Human all stats 10 or 15?

I like that they did not. In RQ the races are defined by the type/number/bonuses that they roll for their Stats. If Elves and Trolls don't roll 3d6 for everything, why should Humans?

What I mean is: as the game is made/played by humans, I'd expect the Human rolls to be the benchmark for stats, with 'Joe Average' having a consistent rating across all characteristics.

And with base 10 numbers, it just feels right if that benchmark figure is a multiple of 5 rather than some other value.

But whether that should also be the midpoint of a bell-curve, and whether the Human upper and lower limits should be the same for all characteristics is debatable.

 

[TRose]

Might add size was modified by ethnic group one was from at times. The Bisn riders( And if I remember right, the vikings) got +1 to size so they where 7+2d6. While in tales of the reachng moon 14 the Basmoli beserkers where smaller then normal and where -3 to size(So size3+2d6). And of course there are the pygmies such as the Impala tribe which where smaller still.Their ize was listed in book of Drastic resolution prax but I dont have my copy in front of me so will not list their size as I not really sure.
I do hope the pygmies make it into either the Monster or Gloranthan book, cause how do yo run Prax with out pygmies?

 

[simonh]

Suppose I've already rolled low STR but high DEX and decided it might be good to have a small, sneaky character? Am I still obliged to try and be as a big as possible?

Since the rules (optionaly) allow you to reasign characteristics as you choose (but SIZ can only swap with INT), you can certainly choose to opt for a smaller SIZ, and I'd support the idea of allowing greater flexibility in character building than that too. I personaly feel it's important to let players who ahve a clear view of the characetr they want, to be able to achieve that, within a fair system.

However from a purely game mechanical standpoint, having a lower SIZ is only a fairly small advantage for a stealthy character. Stealth and Dodge do get a penalty based on your SIZ, but high SIZ gives you a significant advantage in both hit points and damage bonus, and also a small advantage in unarmed combat.

One way to shift this a bit would be to introduce a legendary Ability for stealthy characters, that has a maximum SIZ requirement. Something like this-

Tread of the Cat
Requirements: SIZ 11 or lower, Stealth skill at 90% or higher.
Hero Points: 10

Your slight build and soft tread make you almost undetectable. Deduct your DEX + INT from your opponent's Perception tests to detect your character. The character can also move twice as fast as other characters while using the Stealth skill.

The rules don't say it, but I'd normaly assume that characters using Stealth skill to move around do so at half nromal movement rate, so a characetr with this ability would move normaly while sneaking about.

EDIT: I've added this to my MRQ page.

 

[atgxtg]

Oohhh, I like.

How about we add:

* Can walk across nightingale floors without making noise

* Can walk across ricepaper wilthout leaving tracks (grasshopper)

*Can subtract thier DEX from falling damage.

 

[simonh]

Oohhh, I like.

How about we add:

* Can walk across nightingale floors without making noise

* Can walk across ricepaper wilthout leaving tracks (grasshopper)

A blanket rule that all penalties to their Stealth skill are halved might work better, but also might be too powerful.

*Can subtract thier DEX from falling damage.

I think that's probably more appropriate to an Atheltics based skill.

Perhaps this ability should also have a minimum DEX requirement?


Simon Hibbs