disruptors = energy bleed???

[crosswiredmind]

I searched through the forum, but could not find a definative answer to this.

There are two places in the rules that mention disruptors losing energy over distance … under disruptors and photon torpedoes p.10. Should disruptors have energy bleed or is the text wrong?

 

[Greg Smith]

The text is just flavour text. In SFB or FC pretty much everything does less damage at longer range and disruptors are no exception. ACTA is less detailed and so there is no drop off.

 

[Stu--]

In SFB or FC pretty much everything does less damage at longer range and disruptors are no exception. ACTA is less detailed and so there is no drop off.

I did wonder about this.

Phasers drop off - they have 8" kill zones (ph-1)
Torpedoes don't (but there are no proximity fuses so that makes sense)
Drones don't (but neither do they in FC/SFB)
Plasma's do (energy bleed)
Disruptors don't even though they clearly do less damage at range in FC/SFB

I had thought they should have been something like:
Disruptor - accurate +1 ; Kill Zone 12"
although, having gone and checked the FC tables disruptors do an average of 2 points of damage at 9-15 hexes and phaser-1's do an average of 1 point. So maybe it is right..

 

[Greg Smith]

We did experiment with different traits for disruptors during playtests. Getting them to conform to SFB/FC characteristics while still giving the Klingons a reason to sabre dance was a subject of heated discussion.

 

[Stumonster]

I had suggested a killzone 12 as well:

http://forum.mongoosepublishing.com/viewtopic.php?f=103&t=49601&start=75

(Scroll down to the lasts posts on that page)

With KillZone 12 and no multi hit:

Range 0-6 overloaded Killzone 12 makes damage MultiHit2, doubled to 4 by overload (same as RAW)
Range 0-12 not overloaded: Killzone 12 makes them MultiHit2 (same as for RAW)
Range 12.1 to 24: 1 point of damage.

Viola! damage loss over range! (And pretty simply I might add.) Could be an "Advanced" or "Optional" rule so people could use either method. Also, I just use killzone 12 as an example, I do not have a SFB weapon's chart in front of me at the moment, so I am not sure of the drop off point. It could be adjusted to Killzone XX to be close to those ranges, whatever they are.

I had not played but a single 1 on 1 game when I wrote that, but saw the same thing in the fluff crosswiremind did and thought it would be an easy way to make the fluff match the ships. We are going to have a small game this week with Klingons and Pirates I am interested to see how the disruptors do in that game with rules as written before commenting on this further.

 

[Stu--]

Yeah does seem better to me.

The other day I had Klingon reversing to 24" because they had no reason to close.

Certainly in FC/SFB disruptor effectiveness falls off dramatically at range.
I may use Killzone 12 or 16 in my games - probably a good optional rule.

 

[scoutdad]

During early rounds of playtesting, Disruptors had a Kill Zone, but it was taken out in later versions.

 

[Sgt_G]

ScoutDad, do you know why it was taken out? I'd be curious to know.

 

[katadder]

combined with over charging them made disrupters too powerful.

 

[crosswiredmind]

I am a little disappointed. It seems to me that it creates a real point of dissonance between A Call to Arms and the rest of the Starfleet Universe.

 

[Sgt_G]

Katadder,

Only if they were both Multihit and Killzone. Use one or the other, and it works. If it's Killzone, as Stumonster suggested, it becomes more like FedCmdr.

 

[Stu--]

Yeah stumonster's stats are a definate improvement imho..

 

[scoutdad]

During early rounds of playtesting, Disruptors had a Kill Zone, but it was taken out in later versions.

As previously stated, the combination of Accurate, multi-hit, and kill zone made it waaay too powerful in comparsion to the photons.
Add in Overloads nd WOW! a Klingon D7 could totally wreck a Fed CA.

At least as it currently is, you can somewhat mimic hte outcome of a typical SFB / Fed Comm game.

 

[Greg Smith]

As well as mirroring the characteristics of FC/SFB disruptors, they had to fit into the gap between phasers and photons in ACTA - ie they needed to be less accurate than phasers while more damaging and yet less damaging then photons but more accurate.

 

[Stu--]

The suggestion above satisfies the things you mention regarding balance.
(reproduced below):

Range 0-6 overloaded Killzone 12 makes damage MultiHit2, doubled to 4 by overload (same as RAW)
Range 0-12 not overloaded: Killzone 12 makes them MultiHit2 (same as for RAW)
Range 12.1 to 24: 1 point of damage.

 

[Greg Smith]

In FC the disruptor maintains its damage at longer range better than a phaser. 1 point of damage at long range doesn't replicate that.

 

[Stumonster]

I think there is some misunderstanding about the the stats I posted. Distruptors would be:

Accuate +1, Killzone 12

There would be no multi-hit any more.

By doing that, a disruptor can still shoot 24 inches, out distancing a phaser-1 by 6 inches and scoring 1 point of damage 12-24 inches in range. Then from range 0-12 they would get 2 points of damage scored due to the killzone. This again outdistances the killzone of a phaser 1 by 4 inches. Lastly, you could overload the distuptors and get 4 points of damage from range 1-6, 2 points from 6 to 12, and 1 point from 12 to 24.

Now: 0-24 2 points damage, overloaded is 4 to range 6.
Suggested: 0-12 is 2 points damage, 12-24 1 point damage, overloaded is 4 point to range 6

Basically, no different from what we have now for max damage, however, there is actually a reason to close to range 12 rather than cruise around out at range 19 or 20 spamming shots looking for a lucky leak. [Edit] For those who think 12 is to short, it could be Killzone 14 or 15 or whatever. I was just suggesting 12, but if that does not make it work for more damage over a phaser 1 for longer range could play with that number a bit. [/edit]

Wanted to be clear that I am not advocating multihit and killzone. Also, again, I have yet to play a large Klingon battle, so I may change my mind about this anyway. It just seemed to make the weapon fit better IMHO.

 

[Nerroth]

That kind of change would have a knock-on effect on other fleets, too; the Kzintis to some extent, plus the Tholians and (depending on option mount choices) Orions, as well as certain future candidates like the Lyrans/LDR and WYNs.

Actually, in the case of the Kzintis, that might make things interesting; sure, they'd still have all those drones, but there'd be that little bit less behind them to cause trouble with at a distance.

 

[Stumonster]

Good points, Nerroth. We plan to get a taste of that in our next battle. We are doing a D7C and 2 D6's against an Orion LR, 2 Raiders, and 1 Salvage Cruiser. We have the salvage done up with 6 drones, and the others with a mix of drones and distuptors. We will play with the standard rules first. If we have time, I want to try again with maybe killzone 14 on the distuptors and see if there is any difference on how things shake out.

Been trying to get to this game for a while. I think my son and I may get a chance Tues. night US time. We are both chomping at the bit to start in with some destruction!!

 

[Captain Jonah]

It will be interesting to see how this works out but as a general question.

What is the problem with Disruptors doing 2 damage out to 24". They are a heavy weapon, they cannot be used defensively. You expect them to be better. Doing the same damage as a phaser but having a few inches more range seems to reduce them to nothing more than longer range phasers without the ability to shoot down drones.

Frigate sized Disruptors have a shorter range than P1s at 15", if you are talking out a 12" kill zone that means the Frigate disruptors as a heavy weapon are then shorter range AND doing the same damage across the far end of that range. From range 8 to range 12 the Disruptor does 2 damage against the phasers 1 but the phaser is still more accurate.

They are heavy weapons, they should be better than phasers, leave the poor things alone :roll: :wink: