Bland covers. Why?

[rust]

Actually Mongoose should have just had the cover all black. No printing or color. Now that would have been bland.

That would have been style. 8)

"Hey, dude, gimme de black one !" would have become the favourite
slogan of the young and hip RPG scene, the youngsters in the Coke
advertisements would have been holding "black ones", the next US
president would show up at photo ops with "the black one" ...

Oh, what a chance was missed ...

 

[Jeff Hopper]

By the way. Is AVANT GUARD the Traveller supplement for artists and entertainers ?

I thought it was going to be the preview for High Guard...

 

[GamerDude]

Damm, this is why it's not worth trying to engage you in an honest discussion... You twist everything. I never said you CAN'T... I said it's NOT BUILT TO ENCOURAGE IT. Honestly learn to read.

Resorting to personal attacks again, PG? Quel surprise.

No, just starting to take your bait... you're good at it..

Me, I'm finished. I made my point...

**sigh**

PG, I am actualy agreeing with you, if perhaps not very clearly.

With the right players and GM, any system no matter how doggy can be used for RP. That does not mean they are meant for it, or good for it.

Thank you. It's nice when someone actually reads what you say instead of just twisting it...

Again, thank you.

Ok, now go back and look at what I was responding to... it was a post complaining that XP was only rewarded for hack & slash. The Skill Challenge was specifically designed to allow non-combat situations to be integrated into the XP system. It's not the only one either.

Yes, the core of D&D is tactical combat. That's been true of the majority of RPGs since the invention of the genre, and has been especially true of D&D.

As for the skill challenge itself, yes it's possible to run it that way, and that would be wrong. The correct way would be to use die rolls to help adjudicate the outcomes of a roleplaying encounter (assuming the encounter is actually a roleplaying encounter, the same system can be used to adjudicate other non-combat encounters). Now for some, that screams rollplaying, but for others it's a recognition that your character is not you.

And it's not just "make some roles" but there are three levels of DC's the player can choose... success (at a hard DC) or failure (of an easy DC) have consequences.

Personally, I allow for the player to have an effect.. basically what they say they are doing can get them a bonus or penalty from me (insulting someone when making a diplomacy check gets you a penalty... I've had someone actually do that in an adventure I ran... they insulted the mayor saying he didnt' trust her to return all the property they recovered.. the HIGHLY REVERED Mayor... they then really blew their diplomacy roll).

The challenge in the Skill Encounters are the GM keeping up with the party and the group splitting up. In PREV-2 "Escape from Sembia" the skill encounter is a fast paced chase where the GM has to keep making stuff up depending on what the players do. No details on the area to work with just a chase scene until the players get the stated number of successes of failures (whichever happens first). Not a lot of roleplaying there, but in something with more interaction with NPC's, like with Diplomacy, Sense motive, etc going on... THAT's a RP encounter if the players rise to the occasion.

Remember - it's BLAND if you don't like them - MINIMALIST if you do. Didn't you get the memo ?

Yep... the CLASSIC Minimalist approach. Remember the more complex the mind, the simpler the entertainment... Guess some people just need lots of bright colors and big pictures because the need more to 'entertain' them. {{wink}}

 

[Shiloh]

By the way. Is AVANT GUARD the Traveller supplement for artists and entertainers ? Ow ! Ow ! Stop OW! hitting me OW!

Ah! I thought it was a futuristic PBM supplement by SFCP...

 

[Dark Lord Skippy]

Why do the covers of the Mongoose Traveller series have no variety to them? Is it a money problem? I know MGP can do better, look at the Spinward Marches book, it's excellent! But all the other books that are in the pipeline have those hoary old black basic covers, which were fine for the 1970's and low budget game companies. A cover illustration would help sell these books guys!

Tradition. So far, IMHO, the covers have been among the best things about the books.

 

[EDG]

Remember - it's BLAND if you don't like them - MINIMALIST if you do. Didn't you get the memo ?

Think of Avant-garde, Malevich and his famous black square:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malevich

Pure Minimalism, pure Modernism ...

...also complete proof that the art community has a lot of gullible people in it who'd fall for any pretentious twaddle.

Honestly, a five year old could paint a black square on canvas - it requires no talent or imagination whatsoever (still, at least his other work shows that he was actually a capable artist).

 

[TrippyHippy]

A five year old would struggle to concentrate long enough to do a pure black square on a canvas - and the paint would go everywhere! :wink:

I dunno why this debate keeps revolving really - I guess it's all about taste - but I think there would be plenty of complaints if Mongoose hadn't used the black covers. I think it's pretty stylish to have all the covers lining up with the same minimal design, as well as being something of a brand identity, but some others don't.

Will it change anything, or affect sales, either way? It doesn't appear so.

 

[rust]

Honestly, a five year old could paint a black square on canvas - it requires no talent or imagination whatsoever ...

Yep, but at the time it required quite a lot of courage (or chuzpe) -
and it made Malevich instantly famous ...

 

[EDG]

I dunno why this debate keeps revolving really - I guess it's all about taste - but I think there would be plenty of complaints if Mongoose hadn't used the black covers. I think it's pretty stylish to have all the covers lining up with the same minimal design, as well as being something of a brand identity, but some others don't.

I thought the previews of the HG and Merc covers both had them with the same pale green strip going across it? If I'm remembering that correctly then there's even less to distinguish the books apart from eachother...

 

[TrippyHippy]

Well, there is the title.....

 

[Bygoneyrs]

Who cares what the cover looks like, keep it the traditionial basic black covers. I buy the books not for their cover but what is in the BOOK itself.

Penn

 

[E.D.Quibell]

The plain black cover with the line and Traveller on the cover is a simple, elegant, and iconic design.

And simple elegant and iconic designs are instantly recognizable, and timeless.

Whoever came up with it in '77 was a genius, and Mongoose are defiantly correct to continue with it, IMHO.

But it's not that they have just continued it, Mongoose have added their own touches to this iconic design. The Traveller "Swoosh" distinguishes it as Mongoose Traveller, and again this is easy, simple and recognizable.

Bravo!

Ewan

 

[Xoph]

I doubt that both Merc and HG will have a Green "Swoosh" 760 patrons ended up Yellow and it was Blue in the concept on the mongoose site. I wouldn't be surprised if they wanted Blue for HG. Green is the traditional Army colour and Blue the traditional Navy/Airforce(Diferent Blues of course) colours.

 

[cbrunish]

I wouldn't be surprised if they wanted Blue for HG. Green is the traditional Army colour and Blue the traditional Navy/Airforce(Diferent Blues of course) colours.

Yes but the U.S. Army is not always green. Lt. Blue is used for Infantry, Yellow for Armor (damn almost wrote Armour , you Brits have me brainwashed), Red for Artillery (The King of Battle) and Green for Medical Corps.

 

[zozotroll]

Shoot, move, and communicate , boom boom!

 

[GamerDude]

Yes but the U.S. Army is not always green. Lt. Blue is used for Infantry, Yellow for Armor (damn almost wrote Armour , you Brits have me brainwashed), Red for Artillery (The King of Battle) and Green for Medical Corps.

Yeah, but those are HIGHLIGHTING colors... the base color of your dress uniforms is GREEN...

Also, I just did 20 hrs of MGT at a con, and at the end of every session I did an informal poll...

Except for one person who just likes 'pretty pictures', the covers are a big success.

Half those surveyed had never really heard of Traveller but it was the only Sci-fi RPG (or non-RPGA) game in the slot so they tried it. Hell, even the GURPS demo people (MIBs) loved it (yes several played in my sessions).

There was criticism for the SM book... the graphic for "The Third Imperium" got lots of complaints as being unreadable unless you actually gave it a hard look.

I also discussed the "IW/GT Canon" issue with all the GURPS MIBs... they laughed hysterically... "what? it says right in the GT books that it's an ATU! How can anyone think IW is Canon?"

Gawd it was such a great weekend, now I get to leave at 7am Wed (the 13th) for GENCON-The best 4 days of Gaming!

 

[MongooseMatt]

I doubt that both Merc and HG will have a Green "Swoosh" 760 patrons ended up Yellow and it was Blue in the concept on the mongoose site. I wouldn't be surprised if they wanted Blue for HG. Green is the traditional Army colour and Blue the traditional Navy/Airforce(Diferent Blues of course) colours.

All 'Books' in the core line will have green swooshes (who came up with that term? ), all 'Supplements' Yellow. 'Adventures' I don't think has been settled on yet, but they too will all be the same colour - this way, you have uniformity between the different core titles. And they will look 'right' on the shelf. . .

Alien Modules will likely be setting specific (such as Aslan for OTU) and so will follow the formats for their own lines.

 

[AKAramis]

Yes but the U.S. Army is not always green. Lt. Blue is used for Infantry, Yellow for Armor (damn almost wrote Armour , you Brits have me brainwashed), Red for Artillery (The King of Battle) and Green for Medical Corps.

Yeah, but those are HIGHLIGHTING colors... the base color of your dress uniforms is GREEN...

US Army uses a Blue Dress Uniform, according to http://www.army.mil/symbols/uniforms/timeline.html

I've not seen anyone in dress uniform who isn't retired or a cadet in over a year, so I can't say if they are actually in use. (Every troop I've seen has been in BDUs...)

 

[cbrunish]

Usually high ranking officers (O4 and above) and high ranking enlisted (E7) and above wear the dress blue uniform. Although recruiting duty usually will also get you the dress blue uniform. And the appropriate colors are usually along the leg going from hip to ankles. Actually the Army dress blues looks as good as the Marine Corps dress uniform. I retired as an E6 (Staff Sergeant) from the PA Army Guard so I personally never had the dress blue uniform. Just the green class "A" uniform for me. Dress blue uniform was way too costly to wear once a year (at military balls).

 

[Emryys]

All 'Books' in the core line will have green swooshes (who came up with that term? ), all 'Supplements' Yellow. 'Adventures' I don't think has been settled on yet, but they too will all be the same colour - this way, you have uniformity between the different core titles. And they will look 'right' on the shelf. . .

Alien Modules will likely be setting specific (such as Aslan for OTU) and so will follow the formats for their own lines.

Rules and supplements should stick with the basic design, but I'd like to see "art" covers for the "Fluff" of settings and adventures... conveys the material better

IMHO...