Beams

[Johnny D]

I was initially sceptical of the new beam rules due to the scale of the changes and the difficulty in getting the balance right across different ships. That said when the new rules turned up we all happily gave them a go.
Having played quite a few games now our groups found that a lucky beam hit has been responsible for winning the battle in two thirds of the games. The always hitting on 4+ while mainly balanced does still manage to produce gigantic hits on a far regular basis than it used to and this has been in just plain damage before you even factor in criticals.
It’s just unsatisfactory to have these freakish (yet common rolls) all but decide a game, a bit like the old no guns critical used to in 1ed.
Also as it essentially mitigates the advantages of high hull ships (which in most cases means the higher priority level ships) we’ve found that it just means that battle + ships have become far more vulnerable. As one of larger ships big advantages previously was that they were hard to hurt partly due to the protection that a higher hull afforded them. This has been dramatically mitigated (against quite a lot of opponents anyway) by the fact that they can now be damaged as easily as lower hull and priority ships. Indeed as they are harder to hurt with conventional weapons they become something of a beacon for beams. As higher priority ships are rarely worth their weight in lower level ships anyway, we weren’t enamoured with having another mechanism that makes them comparatively easier to damage.
Interested in knowing if it’s just that we’re really have been getting freakish roles or if this is just part of how 2ed plays.

 

[Burger]

Not your freakish rolls, its just the way it works now.
Standard deviation of the new beam rules is much higher than in the old ones.

 

[Locutus9956]

I havent had chance to really properly play 2nd ed yet so cant really comment too much on them.

On the one hand I like the fact that they make lower hull ships as viable as the bigger ones as opposed to them just being instant deathtraps.

I also like the fact that beams cant be CAFed or Twin linked or Scout rerolled etc.

What I DONT like (at least on paper is the potential to score really runaway hits, it makes it a little too possible to win by a lucky big beam volley, then again on average a 4AD beam for example will score about 4 hits now vs any target wheras previously a 4AD SAP beam vs a hull 4 targets would score, on average about 8 or 9 hits! Of course its better of course, vs hull 6 it tends to favour the new beams slightly but its all swings and roundabouts really and for the most part I think its an improvement, Im just a little worried that those lucky massive beam salvoes might be a tad more common now you dont need to roll a string of 6s to do it!

 

[tneva82]

Well. I have only one game under my belt but while earth lasers were doing nice damage it was the bucketloads of ion cannons that were causing tons of damage. Omega heavy destroyer? Oh look scrap metal quarantee...Space station? One third down after 3 ships gave good volley.

While inconclusive(just one game) so far that didn't give us worries about beams.

Centurions with their bucketloads of DD goodyness though...

 

[Johnny D]

Has to be said I do really like that you can't caf or scout beams anymore.
Just don't like the randomness of it all.

 

[H]

Has to be said I do really like that you can't caf or scout beams anymore.
Just don't like the randomness of it all.

but then ANY dice game is defined by randomness? The best tactics in the world can be undone by a double one, whereas the most inept player ever can get the double 6 that wins them a game, any wargame in fact.

 

[Johnny D]

Has to be said I do really like that you can't caf or scout beams anymore.
Just don't like the randomness of it all.

but then ANY dice game is defined by randomness? The best tactics in the world can be undone by a double one, whereas the most inept player ever can get the double 6 that wins them a game, any wargame in fact.

By that measure stealth is a great mechanism that's not frustrating to play against because it's more luck based than other fighting non-stealthed ships. Maybe a extreme example but the frustration felt was similar.

 

[Hans Olo]

As higher priority ships are rarely worth their weight in lower level ships anyway, we weren’t enamoured with having another mechanism that makes them comparatively easier to damage.

I second that. In my opinion not one of the best ideas!

 

[Frankvas]

Well, this just means that the big ships need some escorts to take care of the small beam equipped ships before they get to shoot. So, do you shoot your beams at the escorts that are coming for you or at the battleship?

I like the new way beams work. As said earlier, hull 4 & 5 ships are no longer beam magnets/death traps.

Frank V.

 

[Lord David the Denied]

I think, not that I've played a game in 2nd ed yet, that re-rolls should still be to one point higher each time. Hit on 4s normally, then 5s, then 6s for re-rolls...

 

[Greg Smith]

The new beams are more random. And as often as they do super hits, they do nothing. I don't like or dislike them, though.

However the whole game can be random, I played a game the other night in which I scored 1 critical. I fired energy mones at a Minbari ship - the first hit stripped half its damage, the second did nothing.

 

[animus]

In the series, beams were pretty decisive. They miss sometimes; they hurt alot of the time, and they cut some poor sob in half most of the time.

I'm thinking that the game's flavor is enhanced by beams that are so nasty, but I won't know until I get my freakin' rules and play a few.

 

[angelus2000]

I like how the new beam mechanic works as well in general. I however have the same cautions againsts runaway hits though, I had a Omega Command completely scrag a Primus with one shot, first EA shot in the game. It would have been simple to include a " Attack Dice my be re-rolled no more than 3 times" to stop the worst of them. Still allows for a pretty punishing beam hit, an Omega using this rule could score up to 24 hits ( 6 AD times 4 rolls)

 

[Dizzy Vree]

I play a brakiri/vree(sumtimes gaim) mixed leauge fleet, so i LOVE them

 

[Target]

Been playin with the new beam rules with 1st ed when we heard they were going to change. We found they were a improvement.
Gets a big thumbs up.

 

[Ripple]

We liked the effect on hull 4 ships but generally dislike the randomness. Some randomness is good in a game. Puts some tension in a game. But the huge swings, which we see at least once a game, is hard to swallow, especially as over time it seems to be removing the larger ships from our games.

Ripple

 

[eek]

In the series, beams were pretty decisive. They miss sometimes; they hurt alot of the time, and they cut some poor sob in half most of the time.

Exactly, that's something that seems to be overlooked a lot. Every time a beam hit in the series (as far as I can recall) it was quite devastating to the target, except perhaps against the Shadows (until they got pinned by several of them).

I've only played one 2nd ed game so far, and my Primus' beam got an obscenely lucky roll first try. I guess I'll now for sure when I start using my Omegas more, seeing as how I used them so often before.

edit: Also, I find them so much easier to play. Gone are the days when you have to figure out what you need to hit to begin with, then remembering to add one each time...

 

[voodoomachine]

We like it. I play Shadows, and find it to be a good boost. However, they did cut my beam dice down a lot, which I think balances it out.

But then, I've been winning my games. :lol:

 

[Silvereye]

I'm still undecided. There are some of the crunchy bits that I preferred from 1e, and some bits I prefer in 2e as far as the feel goes.

Will have to play more games to see if they grow on me.

 

[Banichi]

I only got the 2e rules last week, and have only had one game so far, so can't really judge. That said the first narn shot of the game was a mag gun shot that went nuts and chopped a centurion in half. Two turns latter the front laser cannons did the same trick and pretty much nailed a primus. So thats 2 freak runs of 4+s in 3 turns, which is scary. Will have to play a few more games though, before I make up my mind if this sort of thing is a fluke or a regular part of the game now.