Are Gaim THAT good?

[Da Boss]

What I was thinking about was hit and run. How much destruction could those particular forces inflict on the Gaim before they can retreat to hyperspace and still win on VPs? I'm thinking you have 2 turns to do so before you make that escape.

Kind of like the Sentient Rabbits mythbust to trash the 10 Saggitarius fleet in Armageddon.

Retreating to hyperpsace is not usually an option for most races - if not all - activate in one turn and go through next without firing kinda makes you dead I have found............especially since the range if the gaim is so high - now depending on the scenario a run for the edge is more possible?

 

[stryve]

now depending on the scenario a run for the edge is more possible?

Yeah, that's part of the reason that I'm starting to like the Ipsha for this tactic (most of the rest of the reason is that I just kind of like the idea of the ship ).

 

[dennisharlien]

Wew that was a long read.
So I have heard most all fleets discused here and what there options are, but I would like these people to analise a Vorlon fleet against the Gaim. Long rnage heavy Beams and not being able to be boarded along with AAF, seam like is all you have to wory about is crewed missles (some) and some Emines and that might not be as much of a problem since the self repair would keep them going far longer. I would love to hear what you guys think there chances are with and without hyperspace options.

 

[Skipper]

OK, lets change the tone of the conversation a bit. What could be done (minimum changes) that would allow the other races to stand a marginal chance against the giam. I'm not talking major sweeping changes, but small tweeks that would level the field a bit.

If we come up with a couple of good ideas that keeps the Gaim playasble and true to their style, maybe Mongoose will consider the best ideas in their next "fix".

My suggestion is to reduce the range of the pulsar mines to 30". This reduces their overlapping potential and allows slow fleets a slight chance.

Skipper

 

[Burger]

Pulsar mines down to 30" would be a good start. Then:

- Double the damage done by suicide fighters.
- Increase dogfight by +1.
- Halve the number of fighters on all Gaim ships.

 

[inq101]

- Double the damage done by suicide fighters.

You do know they cause DD already? Not that I'm complaining about quad damage fighters.

Double (probably tripple) AD on photon bombs and remove e-mine.
OR
Combine all e-mines into a single shot (to stop one ship putting down 3 templates of fighter-killing).
Auto loose/retreat if Gaim has no queen-ships left.

I still say ANY balanced fleet can beat Gaim with the right tactics or minor changes to ship roster.

 

[katadder]

dont think halfing the number of fighters, would make them too easy to stop with AF then, as it is thats their main weapon, photon bombs just dont cause enough damage and cant crit.

as most people said their problem is tourneys, they excel at raid, to overcome this going to 1pt armageddon for tourneys would be a step in the right direction.

 

[Burger]

as most people said their problem is tourneys, they excel at raid, to overcome this going to 1pt armageddon for tourneys would be a step in the right direction.

Agreed! As long as we can go back to the Armageddon FAP splitting rules. They were just right. Why did they change such a perfect system??!?! 1pt Armageddon will now screw over those races with PL gaps, or weak ships at certain PLs.

 

[Kaizen Zanshin]

Hi - I figured I'd chime in - I haven't played a ton of ACTA yet but am I missing something???

What about the Special Action: intensify defensive fire!? That should take care of the anti-fighter issue (as it doubles it) if you took any anti-fighter; considering the Giam's fighters are hull 3. I know the Centuri have at least one great cheap level one - The Maximus Class Frigate with Antifighter 4, and Escort with a hull 6! All at the Skirmish Level. Take 4 of these and I would think you would be laughing as you walked in, taking out 60% of 32 shots (19 fighters assuming you pass the crew score) as they get within range of the frigate or another ship that is within 8" with a clear line of sight. Let the frigates take care of the fighters. Then you bring your big guns in ASAP with all power to engines!

Did I miss something?

 

[Davesaint]

Things to fix the Gaim

1 - Get rid of the Photon Bomb. This allows opponents to fight them by bringing a carrier

2 - No turreted weapons for the Gaim. Forces the ships to actually engage

3 - Reduce Breaching pods down by 50%

That's a start

 

[Locutus9956]

Hi - I figured I'd chime in - I haven't played a ton of ACTA yet but am I missing something???

What about the Special Action: intensify defensive fire!? That should take care of the anti-fighter issue (as it doubles it) if you took any anti-fighter; considering the Giam's fighters are hull 3. I know the Centuri have at least one great cheap level one - The Maximus Class Frigate with Antifighter 4, and Escort with a hull 6! All at the Skirmish Level. Take 4 of these and I would think you would be laughing as you walked in, taking out 60% of 32 shots (19 fighters assuming you pass the crew score) as they get within range of the frigate or another ship that is within 8" with a clear line of sight. Let the frigates take care of the fighters. Then you bring your big guns in ASAP with all power to engines!

Did I miss something?

Its not a bad idea but again relies on:

a) spending 2/5 of your tournament fleet on escort ships in this case. Great vs Gaim, but what happens if your next opponent is, say, Minbari? Or Drazi? Yay, hull 6! Interceptors! Antifighter. EAT BEAMS!!! Oh.....

b) Doesnt start thinning them out till they get within 2". 19 fighters dead sounds nice on paper, but when theres 52 flights on the table it wont save you and those ships are nice and slow and short ranged so the gaim can hammer with emines for ages.

Again the problem I have here is not necessarily that it wouldnt WORK its that you have to build a pretty heavily tailored antifighter fleet to work at 5 point raid....

 

[Da Boss]

I still say ANY balanced fleet can beat Gaim with the right tactics or minor changes to ship roster.

yes and no it depends on the scenario - i start 36" away from you - I am dead!

 

[Triggy]

I'm not saying it would address the issues directly but it would work as a balancing tool (that doesn't affect any ship's stats) - have suicide fighters no longer be Precise.

That's it.

 

[Omnipotent]

can de dilgar fighters get past the gaim fighters as dilgars are fast, and then drill a hole in there carries ?
(haven´t even got the RB yet but still commenting

 

[Kaizen Zanshin]

Thanks for the response.

Against the Minbari or the Drazi, The Frigates would get chewed up and spit out - no doubt about that. They do have intercept 2 as well - which doubled would not be too bad against the EA/non-beam heavy races. I would keep them back or use them as beam bait to get my heavy hitters in (if they needed to) - they still do some okay damage on there own - with a Matter Cannon (6 AD, AP and DD) add "Concentrate All Fire-Power!" for TL and they would do okay before they got shot up.

As for the other 3 points - perhaps 2 Demos-class Warships (Vorchan Variant), A Balvarian Carrier and Elutarian-class Bombardment Destroyer (Altarian Variant). That way you've got range, hitting power, plus if you don't lock on to the Minbari you don't lose the shot, and some fighters to boot. The command +1 dosent't hurt either.

Just my thoughts on the matter

 

[Da Boss]

Hi - I figured I'd chime in - I haven't played a ton of ACTA yet but am I missing something???

What about the Special Action: intensify defensive fire!? That should take care of the anti-fighter issue (as it doubles it) if you took any anti-fighter; considering the Giam's fighters are hull 3. I know the Centuri have at least one great cheap level one - The Maximus Class Frigate with Antifighter 4, and Escort with a hull 6! All at the Skirmish Level. Take 4 of these and I would think you would be laughing as you walked in, taking out 60% of 32 shots (19 fighters assuming you pass the crew score) as they get within range of the frigate or another ship that is within 8" with a clear line of sight. Let the frigates take care of the fighters. Then you bring your big guns in ASAP with all power to engines!

Did I miss something?

yes and no - intensfy is a special action that requires a CQ check so not auto. Also depends on how many emines go the escorts way. If you keep the escort near the ships to guard them - I made this mistake - you provide mutiple targets for the emine - really bad idea

 

[Greg Smith]

Intensify defensive firepower is useful but a lot of ships have none in the first place and double nothing is still nothing.

 

[Kaizen Zanshin]

Intensify defensive firepower is useful but a lot of ships have none in the first place and double nothing is still nothing.

Your Right, 0 x 2 = 0.

Thats why I mentioned a ship with anti-fighter and escort. If they get close to any ship in the fleet - you pound them as best you can.

I also did some quick calculations - The Gaim will be firing at 40" - The Centurai ships I mentioned earlier using all engines will be able to fire their torpedos on the first turn even if starting at a distance of 40" away.

What would be best to take out first? The Queen - or the Carrier. I assume the carrier if it hasn't got all of its fighters out yet.

 

[Da Boss]

the carrier will have all its fighters out on the first turn I think - half for fleet carrier and scramble scramble unless it rolls a one for the CQ check (CQ 6 , target 7). I can't recall which has better interceptors but IIRC the carrier has hull 4?

remember also that with dynamic squadrons he will be firing either all ships first or after your first ship unless you are squadroned.

re range - depends on the scenario - prob start 30" apart as he will start at back and you at front so yep prob in range more of a problem if playing anhilation, carrier clash etc

 

[katadder]

carrier is the easier hit, also taking this down gets rid of fleet carrier stopping the Gaim regenerating fighters and they lose the +1 dogfight.