Applying Damage

[anselyn]

This may be a dumb question [1] but ....

The Damage para says "Damage is initially applied to a target's END. If a target is reduced to 0 END, then further damage is deducted from the target's STR or DEX (target's choice of which)."

Is that "further" damage the rest of the initial damage. i.e 10 damage from a laser pistol against 7 END: 3 carried on to STR or DEX. Or is that "further" the next 3D of damage from the pistol ?

[1] If this all seems odd, in CT (IIRC) the damage was removed from characteristics in the quanta of how the dice had rolled. So, excess damage from a die didn't carry on to the next characteristic. I wasn't sure if this tradition was quietly being preserved here.

 

[Rikki Tikki Traveller]

This is the same as it was in MGT1.

Damage comes from Endurance first, when Endurance reaches 0 you take the damage to either STR or DEX (player's choice).

So, your example: 10 points of damage with END=7.

END=0 and apply 3 points of damage (AND all further damage) to STR or DEX (player's choice). So, he could select all 3 from STR or DEX or he could mix it and take 2 from STR and 1 from DEX.

When he gets hit again, then he will have to subtract all the damage from STR or DEX (again Player's Choice). The old "by dice" rule doesn't apply and there are no restrictions on how the damage is applied after END=0 except that it is the Player's Choice.

 

[anselyn]

This is the same as it was in MGT1.

Damage comes from Endurance first, when Endurance reaches 0 you take the damage to either STR or DEX (player's choice).

So, your example: 10 points of damage with END=7.

END=0 and apply 3 points of damage (AND all further damage) to STR or DEX (player's choice). So, he could select all 3 from STR or DEX or he could mix it and take 2 from STR and 1 from DEX.

When he gets hit again, then he will have to subtract all the damage from STR or DEX (again Player's Choice). The old "by dice" rule doesn't apply and there are no restrictions on how the damage is applied after END=0 except that it is the Player's Choice.

Thanks, Sir.

 

[-Daniel-]

So, he could select all 3 from STR or DEX or he could mix it and take 2 from STR and 1 from DEX.

Oh wow, we always played it that you had to pick one or the other. Never that you could split it. Probably one of those times someone house ruled something and it becomes the "norm" for the group. :lol:

Learn something new all the time I guess. :mrgreen:

 

[ShawnDriscoll]

Ha! I don't want to go to sleep yet!

 

[Old timer]

Actually in first edition damage came from END first, then the remaining came of either STR or DEX, it was not divided up as the player wants among the two remaining attributes. In this play test edition it says that damage is removed from END first, then the remaining is deducted from targets STR or DEX, targets choice. Page 65 PDF for 1st ed, page 74 beta
This seems to be saying the same as first edition but is a little unclear.

 

[Wizard]

Actually in first edition damage came from END first, then the remaining came of either STR or DEX, it was not divided up as the player wants among the two remaining attributes. In this play test edition it says that damage is removed from END first, then the remaining is deducted from targets STR or DEX, targets choice. Page 65 PDF for 1st ed, page 74 beta
This seems to be saying the same as first edition but is a little unclear.

Agree, in the beta the ", then further damage is deducted from the target’s STR or DEX (target’s choice of which)." does imply it's either STR or DEX not a mix amongst the two.

 

[Stainless]

As described in the beta, it's unclear.

I can't see either approach being a better or worse simulation of reality so there's nothing there to direct what mechanic should be used. Rather, a game-play consideration should be used;

If the residual has to be applied in full from one characteristic (STR or DEX) it will be a more lethal system and combats will be shorter. If the residual can be split between the two characteristics as one wishes, it will be a less lethal system and combats will be longer. Both approaches should be play tested to see what "feels" better. Alternatively, since it's likely to be different strokes for different folks, both systems could be presented as "purist" and "pulp" (or some such) and the gaming table should make a decision on what system they will use.

 

[Rikki Tikki Traveller]

I will concede that I misread the rule when I allowed the damage to split. It should have been applied to EiTHER not mixed/both.

 

[grauenwolf]

Splitting it is a really bad idea from the player's perspective.

If you take damage to two stats, you can still benefit from medical healing. If you damage a third stat, you need to undergo risky surgery or hope that you don't die during natural healing.

 

[First Age]

Although implicit, and perhaps therefore obvious(!), I've often thought it useful to have an explicit statement as to the immediacy of the effect of damage once characteristics are reduced.

Are reduced characteristic modifiers applied immediately when damage is taken? I assume so. It might be worth stating this in the damage section?

 

[Rikki Tikki Traveller]

Yes, they are supposed to be. That is really the big difference between this system and a Hit Point based system. With HP, you aren't reduced in your capability... Traveller has always used Characteristic damage and you should use the new/reduced Characteristic and DM. The rules for healing etc. are pretty good about telling you if you should use your original/full Characteristic score or your current Characterstic Score.

 

[First Age]

Yes, they are supposed to be. That is really the big difference between this system and a Hit Point based system. With HP, you aren't reduced in your capability... Traveller has always used Characteristic damage and you should use the new/reduced Characteristic and DM. The rules for healing etc. are pretty good about telling you if you should use your original/full Characteristic score or your current Characterstic Score.

Yep agreed. Looking at the healing text I still don't think it would hurt to make a statement that once characteristics are reduced that the DM should be immediately revised and based on the lower, damaged characteristic.

 

[-Daniel-]

Looking at the healing text I still don't think it would hurt to make a statement that once characteristics are reduced that the DM should be immediately revised and based on the lower, damaged characteristic.

I agree, it never hurts to have the rules as clear as possible. Leave the things vague that you want vague, but clarify either in the text or with examples.

 

[ShawnDriscoll]

Also, maybe mention something about writing temporary Characteristics and Characteristic Modifiers on the character sheet to reflect changes done to a character from their base values.