Another One Bites the Dust....

[Xelee]

Haha, understanding is not the issue, rules not doing what I and my players want is the issue.

Judging from all that I have read, from the first reviews, through endless forum lurking, I am not the first person whose reaction to the rules (admittedly I am just going from the SRD after reviews put me off) was to massively houserule.....

The outcome has pleased no one, since I know what I want and have been running games for years, it's simpler to just write my own rules. That way my player wont be confused by differences between the SRD and my houserules as there will be just one set of rules.

Still, the fact that I am keen to try out an EC series book is evidence that I have found something to like in MRQ. My favourite RPG Earthdawn is evidence that setting specific rules can make for a fantastic system. So I am keen to see if setting specific MRQ taking into account the (numerous) suggestions for improvements can be equally fantastic.

 

[vitalis6969]

Cool, was just wondering. Yeah, I have houseruled one thing off the top of my head, but I always do that so my players are used to it.. lol...

And I'm geeked about RQM because we have been playing my house rules for like nearly two decades... We want something that has books... hehehehhehe...

Im not a RQM hater because I thought the previous Runequests were silly and had dumb art, so I never got into them to really give them a chance or not. So I am liking RQM because I am coming from a clean slate...

-V

 

[Loz]

Snip

Considering I actually liked your work on the Chaosium Hawkmoon Monograph, I am not belittling the quality of your work.

Well, thank you for that. It's nice feedback.

Can you honestly say that you have condensed a comprehensive list (with stats) of all the animals, demons and copious NPC's of the entire saga, (what appears to be) several entirely new magical systems, an in-depth gazetteer of the entire Young Kingdoms, a list of herbs and potions, the few (but awesomely powerful) magical items, a precis of the storyline, scenario ideas and genre, not to mention maps and (what initially seems decent) artwork into only 100 pages?

And can you say, hand on heart, that you couldn't have filled 50 pages more with useful gaming material, instead of having it used for replicated game mechanics. If the answer is 'No, there was no more to write" then I'll seal my lips, bow and exit stage left.

Don't be ridiculous! I could have written a book twice or three times the size and would have done but for certain, practical, limitations such as time and a production schedule.

Look, a 400 page doorstop, definitive guide to Elric and the YK is all well and good, but there's more to it than just shoe-horning stuff in just because you can. There's work afoot in other RQ areas that isn't complete yet that will make a perfect adjunct to Elric and Hawkmoon. When I planned the book I considered much of what you say, including detailing the Unknown East, including an additional magic system specific to Melnibone and even one for Pan Tang. But you have to have a cut-off point. You really do. I appreciate your concerns, Baron, and (hand on heart, as you like that sort of thing) we discussed them internally at Mongoose.

I doubt I'm going to convince you, so I'm not going to try, but I dop hope that you won't be disappointed with Elric. If I say 'dream thieves' would that help you swallow what obviously seems a bitter pill?

 

[Baron Meliadus]

If I say 'dream thieves' would that help you swallow what obviously seems a bitter pill?

Well, it would certainly help.

Look, the last thing I want is for the EC line to fail. Mongoose has a reputation for supporting its game settings by churning out supplements, and with similar efforts it might actually help genres such as Hawkmoon or Elric finally bloom as they never quite did under Chaosium.

These first books have to sell well so that they gain a player following. What I am fearful of is that when a prospective new player considers purchasing the Hawkmoon (or Elric) book, they'll think that either they're getting ripped off since they already have a third of its content from owning MRQ, or that when looked at closely it only has 100 pages of actual campaign background. Thats pretty thin for a standalone game.

Now if Lankhmar had 160 pages, and Slaine will have 206 pages (and lets face it, Slaine is only a comic strip and has a fraction of the information held in a book series), why on earth were Hawkmoon and Elric designed to have less? 100 pages sans rules is a supplement. You really do need more for an initial campaign setting (industry standard is 200-300). Squeezing in more pages would have helped these genres shine so brilliantly that everyone would be clamoring for a copy.

I really do hope that Hawkmoon and/or Elric knock my socks off. Since if they impress a critic like me then I'm sure they'll sell well... and that's the most important thing.

 

[duncan_disorderly]

You wouldn't believe (or perhaps you would, I don't know) the amount of effort that went into trying to ensure consistency between examples, rules and getting things to reflect the Elric saga. [\quote]

Well, I didn't believe the (apparent) lack of effort that went into doing this in the flagship launch of the core product, so it would be nice to think that some lessons had been leqarned :wink:

Will questions as to the applicability of the rules in the Eternal Champion books to Moorcock's world be answered by saying the rules are Generic and shouldn't be assumed to apply to the world stated in the rules to be the default?

I can't speak for Hawkmoon, but as far as Elric is concerned, I've gone for reflecting the saga, not striving, necessarily, for game balance (although not deliberately setting out to subvert it, either).

This sounds good (My concern was that the core MRQ rulebook says that Glorantha is the assumed default setting, but a number of the rules were actually "Generic" rather than "gloranthan" in their presentation without any indication that this was the case leading to frustration from (a) Glorantha fans who couldn't understand why the rules did not seem to support the "default setting" and (b) Mongoose people who didn't seem to understand why people thought they should! What I wouldn't want is to get a reprint of MRQ core rules in the Eternal Champion books that include rules/references to non-EC work (at least without making it clear this is the case!)

 

[Loz]

Look, the last thing I want is for the EC line to fail. Mongoose has a reputation for supporting its game settings by churning out supplements, and with similar efforts it might actually help genres such as Hawkmoon or Elric finally bloom as they never quite did under Chaosium.

We agree 100% on that score. Let's hope we find more common ground when the book comes out!

 

[Loz]

This sounds good (My concern was that the core MRQ rulebook says that Glorantha is the assumed default setting, but a number of the rules were actually "Generic" rather than "gloranthan" in their presentation without any indication that this was the case leading to frustration from (a) Glorantha fans who couldn't understand why the rules did not seem to support the "default setting" and (b) Mongoose people who didn't seem to understand why people thought they should! What I wouldn't want is to get a reprint of MRQ core rules in the Eternal Champion books that include rules/references to non-EC work (at least without making it clear this is the case!)

Of course. Both Hawkmoon and Elric are tailored to their respective settings. There's obviously stuff that you can easily lift and use elsewhere, but as structured, its written for the distinctive style and tone of the EC cycle, not as a generic set of rules. But the overtly generic stuff, such as the RQ Companion, Monsters, Arms and Equipment and the GMs Guide are/will be 100% compatible.