Ancient Shadow Ship vs Vorlon Heavy Cruiser

[Shadow Queen]

give the shadow fighters a Nuke to carry :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:

 

[Hash]

...you know a lot of these arguments can be settled by quick play tests.

I mean quick because 1 vs. 1 I'd put my money on the Shadow Ship (Ancient) vs. almost ANY other ship in the game....and yet I've seen it defeated and outmaneuvered by several skirmish ships. This is *fleet* game folks and the way to beat a Shadow Armageddon ship is NOT to take your own Armageddon ship but the equivalent points worth of smaller hitters....

That said my Shadow (ancient) is quite happily waiting for challengers to take him on mano-a-mano if you disagree

 

[Tzarevitch]

Sitting in a corner won't work unless the shadow player is an idiot. You'll have a draw because the shadow ship won't approach.

Tzarevitch

 

[Burger]

All that does is remove the Shadow's fighters as being able to do much of anything to the Vorlon. Plus, if the Vorlon receive a No Special Actions crit, it gets repaired in End Phase. Not exactly a game-ender for the Vorlon.

Yes it is: it can't All Stop any more, so it gets out of the corner, so the Shadow Ship gets behind it. It will take another 4-5 turns to get back into the corner. So one NSA crit is game over for the Vorlon.

 

[Methos5000]

All that does is remove the Shadow's fighters as being able to do much of anything to the Vorlon. Plus, if the Vorlon receive a No Special Actions crit, it gets repaired in End Phase. Not exactly a game-ender for the Vorlon.

Yes it is: it can't All Stop any more, so it gets out of the corner, so the Shadow Ship gets behind it. It will take another 4-5 turns to get back into the corner. So one NSA crit is game over for the Vorlon.

A running adrift crit would also have a similar effect.

 

[EDFDarkAngel1]

If I recall correctly, critical effects, including vital systems, are repaired automatically in the End Phase of the turn they were inflicted. Knocking them adrift might get them out of the corner, but that depends on it they repair it before compulsory movement is required.

Dark Angel

 

[Na-Po]

Same as Burger, max one shot for a "smart" Vorlon player .. no more.
Further more it depends on what scenario you're playing, shadows attacking in an ambush scenario and your vorlon is dead vorlon.

And all of this is without debris. Gimme an asteroid field (Lucky shadows)


In open field at 36 you're dead if you're pinned else ...

But I second the idea that it's not made for a 1/1 fight

 

[Na-Po]

If I recall correctly, critical effects, including vital systems, are repaired automatically in the End Phase of the turn they were inflicted. Knocking them adrift might get them out of the corner, but that depends on it they repair it before compulsory movement is required.

Dark Angel

The End Phase of the turn AFTER the one in which they were inflicted

 

[Hash]

If I recall correctly, critical effects, including vital systems, are repaired automatically in the End Phase of the turn they were inflicted.

You recall incorrectly, they are repaired in the End Phase of the turn AFTER they were inflicted, e.g. Take a crit in Turn 2 it gets repaired at the end of Turn 3. Makes a big difference...

EDIT: Doh, my bad Na-Po, you already beat me to the correction!

 

[dag'karlove]

Actually The shadow player has teh very Big advantage in Being able to use His cheesiest rule called HYPERSPACE MASTERY. Wait Till turn 2 Pop Out Behind Teh Vorlon and plast away. The Vorlon Never has a chance as you stay in his rear and blast away The vorlon never being able to return fire.

 

[Burger]

Actually The shadow player has teh very Big advantage in Being able to use His cheesiest rule called HYPERSPACE MASTERY. Wait Till turn 2 Pop Out Behind Teh Vorlon and plast away. The Vorlon Never has a chance as you stay in his rear and blast away The vorlon never being able to return fire.

If the scenario allows, yes. I think we're talking about if the scenario doesn't allow because it is the only case where there would actually be a discussion!!

 

[akenatum]

I don't really see how the vorlons would win this unless they got lucky dice rolls even on an open terrain map, starting at opposite long board edges from each other...

Sheilds are just too mean and it wouldn't take long for the shadow ship to power in (and i don't mean all power to engines) then stick behind the vorlon ship....


The physical disruption only comes in if the sheilds actually get dropped doesn't it? if so doing that many hits before getting damage through would be real tough....

anyway it would be a good fight to watch.

 

[Burger]

The physical disruption only comes in if the sheilds actually get dropped doesn't it? if so doing that many hits before getting damage through would be real tough....

Yes. He'd presumably fire the Discharge Gun first to drop the shields. Then, he'd have to score 10 or more hits (excluding damage from crits - so he could probably do it fairly reliably with 8 or 9 hits) with 6AD of lightning cannon to pin it. A pretty lucky roll, but certainly far from impossible.

 

[EDFDarkAngel1]

It looks like that they both really have one shot at killing one another...

The Shadows need to get behind the Vorlon cruiser to get away from its guns.

The Vorlons need to roll decent on their beams to pin the ship and thus, hose it.

Dark Angel

 

[Burger]

Yes but the Shadows have a much better chance of succeeding than the Vorlons.

 

[EDFDarkAngel1]

We did two fights, testing the Vorlon HC vs the Ancient Shadow Ship.

Game 1 - dachi55 (Vorlon) vs AnbuOnion (Shadows)

Vorlon ship advanced forward, using its beam weapons to kill all but 2 flights of Shadow fighters. Shadow ship does figure 8s in the back. Last 2 fighters die to Vorlon AAF. Shadow ship approached Vorlon HC, Vorlon flubbed badly on the attack and Shadow ship got behind the Vorlon. HC survived to retreat off the board.

Game 2 - dachi55 (Shadows) vs AnbuOnion(Vorlons)

Vorlon holds position until the fighters arrive, and only manages to destroy three the entire 4 rounds of the game. Shadows advance into the Vorlon's arc, but they win initiative. In the one turn of Vorlon combat, Shadows inflict No Damage Control, Engines Adrift, and Catastrophic Ammunitions Explosion before the Vorlons got to fire. Shadows get behind HC to kill it for the win.

Dark Angel