Barbarossa Rotbart
Mongoose
You are very wrong! Elves have balls.Hervé said:
:roll:
I know, the only elves you have met were female...
Alternate Hyborian Age
- Thread starter Barbarossa Rotbart
- Start date
:roll:
I know, the only elves you have met were female...
Style said:
Hah, I'm flattered. Guess I'm required to answer something now.
Well, first things first - I'm a Howard purist, so I'd never pollute the Hyborian Age with standard fantasy creatures. However, if you'd really want to put them in, I think the first question to ask would be "what do they give to the setting"? For example, yuan-ti - why would you want to put them in when you have Valusian snakemen that are far cooler and were clearly the source of inspiration for yuan-ti? Why would you use orcs, when you can use Cimmerians, Nordheimers, Picts or Darfar for the same role as barbaric enemies that only understand the language of violence?
The second question is - are the fantasy races (or rather species) active part of the world, or a hidden, mysterious force behind the scenes? The Hyborian Age has plenty of the latter - mainly as dying remnants of ancient, long-dead ages. In the first case it would be hard to add new species to the political sphere of the Hyborian Age. Especially so as it would require rethinking of certain things. For example, xenophobia - how do the species think about each other and how do the human cultures think about them? How do religions mix in the mess and so forth. If you'd want active fantasy races, the best solution would most likely be to replace certain human cultures with inhuman creatures. For example, the wicked Zamorans could be Dark Elves, Picts could be Wood Elves, Turanians Hobgoblins and so forth, however you want to change and twist them. This would mean less trouble as you could just take the stuff that is said of each realm, but just replace, say, every mention of a "Cimmerian" with "Mountain Orc".
I'd suggest you to take option B - hidden, dying remnants. In this sense, elves and dwarves could be fit in to the game. Just remember that in Howard's writings members of elder races are never goody-good. They are strange, alien and terrible. Even the elephant-thing in the Tower of the Elephant is very strange and alien despite being almost benevolent. Pretty much all other creatures are vile and terrible, portrayed as mortal enemies of humankind. In several Kull stories, Howard writes about "wars of ages past" where humanity exterminated most of the older races with fires and steel. Another variety in the same spirit would be corrupted, disfigured human culture. For example, a small group of people, who through dealing with demons or fiendish science, have become changed to something less (or more?) than human.
For elves, I'd suggest you to take a look at Irish/Celtic legends. Tuatha and Sidhe might have well been the source of inspiration for Tolkien when he was designing elves of the Middle Earth. Masters of illusion and deceit, Tuatha/Sidhe-style elves could be hiding in the moors of Cimmeria, Border Kingdoms and Brythunia.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sidhe#The_s.C3.ADdhe:_abodes_of_the_aes_s.C3.ADdhe
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tuatha_D%C3%A9_Danann
In the case of dwarves, German and Norse legends might be a good source of inspiration. They mention dark, malformed little people that live in the depths of the Earth, requiring gifts from miners or they shall cause great harm to them. They are thought to be masters of metalcrafts and treasures, but shun humans - and they are masters of illusions and deception, like most mythical creatures (explaining why they are so hard to find, hehe). This kind of little people sound like something that could be found from distant mountain ranges. I'd vote for Graaskal Mountains, Eiglophian Mountains or Kezankian Mountains. Goblins and all other little folk of fantasy literature could be easily melded in to dwarves.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dwarf
Majestic7 said:
Knowing that you are such a Howard purist (THE Howard purist really), I knew you wouldn't pollute your world as such, and was just joking. I thought you might give Barbarossa the old one, two! I should have known that you're way too nice of a guy for that, and look, you went and gave great advice after all.
Barbarossa Rotbart
Mongoose
That was just an idea...
Barbarossa Rotbart said:
Nothing is just "an idea". If you like the thought, make it work. Don't care about what some old geezers whine on a forum. As long as all involved in the playing sessions have a good time, it doesn't matter a least bit what others might think. You might even manage to lure some people from D&D and other more generic fantasy setting in to the Hyborian Age this way.
Barbarossa Rotbart
Mongoose
I think it is much better if I stay with the original Hyborian Age, but then I have two problems:
1. One of my players always plays elves or dwarves.
2. I wanted to use Yuan-ti and Illithids as the main antagonists.
1. One of my players always plays elves or dwarves.
2. I wanted to use Yuan-ti and Illithids as the main antagonists.
Barbarossa Rotbart said:
1. Well, roleplaying should be about exploring different characters... Talk him in to playing a Nordheimer or Hyperborean (who act a bit like your standard fantasy dwarves) or Pict / guy from Black Kingdoms for a mystic forest dude.
2. Valusian snakemen fit fine in place of Yuan-ti, though they should never be used as chaff, but rather as mysterious masterminds who manipulate people through their sorcery and shapeshifting abilities. Illithids could be replaced by some Cthulhu-style creatures. Illthids themselves are a clear ripoff from Cthulhu and his Starspawn. Mi-Go use mind control - perhaps they could take the place of Illithids.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mi-go
Of course, if you use Hyborian Age as it is, plenty of themes and things can be done without fantasy races at all. You could easily replace Mindflayers with a cabal of sorcerers, who use Hypnotism and addictive drugs to control people. They could be deranged enough to eat brains! If you want little tentacle action, they can worship Cthulhu and have one of his Starspawns in their cellar.
Barbarossa Rotbart
Mongoose
- There is still one problem: I have no stats for the Valusian Snakemen. 
- Illithids and Mi-Go seem to be nearly the same. Without stats for the Mi-Go, I think I use the good old Illithids.
- I will talk with him, but I think I have the solution to the problem. I will allow him his character. A failed summoning will bring that character from his home world to the Hyborian Age. :twisted:
- Illithids and Mi-Go seem to be nearly the same. Without stats for the Mi-Go, I think I use the good old Illithids.
- I will talk with him, but I think I have the solution to the problem. I will allow him his character. A failed summoning will bring that character from his home world to the Hyborian Age. :twisted:
Clovenhoof
Mongoose
Barbarossa Rotbart said:
I did that once, actually. Not with Conan but with a Homebrew world I cooked up back in school days, and not with a single player but with a whole group. One or two of them were Elves indeed. We started in the world of The Dark Eye, but then I got a bit annoyed at one of my players' "I know the world better than you" attitude (he did) and so I sort of gated them to a different world.
The characters' first problem: language. However, I used a deus ex and supplied them rather quickly with "Speak language" charms so we could concentrate on actual gaming rather than a perpetual charade.
Apart from these charms, the new world was pretty low-magic, so the player characters' magic didn't work half as effective (in TDE, ALL the Elves can cast spells). It took them a while to find out, though.
We played that one just for a few sessions, then the players made new, native characters for this world.
Barbarossa Rotbart
Mongoose
What you are talking about?
*ready to run away*
*ready to run away*
Barbarossa Rotbart
Mongoose
Ouch! that really hurts!
When people think of D&D, they think of a medieval age and a Middle-Earth setting. I hate that! To me the idea that medieval/Tolkienian settings are the "Alpha & Omega" of fantasy is a joke! I find such a setting to be dry and overdone. I think Hyboria is the best example of establishing a setting with its wide diversity with all the historically-based cultures, with a twist of originality. I'm not saying that D&D should be based on the Hyborian Age, but it a good template for homemade worlds.
A bloger, at Grognardia as a lot more to say about it. Grognaria is a good Blog site if you like old-school gaming, and he has a lot of interesting things to say.
A bloger, at Grognardia as a lot more to say about it. Grognaria is a good Blog site if you like old-school gaming, and he has a lot of interesting things to say.
Clovenhoof
Mongoose
Malcadon said:
Middle Earth was as original and unique as Conan when it was devised, or probably even more so. It practically _invented_ Orcs and Goblins, and all other high fantasy games ripped it off. But no two fantasy worlds could be further apart than Middle Earth and a D&D setting like Forgotten Realms (which is btw not a medieval but a renaissance theme).
In D&D, a high-level wizard can teleport around the world, fly like a bird, call down meteor swarms, become living iron and summon clouds of fire and lightning.
In Middle Earth, the most powerful wizard can make fire and talk to birds.
Barbarossa Rotbart
Mongoose
In Middle-earth Orcs and Goblins are one and the same. Orc is just the elvish word for goblin. And Tolkien did not invented them: Goblins were allways part of the folklore. But many copied his version of elves, dwarves and goblins.Clovenhoof said:
Yes. Middle-Earth has a dark age theme, while many D&D worlds have a late mediveal or renaissance theme.Clovenhoof said:
That's not completely right. Magic in Middle-Earth is very different than the magic of D&D or the magic of the Hyborian Age. and we do not know how powerful the Wizards really were, but we know that they did not use their full potential because every one who was able to sense the use of magic would have sensed them. And the magic of Middle-Earth mirrors the "magic" of mediveal times.Clovenhoof said:
For AD&D I had created a world with the technological level and cultures of the bronze age.
that is true and what we think of as orcs are the uruk-hai(mordor had their own ones aswel as the ones saruman made) or fighting orcs which are man sized, braver and stronger than their goblin brethren. and the first orcs were made from tortured elves
On the magic, Gandalf had sworn an oath to not use his powers to directly intervene in the wars between the people of middle earth and mordor, in return he was granted immortality. Also saruman used his sorcery to create legions of uruk-hai so it wasnt all so bad just behind the scenes as it wasnt intended to steal the story from the fellowship and their struggle. read the silmarillion and it will show you some high power magic but it still isnt the fireball and lightning bolt flinging of d&d
Barbarossa Rotbart
Mongoose
That's wrong. All Istari were immortal because they are not humans but Maiar (like Sauron and the Balrog). Gandalf did not use most of his power, because he knew that no good would come out of it.Krushnak said:
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