ACTA RIP....
- Thread starter Wing Commander
- Start date
[Omicron]Urobach
Mongoose
i think...MGP has stopped all their mini production , because:
the entire problems with the quality,stock problems etc...
now they use the time until 2009 to fix all this problems....that is only an hope.
but...hope dies at last,times will see...
the entire problems with the quality,stock problems etc...
now they use the time until 2009 to fix all this problems....that is only an hope.
but...hope dies at last,times will see...
The word on the street is that Mongoose is going to have "a new space combat game in 2009." This would be competition and since Mongoose is selling all their ACTA stuff on ebay now and discounting all the regular stock, laying off those people in design and such, I can't see that ACTA will ever come back from Mongoose.
The people I've talked to think the best chance will be another company to pick it up, like Mongoose did from AOG in the past.
I really don't sense anything besides vague hopeful maybe's from Matt that A Call to Arms will ever recover from this. They've sorted out all the problems finally and permanently.
Like the post says, ACTA RIP
The people I've talked to think the best chance will be another company to pick it up, like Mongoose did from AOG in the past.
I really don't sense anything besides vague hopeful maybe's from Matt that A Call to Arms will ever recover from this. They've sorted out all the problems finally and permanently.
Like the post says, ACTA RIP
I can tell you guys for a fact that Matthew has been putting a lot of work into various projects, and the one you are alluding to was one of them. I wouldn't be writing miniature off completely just yet. Like he said, 'mothballed', not terminated.
While I obviously don't know what the future holds for Mongoose with regards to minis I wouldn't write the company out of the market just yet.
While I obviously don't know what the future holds for Mongoose with regards to minis I wouldn't write the company out of the market just yet.
MustEatBrains
Mongoose
I think there is a difference between Mongoose on the miniatures market in general, and the B5 license specifically. We know that a new miniature game is planned for next year, and we also know that we can expect more CTA support for some time to come. However, with only books (and maybe counters) to earn money from, I´m not sure whether it would make sense for MGP to extend the B5 license another time, at least for the miniatures game (the RPG seems to do well enough; I don´t know however if the a single license covers both genres or not).
Even with a new game in the making, I´m sure there´s a lot of people who will "follow the license" should it ever be taken up by another company. Space combat as such is cool, but with the B5 flavour it´s just that little more interesting.
Even with a new game in the making, I´m sure there´s a lot of people who will "follow the license" should it ever be taken up by another company. Space combat as such is cool, but with the B5 flavour it´s just that little more interesting.
M1ndr1d3rs
Mongoose
Errr... I think he means the base, Frohike :wink:
emperorpenguin
Mongoose
Frohike said:
no just the bases, Frohike
M1ndr1d3rs
Mongoose
emperorpenguin said:
Jinx!
emperorpenguin
Mongoose
M1ndr1d3rs said:emperorpenguin said:
Jinx!
damn my slow typing! :wink:
at least he'll get the point!
Damn.
There's not a lot else I can say; since I'm not a Mongoose employee and have no actual influence aside from either (a) dispatching a team of hardened ninja assassins to murder the staff of Mongoose Publishing in their sleep (which seems a bit of an overreaction) or (b) writing long, rambling diatribes on the forum (which, given some of the crap they let us spout off, are substantially closer to free opinion than another former set of miniature company forums that I could name).
Thoughts in order:
1) Damn (again). I was hoping to go to the Earth-Centauri war event but didn't make it due to my 2nd Ed book getting held up in some sort of stock confusion. In fairness I gather that the root cause of this is mostly due to the LGS in question having a ford mondeo drive through the front window shortly after christmas and the resulting insurance-based financial carnage than anything Swindon-related. However, with economy as the watchword, other events once I finally have the rulebooks and additional (3rd) counter pack may be fewer and further between. Official ones at least.
2) I have to say that I, personally, can manage on counters only. I have no real right to whinge: I must confess I own only 3 mongoose metal miniatures; each bought because it was highly pretty than any serious attempt to collect a fleet. In some ways the massive diversity of ACTA works against it because people want to try all the fleets and never settle long enough to buy a metal fleet...
3) Mongoose was a rulebook and sourcebook company before it was anything else. If they can do that well (and we know at their best they can, even if there have been binding-typo-and-game-balance-related hiccups at some points) then there's no reason why they shouldn't continue to stick around.
4) Matt has said - and I don't see why I shouldn't believe him - that the decision was made under duress to stop the model lines. It has not been done alone, and few companies will make a business decision just to spite their customers. Mongoose is clearly engaged in a major overhaul; losing the Old Bear on Signs and Portents is a major blow to us as well as him. I suggest to readers that he is not a muppet and is just as clearly aware of the effects a hiatus or halt will have on the number of new players as the rest of us.
5) Matt's statement that this is a hiatus - i.e. things will be back sometime next year - gives hope; we'll wait and see. [mild cynicism] It things do go as planned, then the wait for miniatures is still less than some people have had for things that were supposedly in Mongoose's catalogue or 'coming imminently'. [/mild cynicism]
6) Issues of not being able to outsource the miniature production is a major obstacle. However the license is an extent fact, and once again we can't change it by wishing. If people really, really want to buy new miniatures after the deadline, then wir sollten unser Deutsches üben und Urobach besuchen en masse. I suspect this may be a good year for him.
7) I'd once again repeat the recommendation for counters, especially if, later in the year, this looks to become permanent. A new counters .pdf has no net cost to mongoose once created, unlike a mould or physical inventory. Heavy cardstock, or better yet printed foamboard or plasticard, would be superb (an observation of mine. I backed capship counters onto foamboard and their thickness makes them much easier to manipulate as game pieces)
8) The yearly book/campaign supplement debate. I'm definitely going to put a vote for. As to which - I'm always in favour of good themed fleets. As noted, there are a lot to go at, E-Ce war, E-Mi war, E-Di war, E-Dr war (my, my, we are a beligerent lot, aren't we!), Great Shadow war, EA civil war, War of Retribution, Previous Shadow War, etc, etc. Again, a decent review process and some time with a publishing expert could turn a lot of the existing fan supplements into 'official' .pdf versions without much effort.
This is, after all, the source of new rules for all the GW specialist games and seems to work well enough there (and incidentally, for those comparing across, GW has also recently started a rather vicious purge of their miniatures business, eliminating the ability to order individual components and cutting off a lot of the classic models)
9) An updated base fleet book would be nice as well, but frankly there are a minimal number of ships that really need work and everyone knows which ones they are. A .pdf errata to support the .pdf FAQ would work fine and would not take long to do. There have been enough debates on the subjects already; skim off the best suggestions and you'll find a lot of the groundwork has been done.
I like the game, and at the moment there's no reason to insist that it's 'dead' or even necessarily 'dying'. On the other hand, I'm not daft enough to suggest that this is a good thing.
Long term, I don't think we can say anything but "we'll see". So I'll say it.
We'll see.
There's not a lot else I can say; since I'm not a Mongoose employee and have no actual influence aside from either (a) dispatching a team of hardened ninja assassins to murder the staff of Mongoose Publishing in their sleep (which seems a bit of an overreaction) or (b) writing long, rambling diatribes on the forum (which, given some of the crap they let us spout off, are substantially closer to free opinion than another former set of miniature company forums that I could name).
Thoughts in order:
1) Damn (again). I was hoping to go to the Earth-Centauri war event but didn't make it due to my 2nd Ed book getting held up in some sort of stock confusion. In fairness I gather that the root cause of this is mostly due to the LGS in question having a ford mondeo drive through the front window shortly after christmas and the resulting insurance-based financial carnage than anything Swindon-related. However, with economy as the watchword, other events once I finally have the rulebooks and additional (3rd) counter pack may be fewer and further between. Official ones at least.
2) I have to say that I, personally, can manage on counters only. I have no real right to whinge: I must confess I own only 3 mongoose metal miniatures; each bought because it was highly pretty than any serious attempt to collect a fleet. In some ways the massive diversity of ACTA works against it because people want to try all the fleets and never settle long enough to buy a metal fleet...
3) Mongoose was a rulebook and sourcebook company before it was anything else. If they can do that well (and we know at their best they can, even if there have been binding-typo-and-game-balance-related hiccups at some points) then there's no reason why they shouldn't continue to stick around.
4) Matt has said - and I don't see why I shouldn't believe him - that the decision was made under duress to stop the model lines. It has not been done alone, and few companies will make a business decision just to spite their customers. Mongoose is clearly engaged in a major overhaul; losing the Old Bear on Signs and Portents is a major blow to us as well as him. I suggest to readers that he is not a muppet and is just as clearly aware of the effects a hiatus or halt will have on the number of new players as the rest of us.
5) Matt's statement that this is a hiatus - i.e. things will be back sometime next year - gives hope; we'll wait and see. [mild cynicism] It things do go as planned, then the wait for miniatures is still less than some people have had for things that were supposedly in Mongoose's catalogue or 'coming imminently'. [/mild cynicism]
6) Issues of not being able to outsource the miniature production is a major obstacle. However the license is an extent fact, and once again we can't change it by wishing. If people really, really want to buy new miniatures after the deadline, then wir sollten unser Deutsches üben und Urobach besuchen en masse. I suspect this may be a good year for him.
7) I'd once again repeat the recommendation for counters, especially if, later in the year, this looks to become permanent. A new counters .pdf has no net cost to mongoose once created, unlike a mould or physical inventory. Heavy cardstock, or better yet printed foamboard or plasticard, would be superb (an observation of mine. I backed capship counters onto foamboard and their thickness makes them much easier to manipulate as game pieces)
8) The yearly book/campaign supplement debate. I'm definitely going to put a vote for. As to which - I'm always in favour of good themed fleets. As noted, there are a lot to go at, E-Ce war, E-Mi war, E-Di war, E-Dr war (my, my, we are a beligerent lot, aren't we!), Great Shadow war, EA civil war, War of Retribution, Previous Shadow War, etc, etc. Again, a decent review process and some time with a publishing expert could turn a lot of the existing fan supplements into 'official' .pdf versions without much effort.
This is, after all, the source of new rules for all the GW specialist games and seems to work well enough there (and incidentally, for those comparing across, GW has also recently started a rather vicious purge of their miniatures business, eliminating the ability to order individual components and cutting off a lot of the classic models)
9) An updated base fleet book would be nice as well, but frankly there are a minimal number of ships that really need work and everyone knows which ones they are. A .pdf errata to support the .pdf FAQ would work fine and would not take long to do. There have been enough debates on the subjects already; skim off the best suggestions and you'll find a lot of the groundwork has been done.
I like the game, and at the moment there's no reason to insist that it's 'dead' or even necessarily 'dying'. On the other hand, I'm not daft enough to suggest that this is a good thing.
Long term, I don't think we can say anything but "we'll see". So I'll say it.
We'll see.
locarno24 said:
Back toward the end of 2007, I worked several weeks to get minis through my FLGS. When I commented about this here, I was told that it was at the distributors end, not Mongoose's end. When I learned that my FLGS could bypass the Distributors and go directly to Mongoose, we pursued that avenue only to receive silence from Mongoose's e-mail end. In the "State of Mongoose 2008" Mr. Sprange informed us of some serious problems with production (demand well outstripped productive capacity) but the problem had been solved and we were to look forward to great things in 2008. About six weeks later, we were informed that Mongoose would cease manufacturing minis because it could ruin the company.
A similar story governs Starship Troopers. Big effin' plans, then nothing, then an announcement of the games demise.
This pattern of behavior has reduced trust between Mongoose and me. Perhaps the game will come back. I'm not getting my hopes up. I haven't been given any reason to trust Mongoose.
Nightmares about Minbari
Mongoose
The point has already been made a number of times, once at least by me, that what was true at the start of January need not be true in mid Feb. the financial situation of a company can change in an afternoon, let alone six or seven weeks.
All these people who claim that they have lost trust in the company because things have changed between then an now need a reality check.
Mongoose has only survived in the past because it is quick to make changes when they become necessary, and in the current world economic downturn, this talent for survival becomes vital.
So just give the guys here a break, they are after all gamers like us and not a company run by accountants like a certain other company I could mention.
All these people who claim that they have lost trust in the company because things have changed between then an now need a reality check.
Mongoose has only survived in the past because it is quick to make changes when they become necessary, and in the current world economic downturn, this talent for survival becomes vital.
So just give the guys here a break, they are after all gamers like us and not a company run by accountants like a certain other company I could mention.
Timestheus
Mongoose
I could be wrong but it looks to me like simple economics is killing the minis.
From what I have read Mongoose has been producing a rather large number of the minis it sells from molds purchased from AOG. Now these of course have a lifespan.
Seems to me that a rather large number if not all of these are now close to dead and will have to be replaced.
Simple math probably meant that the cost in replacing all of those moulds would exceed what would be made in profit on the minis for a long enough time that it was considered too risky to try.
Unfortunately this would mean that for another company to take over production would require this new company to first acquire the production license then produce a whole new set of moulds to start producing minis. This would be a rather hefty start up cost and probably more than a company would be interested in expending.
From what I have read Mongoose has been producing a rather large number of the minis it sells from molds purchased from AOG. Now these of course have a lifespan.
Seems to me that a rather large number if not all of these are now close to dead and will have to be replaced.
Simple math probably meant that the cost in replacing all of those moulds would exceed what would be made in profit on the minis for a long enough time that it was considered too risky to try.
Unfortunately this would mean that for another company to take over production would require this new company to first acquire the production license then produce a whole new set of moulds to start producing minis. This would be a rather hefty start up cost and probably more than a company would be interested in expending.
Valen is my name
Mongoose
i can understand that the models are going to cost more to make now so why don't Mongoose just raise their prices? They haven't increased their prices (well i can't remember the prices going up anyway.) Surely even just a small price increase (inflation and then a bit more) might make the minis more financially viable? Ok, so people would buy less, but it would be better than not making any minis wouldn't it? Maybe an alternative to metal production could be looked at. Could they not be made from plastic? hell, why not try and make a deal with someone like airfix on the ACTA range?
This is part of the problem, true. That and ever increasing metal costs.
There are also wider issues - the US economy is having a downturn right in the sectors where a lot of gamers traditionally lurk, and that is certainly hitting the market over there. The UK and Europe are much healthier, and have taken up a lot of the slack, but both CTA and SST were always proportionally more popular in the US, and so that had to be taken into account as well.
On the other hand, not all is doom and gloom. The RPG market has accelerated very well in the UK and Europe, and is by far the biggest market for RuneQuest.
There are also wider issues - the US economy is having a downturn right in the sectors where a lot of gamers traditionally lurk, and that is certainly hitting the market over there. The UK and Europe are much healthier, and have taken up a lot of the slack, but both CTA and SST were always proportionally more popular in the US, and so that had to be taken into account as well.
On the other hand, not all is doom and gloom. The RPG market has accelerated very well in the UK and Europe, and is by far the biggest market for RuneQuest.
Valen is my name
Mongoose
this might have already be answered somewhere else but here goes anyway, if no minis are going to be made anymore does that mean no more books etc will be made (ie 2e is the final release?)
Valen is my name said:
We looked at all of these options.
We have recently brought the Dollar prices of CTA miniatures into parity with Sterling, which resulted in an effective price rise for US customers (who always formed our base for CTA and SST). So, a price rise was not an option.
We looked at plastics in the past, but we could never have covered even a tenth of the range that way - the initial set up costs are just too high.
As for Airfix, well, they have had their own problems recently
However, we have certain licence stipulations that we must follow that mean it can be very difficult in farming out production of this nature.
Valen is my name said:
There will indeed - we are still working on Powers & Principalities, and I would very much like to release a Dilgar War book later this year. There is also talk of counter packs. . .
Valen is my name
Mongoose
is it possible that once the economy recovers from the slowdown/crash, whichever it may be, that production could start again, or is ACTA mini production going to end and never be revisited again?
oh and whilst this might sound silly how about 3d paper minis? origami style 'print out and fold' minis. i once made an RAF tornado from paper. (it had print on it and instructions obviously - i'm not that clever)
oh and whilst this might sound silly how about 3d paper minis? origami style 'print out and fold' minis. i once made an RAF tornado from paper. (it had print on it and instructions obviously - i'm not that clever)
