A Melting Pot of Tastes

[Supplement Four]

Has it occurred to all Conan players that the Hyborian Age is a melting pot of fantasy role playing tastes?

Ever noticed how, in most frpgs, there's one taste that is followed, which is usually based on medieval Europe?

Not so, in Conan, for the Hyborian Age consists of many flavors.

Just watched 300, and you want to play a character based on Leonidas? No problem. Roll up a Corinthian Soldier.

Been reading about ancient Rome and want your character to be more like them? No problem. Roll up a Nemedian.

Want to have a medieval Chinese flavor in your game? No problem. Set it in Khitai.

Like Arab desert nomads? Look at the Great Eastern Desert. This game has 'em.

Want to play a Viking type character? Pick a Vanir or Aesir.

Into the ancient Celts? Roll up a Cimmerian.

And on and on.



The different flavors possessed by this universe is a chief factor in its addictiveness.

 

[Azgulor]

Amen, brother! It's one of the things I love about the setting.

 

[Strom]

Howard's world building is second to none. Pure genius. It is worthy of scholarly study even now some 70+ years later. And it is a why I enjoy the age as much as the character Conan.

 

[flatscan]

Heh, I'd posted this:

One of the things I absolutely love about the Conan game is the diversity of locales to adventure in. The melting pot of cultures and environments means the PCs are always encountering something new. They'd gotten bored with the Hyborian kingdoms so we moved the campaign to the Pictish wilderness. From there we'll likely move to the Western Ocean with some pirating adventures. At some point they'll be in Stygia and then the Black Kingdoms. The regional source books that are out for this game provide so much great detail of these exotic locales. One thing that helps me convey just how alien the cultures are to the PCs is music. I start every game session with a recap of what happened before with the opening music of Basil Poulderis' Conan the Barbarian score. The music from both the Age of Conan game as well as the Conan single-player video game and Conan the Dark Axe game have served me well. The Gladiator soundtrack has provided a couple of choice tracks to my game as well as the 300 score (I can forgive electric guitars in the middle of combat Smile ). The God of War scores also work well for setting a mood in the Hyborian Age.

here.

 

[Supplement Four]

Here's a question: How realistic is it that people in the Hyborian Age are so mobile?

I'm not as much a student of this part of history as I should be (maybe one day I'll read more about ancient Europe instead of World War II), so I wonder how cosmopolitan were the major cities in ancient times.

It stands to reason (or does it) that a tribe of Cimmerians may only come into contact with Picts in the west, Aesir/Vanir/Hyperborians in the north, and Gundermen/Bossonians in the south, but mostly just Cimmerians. I could see some Cimmerians coming into contact with only other Cimmerians during their whole lives. Or, maybe Aquilonian borderers, on the west border, only coming into contact with other Aquilonians of the Westermarch and the Picts.

Meaning, because transportation is so rough, most people don't travel that far from their homes.



But, it seems, it is different for the major cities during the Hyborian Age. The stories that Howard wrote are populated with denizens from all over the face of the known world. From Khitai to the Picticsh Wilderness, and from the Black Kingdoms to Asgard, the citizens of the Hyborian Age seem to travel a lot.

My question, then, is how likely is this given real world historical precedent?

I mean, I know Rome was a fairly cosmopolitan place, but that's because the Romans, themselves, would bring home their conquered slaves rather than some notion that foreigners were flocking to Rome all the time.

How likely is it that the major trade cities of the Hyborian Age see such a traveling populace?

 

[Mongoose Gar]

Howard was a first-rate teller of tales, with a remarkable technical command of his tools and with a complete lack of inhibitions. With a fine and free hand he took what he liked from the more spectacular aspects of all ages and climes: proper names of every conceivable linguistic derivation, weapons from everywhere and everywhen, customs and classes from the whole ancient and medieval world . . . and the result was a purple and golden and crimson universe where anything can happen -- except the tedious.

- Dr. John D. Clark

This essay here is worth reading; I found it when searching for the above quote. (Well, actually I was looking for Moorcock's 'Conan's trapped in a movie library of old clips' dig, but anyway...

 

[Krushnak]

the citizens of the Hyborian Age seem to travel a lot.

Not really, atleast no more than in the real world its just the mercenaires, thieves and merchants who travel all over the place. It just so happens that Conan is usually hanging around with the other mercenaries and thieves so we seem alot of varied races in different locals. Also places like Zamora and Argos are the cross roads of the world where all sorts of merchants travel through. Not to mention that Turan has slaves brought in from the far reaches of its empire making it's cities look like ancient rome.

 

[PrinceYyrkoon]

Has it occurred to all Conan players that the Hyborian Age is a melting pot of fantasy role playing tastes?

Ever noticed how, in most frpgs, there's one taste that is followed, which is usually based on medieval Europe?

Not so, in Conan, for the Hyborian Age consists of many flavors.

Just watched 300, and you want to play a character based on Leonidas? No problem. Roll up a Corinthian Soldier.

Been reading about ancient Rome and want your character to be more like them? No problem. Roll up a Nemedian.

Want to have a medieval Chinese flavor in your game? No problem. Set it in Khitai.

Like Arab desert nomads? Look at the Great Eastern Desert. This game has 'em.

Want to play a Viking type character? Pick a Vanir or Aesir.

Into the ancient Celts? Roll up a Cimmerian.

And on and on.



The different flavors possessed by this universe is a chief factor in its addictiveness.

Well, of course, the Hyborian Age is the prehistory of our Earth. Why wouldnt it have direct parallels?

 

[Supplement Four]

Well, of course, the Hyborian Age is the prehistory of our Earth. Why wouldnt it have direct parallels?

You're kinda missing the point, Prince.

And that point is: Howard could have made the pre-history of our Earth with one, maybe two, cultural touches, like we see in a lot of fantasy literature.

Check out Lord of the Rings. It all smacks of a shared, medieval European history. One doesn't open LotR and see cultures with ancient Chinese or Arab desert raider or Greek or Roman flavors. One just sees the one flavor.

Not so with Howard's universe.

It's diverse.

The Riders of Rohan don't look that much different than the soldiers of Gondor.

But, during the Hyborian Age, you can certainly tell the difference, just by sight, between the Kozaki desert raiders and the Black Dragons of Aquilonia.

 

[PrinceYyrkoon]

Well, of course, the Hyborian Age is the prehistory of our Earth. Why wouldnt it have direct parallels?

You're kinda missing the point, Prince.

And that point is: Howard could have made the pre-history of our Earth with one, maybe two, cultural touches, like we see in a lot of fantasy literature.

Check out Lord of the Rings. It all smacks of a shared, medieval European history. One doesn't open LotR and see cultures with ancient Chinese or Arab desert raider or Greek or Roman flavors. One just sees the one flavor.

Not so with Howard's universe.

It's diverse.

The Riders of Rohan don't look that much different than the soldiers of Gondor.

But, during the Hyborian Age, you can certainly tell the difference, just by sight, between the Kozaki desert raiders and the Black Dragons of Aquilonia.

Quite a few fantasy worlds have a number of parallels. Forgotten Realms, for instance. And, sorry, but I have to say Glorantha, (sorry, dont mean to kick off an argument!). Theres Gygax's Oerth, as well as his Mythus version Aerth. And then theres Bard Games' Atlantis. And Hawkmoons Tragic Europe. Actually, its a real effort to get away from those Earth parallels when youre creating a fantasy world.

 

[warzen]

Has it occurred to all Conan players that the Hyborian Age is a melting pot of fantasy role playing tastes?

Not really: no trolls, no elves, no goblins, no breath firing dragons....etc

The Hyborian Age is, by design, a melting pot of past Earth civilizations so more in line of an "historical roleplaying taste".

W.

 

[PrinceYyrkoon]

Oh, and the saga of the Lord of the Rings takes place in the 'European' potion of the continent. It is supposed to be a story of prehistory too, and if youve ever seen ICEs Middle earth supplements, you will find a huge continent of cultures analogous to Earths.

 

[Supplement Four]

Not really: no trolls, no elves, no goblins, no breath firing dragons....etc

Thank the gods it is so!

 

[warzen]

Not really: no trolls, no elves, no goblins, no breath firing dragons....etc

Thank the gods it is so!

I completly agree !!

W.

 

[Vortigern]

Here's a question: How realistic is it that people in the Hyborian Age are so mobile?

-- snip --

My question, then, is how likely is this given real world historical precedent?

I mean, I know Rome was a fairly cosmopolitan place, but that's because the Romans, themselves, would bring home their conquered slaves rather than some notion that foreigners were flocking to Rome all the time.

How likely is it that the major trade cities of the Hyborian Age see such a traveling populace?

IMO, fairly accurate. Rome for example is known to have had an extensive trade in goods with India, in it's day. There have been artifacts at least indicating 'trade', if not an actual physical presence, between very distant places at seemingly rather ancient times in history.

I am of the opinion that we like to think very highly of ourselves as 'modern' people, and a tendency to 'vastly' underestimate ancient peoples.

I've read some opinions estimating the Roman logistical ability was roughly equivalent to that of 1700s era Europe. This speaks volumes about the degree of typical underestimation and, relevant to the Hyborian Age and REH's theme of cyclic rising and falling societies, the ammount of damage that can occur when something like Rome falls.

Anyway, I digress.

If we can find scandinavian artifacts indicating trade everywhere from ancient britain to various locales in the med., and Rome can trade with such a place and India... I think the degree of mixing ( purely in the cosmopolitan areas, such as Messantia ) described is actually 'more' accurate than the opposite.

 

[Bygoneyrs]

Well I do use other crafted monster races, but they are selected and and tailored. There are not alot of anything, but they are there.

Penn

 

[LucaCherstich]

I mean, I know Rome was a fairly cosmopolitan place, but that's because the Romans, themselves, would bring home their conquered slaves rather than some notion that foreigners were flocking to Rome all the time.

I know this is a bit "out of topic" but I feel your opinion of Rome is a bit a 19th century one.
Rome of the Imperial Period (1st century BC - Late Antiquity) really was a melting pot actracting people from all over the Empire (and from beyond).
Rome was a key place for trade, culture and power and people were coming there from everywhere.
Slaves from everywhere were flocking there but also a LOT of freemen.
The discourse is complicated but with the label "Roman citizens" we define many kinds of individuals coming from different provinces and, quite often, speaking many different languages (with an at least vague knowledge of Latin or Greek).
In the 2nd century AD the great part of the senate was made by People born in the provinces.
If we consider the Non-citizens freemen the percentual of strangers was defintefly greater.
Rome was an actracting site for Traders, Mercenaries and Rogues from everywhere.
One could meet Parthian ambassadors and Germanic hostages in the city centre, together with Illiryan mercenaries and Jewish traders.
If you check the "Monte Testaccio" in Rome you will find bits of amphorae coming from everywhere in the empire.
Archeological and literary sources attest that Rome had temples and sanctuaries for any kind of odd divinity.
It defintevely was a melting pot where the visitors were negotiating their own identity with what is usually called "Roman identity" and each of them was a different individual with his own culture.

REH never had the opportunity of picturing anything as complex as Rome....but the fact that he puts different peoples in the Aquilonian Empire (Gundermen, Tauran, Bossonians, Poitanians, etc..) attests that he felt the "Roman model" somehow.

Another discourse is the frequence of many melting pots in the Hyborian Age.
The first chapter on "The Tower of teh Elephant" describes a Zamorian city filled with strangers...and this is because REH had in mind the "desert trade - cities" in Syria and Iran.

I feel that REH had many models of multicultural sites for his Hyborian Age.

 

[David St-Michel]

I have a question.

Is there anyone who has a list of "which hyborian country represents which country/era of our time?"

I have :

Aquilonia - medieval france
Nemedia - ancient roman empire?
Corinthia - greece in its antiquity?
Pictland - the wild west
Vanaheim/Asgard - vikings, without the drakkars
Stygia - mystical egypt
Vendhya - mystical india
Khitai - ancient china?
Hyrkania/Turan - the mongolians/huns under their great leaders?

If anyone can help me fill this list out, I'd really appreciate it.

 

[flatscan]

I have a question.

Is there anyone who has a list of "which hyborian country represents which country/era of our time?"

Yup, wikipedia has a table of correspondence under Etymology.

 

[Spongly]

The Hyborian Age is basically a world set in a backlot of a Cecil B De Mille historical epic - anything and anyone could turn up: 18th century style pirates, biblical era soldiers, vikings and knights.