Wraith Recon - Great Work Pete!

[Radioactive Ape Colin]

Grabbed Wraith Recon and suitably impressed; absolutely chock full to bursting with material (seriously, tiny margins, small font, masses of text crammed in) and every bit as good as the excellent work you produced in Vikings, Pete. A big thumbs up from me!

cheers!
Colin

 

[Dan True]

Is it worth buying Wraith Recon and Spellcom even if you're not going to use Wraith Recon as a setting?

- Dan

 

[Mongoose Pete]

Grabbed Wraith Recon and suitably impressed; absolutely chock full to bursting with material (seriously, tiny margins, small font, masses of text crammed in) and every bit as good as the excellent work you produced in Vikings, Pete. A big thumbs up from me!

Um thanks Colin. I haven't received my own copy yet so I don't know what it looks like in the flesh. Bare in mind however that its a reworking of Bryan's original 4th Ed D&D version blended with some of the Slayer's guides - then cooked at 200 degrees for 2 months in the grim, foetid depths of my imagination. I merely revised and twisted the embryonic material, resulting in a darker, more morally ambiguous campaign world.

Essentially I've taken the bare-bones setting, RQ'd it and added a swathe of mods to show what the rules can do to support a different style of high fantasy than Glorantha.

Is it worth buying Wraith Recon and Spellcom even if you're not going to use Wraith Recon as a setting?

SpellCom, amongst other things, offers further enhancements to magic, such as the creation and lists of Enchanted Items and coordinated casting of magic by multiple casters. However 'Blood Magic' will also include these extra skills (as part of greatly expanding the flexibility and flavour of RQ magic) for those who aren't specifically interested in the Wraith Recon setting. :wink:

 

[Mongoose Pete]

Oh I forgot to mention. As usual, if anyone has questions about the modified or alternate rules used in Wraith Recon, feel free to post them and I'll eventually get round to answering. Just make sure that the thread clearly indicates Wraith Recon so that other folks using this board don't get confused. :wink:

 

[PhilHibbs]

SpellCom, amongst other things, offers further enhancements to magic, such as ... coordinated casting of magic by multiple casters.

Ah, that's a gap that I've tried to plug. I'm interested to know how that works, what's the basic mechanic? Is SpellCom a completely new magic system, or a sorcery variant?

 

[Dan True]

Is it worth buying Wraith Recon and Spellcom even if you're not going to use Wraith Recon as a setting?

SpellCom, amongst other things, offers further enhancements to magic, such as the creation and lists of Enchanted Items and coordinated casting of magic by multiple casters. However 'Blood Magic' will also include these extra skills (as part of greatly expanding the flexibility and flavour of RQ magic) for those who aren't specifically interested in the Wraith Recon setting. :wink:

Great I'll get it as soon as it's available in Dk then

- Dan

 

[Radioactive Ape Colin]

Um thanks Colin. I haven't received my own copy yet so I don't know what it looks like in the flesh. Bare in mind however that its a reworking of Bryan's original 4th Ed D&D version blended with some of the Slayer's guides - then cooked at 200 degrees for 2 months in the grim, foetid depths of my imagination. I merely revised and twisted the embryonic material, resulting in a darker, more morally ambiguous campaign world.

And that revision shows clearly and is much appreciated. I like the fact that it's a clearly High Fantasy setting, very vanilla in most regards, but with a healthy seasoning of ambigious, gritty, and dark. On RPG.net there's a HUGE thread about running fantasy as "Subterranean Fantasy ****ing Vietnam", and with Wraith Recon you could very much do that.

Essentially I've taken the bare-bones setting, RQ'd it and added a swathe of mods to show what the rules can do to support a different style of high fantasy than Glorantha.

Indeed. As a big plus, it's exactly the sort of setting and basic rules support that those of us wanting non-Gloranthan fantasy would like to see. If anything, we want even more; I know I do. WR shows that Mongoose can create a High Fantasy setting that is at once both D&D-esque and very, very RQ. Two great tastes blended beautifully together. I sincerely hope the line expands, as there's a lot of scope in it, both in terms of running Wraith Recon teams, and as a general fantasy setting on its own merits.

I for one, look forward to seeing the likes of Bugbears statted, not to mention cultural and cult writeups for the Dark Elves, Ogres, Scorpion God, and the Oanni trinity.

cheers!
Colin

 

[Radioactive Ape Colin]

Actually Pete, one question just came to mind. It's fairly obvious what nearly all of the briefly statted races are (Pahhur Dwarfs are renamed non-burning Azer, Cynocephales are Gnolls, and Troglodytes, Crocodilians, Serpentmen, etc. are all self-explanatory). However, I'm not entirely sure what the Saurians are supposed to be/be like given that Lizardmen, Trogs, Crocodilians, and Serpentmen are different races. My guess given their low strength and high dex is that they're essentially Kobolds. Is that correct?

Colin

 

[Mongoose Pete]

However, I'm not entirely sure what the Saurians are supposed to be/be like given that Lizardmen, Trogs, Crocodilians, and Serpentmen are different races. My guess given their low strength and high dex is that they're essentially Kobolds. Is that correct?

Pretty much yes. I put them in as a replacement for the Dragonborn.

 

[Radioactive Ape Colin]

Excellent, thanks; I've always enjoyed Kobolds.

So, given that the various racial writeups are apparently copied and tweaked from the various Slayers Guides, does Mongoose have any plans to support WR by putting some extra racial articles in S&P? It seems that it'd be a relatively quick and straightforward thing to do to support the setting (essentially cut-n-paste from the relevant Slayers Guide as needed, make a few tweaks, add MRQ2 stats). Given that there were Slayers Guides for Bugbears, Kobolds (aka Saurians), Ogres, Orcs, Troglodytes, Serpentmen (aka Yuan-ti), and Gnolls (aka Cynocephales), that's a good number of potential articles. Plus, wasn't there some kind of Mongoose guide to Drow or something that could probably be mined easily for an article on the Dark Elves? Such articles would also help support the idea that MRQ2 can be used for more familiar, non-Glorantha settings too.

cheers!
Colin

 

[Mongoose Pete]

Ah, that's a gap that I've tried to plug. I'm interested to know how that works, what's the basic mechanic? Is SpellCom a completely new magic system, or a sorcery variant?

The SpellCom supplement focusses on a High Fantasy version of military intelligence, one which primarily uses Sorcery for reconnaissance, espionage, and battlefield ordnance. It contains personnel, organisation and infrastructure for sandbox play as well as new spells, magic skills and grimoires.

The concert casting skill is designed to be flexible, and can be applied to Divine, Sorcery or Spirit Magic. It basically allows a group of two or more casters to pool their magical skills (capped by the concert skill) together in order to create an spell or binding of greatly augmented effect. Casting chances and resistance are based upon the skill of the gestalt's coordinator. The specific rules cover several pages, so you should buy SpellCom or Blood Magic if you want more details. :wink:

 

[Radioactive Ape Colin]

Quick question/possible errata:

By the rules, Hobgoblins are SIZ 2D6+9, bigger than Ogres and Orcs which are both SIZ 2D6+6. It seems odd that Hobgoblins are on average larger than ogres given that the latter are known for being hulking brutes. As the main races all have 90 attribute points or just under as an average, and the Hobgoblin has 93, should their SIZ have been 2D6+6 instead, and should the Ogre's SIZ have been 2D6+12 (to match its STR and make it larger than hobgobs and orcs)?

cheers!
Colin

 

[PhilHibbs]

The concert casting skill is designed to be flexible, and can be applied to Divine, Sorcery or Spirit Magic... The specific rules cover several pages, so you should buy SpellCom or Blood Magic if you want more details. :wink:

That's all I was after, "is it a new skill, a new spell, a new Manipulation, or something else" thanks!

 

[Mongoose Pete]

As the main races all have 90 attribute points or just under as an average, and the Hobgoblin has 93, should their SIZ have been 2D6+6 instead, and should the Ogre's SIZ have been 2D6+12 (to match its STR and make it larger than hobgobs and orcs)?

My mistake, yes they should have a SIZ of 2d6+12, between hobgobs and fire giants. Sorry about that.

 

[Radioactive Ape Colin]

As the main races all have 90 attribute points or just under as an average, and the Hobgoblin has 93, should their SIZ have been 2D6+6 instead, and should the Ogre's SIZ have been 2D6+12 (to match its STR and make it larger than hobgobs and orcs)?

My mistake, yes they should have a SIZ of 2d6+12, between hobgobs and fire giants. Sorry about that.

No worries, mate, there hasn't been an rpg supplement produced that was errata free, and if two small adjustments to SIZ are the extent of the errata thus far, I wouldn't be concerned.

Colin

 

[Radioactive Ape Colin]

Current Errata

Page 35, Ogre: SIZ should be 2D6+12.

Page 112, Field Plate Armour: Armour Penalty should be -12.

Page 169, Seven Marines: Strike Rank should be +10 (after adjustment for armour).

Page 171, Ballista Crews: All should have Armour: 1AP Hairy Skin. All Hit Location entries for AP should be 1.

Page 173, Wraith 4 - Hardnut Hobgoblin: Armour should be 1AP Hairy Skin. All Hit Location entries for AP should be 1.

cheers!
Colin

 

[Mongoose Pete]

Page 16, Hobgoblin: SIZ should be 2D6+6, Average 13. Damage Modifier should be +1D2.

Sorry Colin I wasn't clear enough when replying to your previous question. Hobgobs should indeed be 2D6+9, its not a mistake. Only Ogres were wrong and should have been 2D6+12. I.e. Hobgobs (Av SIZ 16) < Ogres (Av SIZ 19) < Fire Giants (Av SIZ 23).

Thus the Ballista Crews on p171 have the correct Damage Modifier (assuming average specimens).

Interestingly, a piece of common errata (the Strike Rank for the typical hobgoblin should've been +14 throughout using the original SIZ, when it's listed as +13) is now actually correct using the errata'd SIZ.

Actually the SR calculation in the Core Rulebook is wrong. It should be (INT+DEX)/2 as mentioned in its errata. This means the SR for the Marines on p169 is technically correct too, again assuming they have average characteristics.

However you have me bang to rights with the Hardnut Hobgoblin whose natural armour I forgot. Bugger! Apologies again. I can only plead chronic lack of sleep and that considering the weapons the PCs should have, it won't make the slightest bit of difference to poor old Hardnut... :wink:

By the way, I received my author's copy yesterday and I find the book well laid out and consistently illustrated. Much better than I had hoped.

 

[Radioactive Ape Colin]

Made changes above, thanks, but...

Actually the SR calculation in the Core Rulebook is wrong. It should be (INT+DEX)/2 as mentioned in its errata. This means the SR for the Marines on p169 is technically correct too, again assuming they have average characteristics.

+15 is indeed average for a Lizardman without armour beyond what they naturally have, but as they're wearing Wood Slat armour (for an extra 3AP on every location), shouldn't that reduce their Strike Rank by 5 to the +10 I noted (total extra 24 APs/5, rounded up = a -5 SR penalty)?

Edit: Ah! I think I understand the confusion! Originally, I wrote "+10 (adjusted for armour)" and I'm guessing you thought I meant they had a base SR of +10 (which should be adjusted even lower for armour). What I meant was that the +10 was actually the SR *after* the adjustment for armour had been made, i.e. it had been adjusted for their armour.

cheers!
Colin

 

[Mongoose Pete]

+10 (after adjustment for armour)

Ah, I understand now!

 

[Antalon]

Another rules query:

Page 112 - where the Dardarrian armour is listed: I don't understand how the Armour Penalty calculations are worked out (or how they'd be used). They do not seem to meet the APxHitlocations / 5 formula?

BTW - the scenario is great, but begs the questions: original version or Redux, which is best?

Antalon.